CTE/ PRO ONE with Stan Shuffett

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Aim and Pivot

One of the primary problems with the controversy and misunderstanding(s) is the naming of the process. Forget CTE and think AIM AND PIVOT.

I understand your problem with the offset distances and am still trying to work this out myself.

I also think there are a lot of other methods that support good shot making and pocketing of balls. I have tinkered with edge of the cue aiming combined with offsets and, like everyone else, am always looking for a better method. Aim and Pivot is not a miracle, it's just based on solid geometric proof; however, it is also subject to human failings, especially when carried out by average schleps like me.
 
Last night I spoke to Hal Houle, the originator of CTE and he was in good spirits. We talked in length about many things. Hal's sense of humor was intact and he teased me about walking through water to get to my fishing boat. He remembered my stories about my fishing camp and how, prior to Hurricane Katrina, we would have to walk through ankle high water at high tide to get to my boat so that we could go fish. :grin:

His health is about the same. He walks only very short distances with the aid of a walker but seems to be in good spirits.

He still has visitors who come to see him, his pool room and to hear about CTE. He teased me that there are no round barns to shoot rifles at the edge of the barn where I am from.

I called to wish he and "Sunny" a Happy Thanksgiving and to thank Hal for creating CTE and to let him know that Landon Shuffett is carrying the CTE torch and he talked for nearly 15 minutes about how easy Landon picked up CTE. He seemed proud of the fact that someone as young as Landon could "get it" so easily.

I'm sure that Stan's CTE/Pro One video will answer lots of questions and further define and refine CTE but it will also invite more questions.

Myself, I am quite curious as to what the future holds for CTE/Pro One.

There are a few things that I have noticed about my using CTE/Pro One that I thought I would share:
1. I seem better able to focus because of the method in which you use CTE/Pro One.
2. It seems that I am playing more pool and concentrating better.
3. It seems that I am making shots that I normally miss.
4. It seems that I am making more bank shots than ever before.
5. It seems that in general I am paying more attention to the shot than ever before.

The true test of gambling with CTE is yet to come. I don't get much action these days, not because I am all that good because I'm not but because there isn't that much action going on these days. There are a few people who gamble but I choose to avoid for various personal reasons so that limits the number of potential players to test my CTE/Pro One against.

I have one GOOD potential top player who promises to beat me "like a rented mule". (thanks Bob) When he gets in stroke, we'll see who gets the beating.

This journey is far from over and I don't know where CTE/Pro One will lead me but so far it doesn't appear to have hurt my game as others predicted it might.

I want to try out some gambling with banking using CTE as well but may have to travel to Banger's Paradise to get that action. :smile:

Happy Thanksgiving to all!
 
Thanks, Joey for the news. I'm impressed with your progress and hope it continues to go well for you. Your positive approach will keep your game sharper and help you to improve at a faster rate.

The increased ball pocketing was interesting to me, also. The tougher, low percentage shots start to drop and your confidence level goes up accordingly. But the biggest noticeable gain is in your banking. Once you zero in on the system you start running banks instead of one or two at a time. I used to use the diamonds, mirror images and feel to make my banks, but now I pivot. I feel I've picked up on my bank game at least a ball on a short rack. I wish I lived closer. I'd give you some comp in a bank game. :smile:

Glad to hear Hal is in good spirits. I hope Stan's dvd warms his heart.

Don't gobble up too much turkey!

Best,
Mike
 
Mikjary said:
Thanks, Joey for the news. I'm impressed with your progress and hope it continues to go well for you. Your positive approach will keep your game sharper and help you to improve at a faster rate.

The increased ball pocketing was interesting to me, also. The tougher, low percentage shots start to drop and your confidence level goes up accordingly. But the biggest noticeable gain is in your banking. Once you zero in on the system you start running banks instead of one or two at a time. I used to use the diamonds, mirror images and feel to make my banks, but now I pivot. I feel I've picked up on my bank game at least a ball on a short rack. I wish I lived closer. I'd give you some comp in a bank game. :smile:

Glad to hear Hal is in good spirits. I hope Stan's dvd warms his heart.

Don't gobble up too much turkey!

Best,
Mike
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I wish you were closer too, Mike. It is nice to see that there are other people who have taken the lesson from Stan and that they have benefited from his tutelage.

The bank improvements are really incredible. One day I will discuss the nuances of banking with CTE but I want to beat up on some people first. :grin:

JoeyA, getting ready to go beat up on a Turkey.
 
JoeyA said:
The bank improvements are really incredible. One day I will discuss the nuances of banking with CTE
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Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
 
richard s said:
....I understand your problem with the offset distances and am still trying to work this out myself....

...Aim and Pivot is not a miracle, it's just based on solid geometric proof; ...
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Richard, there seems to be an inconsistency between these two statements. Have you a proof or not?

If you continue to work on it, I believe you'll find that if you fix your offset when using offset-and-pivot for different cut angles and CB-OB separations, you'll need a continuously variable pivot location. If you fix your pivot location, you'll need a continuously variable offset. The interplay between these two simply reflects the continuously variable nature of the ghostball angle. You can't freeze both entities at some fixed value simultaneously.

richard s said:
Here's an idea, since the magic occurs in the ghost ball, we can call this a spiritual method - transcendental aiming.
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If you don't already know it, you might be happy to learn that the ghostball fractional offset is given by 2Rsin(C), and sin(C) is in fact called a "transcendental" function by mathematicians. So while I'm not too sure about the spiritual part, the transcendental part is right on! :)

Jim
 
dr_dave said:
Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
Click to expand...

C'mon Dave... even your Turkey today knows the answer of that post. CTE can definitely be used as a BASELINE for banking balls. Speed, spin and angle effects all need to be accounted for.... no different than any other banking method. You definitely don't need diamonds, etc; you can merely just pivot the ball in with fewer worries... but worries you always have when banking.

Gee whiz... can Joey make a post one time saying CTE improved his banking without a turkey-post like the one above? If CTE "helps" an aspect of one's game --- can someone report on that? That "aight" with you?

I use CTE for every bank (or 90/90-- same thing). It's the best way to bank (for me).

I have a question, Dr. Dave--- how well do you bank? Can you describe your thought process when lining up a bank (a bank that isn't a center-to-center natural angle)?

Dave
 
dr_dave said:
Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
Click to expand...

Joey might be eating about now, so I'll say something. Yes, Dave, it works on banks too. Instead of CTE, I just change to CTC and then pivot. Add a touch of outside english to negate spin off the rail, use a firm stroke, and wha-la. Of course, speed makes a difference on any bank, there's no changing that.
 
Spidey:
If CTE "helps" an aspect of one's game --- can someone report on that? That "aight" with you?
Click to expand...
Can someone ask questions about it? Is that OK with you? Or are all posts about CTE untouchable?

Grow some skin. And some sense.

pj
chgo
 
dr_dave said:
Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
Click to expand...

Dave,

Just so you and the rest of the people understand. This thread is about MY experience with CTE/Pro One and Stan Shuffett.

As I recall, the video did not have much to do with banking although I was very tired after a long day of playing pool and learning CTE.

Just so you and the rest of the people who think I have set the bar too high for Stan's video: Just sit on the sidelines and wait for other people to review the video. You don't have to buy the video. You shouldn't buy the video based upon my experiences. I am already a fairly good player and I can play with just about any aiming system and practically any cue, at least at a fairly comparable level to what I am used to.

This is a journey for me. It's been fun, learning CTE and like anything else, it requires additional skills which if you don't have, you won't have the same results as I or anyone else has with similar skills.

I actually believe that I could show similar skilled players CTE/Pro One and they would have similar results, IF THEY ARE OPEN MINDED, and have a desire to learn it.

The basics of CTE is relatively simple. The actual PRECISE EXECUTION of CTE/Pro One is another story. As I mentioned, I had trouble with a few shots and if Stan had not been right there, instructing me along the way, I would have had doubts about whether it was working for me. His confirmation and encouragment to see what he saw allowed me to be more precise with my aiming and when I was more precise with my aiming, the balls fell far more frequently.

As to banks, I'm not too sure if they were even in the video and we didn't cover a whole lot of that in the lesson but I like one pocket a lot and have kind of danced around with banks, especially after watching some of the great bank players at the Derby city Classic. So I started using CTE,Pro One with banking ON MY OWN and what I can and will say is that I was able to make some very nice bank shots.

Dave,
I am a very optimistic guy and I see the bright side of most things. You and "others" will take up the slack and point out the negatives quite soon enough.

You have to remember that I received one-on-one lesson on CTE Pro One from Stan and only watched the video only after I was exhausted from a long day of work on the table.

I doubt that most people will get out of the video what I got out of the lesson but some who apply themselves will be able to achieve some very positive results.

Besides each video that is purchased will allow each person to experience for themselves and then they will be able to discuss CTE/Pro ONe with others to see if they are achieving the same results.

IF I COULD GUARANTEE THAT I AM PLAYING BETTER THAN I WAS BEFORE TAKING THE LESSON, I WOULD ALREADY BE GAMBLING MY ARSE OFF WITH PEOPLE WHOM I HAD BROKEN EVEN WITH BEFORE OR LOST TO.

I am learning CTE/Pro One and I play with it EVERY DAY, at least a few hours per day. Some of my self-perceived increase level of play may only come from the increased focus, which may or may not be a result of learning something and God forbid if CTE/Pro One actually improves my game for sure. You will hear me howling from the rooftops. :grin:

After playing with CTE and becoming familiar with this unique aiming system, I start moving into something that is more instinctive and more natural and that's called Pro One. Pro One is probably the way Lou shoots pool based upon what he has described on the forum, except that he doesn't have the experience with CTE and he doesn't pivot but he winds up in the same place as proficient CTEers.

Look, I'm having fun with CTE/Pro One and I can't wait to test out my gambling skills using CTE/Pro One. If you want to send a few C notes to my paypal account I will put the dough in action right away. For my dough, I'll bide my time but will put yours in action immediately if you want me to confirm postively if CTE/Pro One has helped my game.

One thing I can tell you for SURE, is that I do not aim contact point to contact point, no ghost ball, no overlap; not one single shot.

Every now and then I will go over and look at the contact point and the path of the object ball before shooting the shot, but when I aim, I do not aim contact point to contact point.

I have recently played another [/B ]good player even and 8-7 one pocket for a couple of years now and more recently two days ago) he asked me to give him 9-7 for cheap money (ten dollars a game) and I reluctantly did, I managed to come out a couple of games ahead but that's all. For me just learning this, I feel like it is going well.

I guess it would have been nice to have some FARGO figures or some other comparison but I didn't bother with that so I guess everything for now is just subjective thinking.

If you think I am suggesting that other people are going to improve their game by a significant margin by using CTE, you are wrong. It will depend upon the player and the effort that they put into CTE/Pro One. I've probably played over 60 hours using CTE/Pro One and I'm still scared to gamble my dough because I want to be CERTAIN that what I think I know, will hold up under that type of pressure.

JoeyA
 
pivoting techniques can be used in banks. Been doing it for a few years now and all I can say is that once you know the kind of "shot" it's just like aiming into the pocket.
 
SpiderWebComm said:
dr_dave said:
Joey,

I know this thread isn't about sharing detailed information, but could you at least expand a little on what you mean by this?

Are you claiming that CTE is also an "aiming system" for bank shots? In other words, it helps you arrive at a consistent and accurate line of aim for a wide range of bank shots, with no need for any "diamond system" or "aiming adjustment" ??? In other words, it eliminates the need for traditional kick and bank "diamond systems" and aim adjustment for speed, spin, and angle effects ???

Joey, I appreciate your desire to help people like Stan with sales of their products, but you sure are creating a high bar of expectation for his DVD. I honestly hope Stan's DVD meets or even exceeds all of the created expectations, but I honestly doubt it can. Regardless, I'm still looking forward to viewing it. I hope it comes out soon, before even more expectations are created.

Sincerely,
Dave

PS: I know you don't like it when I provide links to supporting resources and information, but I hope you don't think the links in this post are inappropriate. I honestly think the linked information is pertinent when considering any claims made concerning kick and bank shots "aiming systems."
Click to expand...
I use CTE for every bank (or 90/90-- same thing). It's the best way to bank (for me).

I have a question, Dr. Dave--- how well do you bank?
Click to expand...
I think I kick and bank better than most players at my speed, and better than many players better than me.

SpiderWebComm said:
Can you describe your thought process when lining up a bank (a bank that isn't a center-to-center natural angle)?
Click to expand...
Sure.

For slow and/or long banks, I use the through-diamond rolling-ball system.

For fast-speed banks, I use a 1/3-diamond adjustment to the equal-distance mirror system aim.

For multiple-rail kicks and banks, I use the Plus or Corner-5 Systems.

I also use other systems in different situations.

Regardless of which system I use, I make adjustments to the "system aim" to account for spin, roll, cut angle, and distance effects where appropriate (based mostly on practice-based "feel" and understanding of the effects).

Regards,
Dave
 
I try and keep banks shots out of my game when i play, thats why i use cte :grin: i actually made a nice long bank last night using cte for the win on my last game :grin:

Dave the product is here and it works and has gotten great reviews from people that have had the determination/open mind to learn a version of it. You along with a few others have lost this battle you waged against it. Be smart except/learn it and use it to your advantage...ijs
 
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dgem said:
pivoting techniques can be used in banks. Been doing it for a few years now and all I can say is that once you know the kind of "shot" it's just like aiming into the pocket.
Click to expand...

Shhhhh. Oh wait! They don't know that type of thing in the Philippines. :grin::grin::grin:

Happy Thanksgiving!
 
JoeyA said:
dgem said:
pivoting techniques can be used in banks.
Click to expand...
Shhhhh. Oh wait! They don't know that type of thing in the Philippines. :grin::grin::grin:
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Actually, according to the DAM truth, all of the top Filipino players use CTE to aim every cut shot, combo, carom, and bank! They even use CTE to aim kick, jump, and masse shots. Isn't it obvious ... that's why they rarely miss a shot. The possibilities with CTE are endless.

This CTE stuff is sounding better and better every day. Boy, I can't wait to play like a Filipino after I view and practice with Stan's DVD. CTE is probably what my game has been missing for all of these years. :eek::grin-square:

Regards,
Dave
 
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