"Dead Straight" Are they all really??

Tramp Steamer said:
True enough 123, but you can look at it this way to. Would Efren, or Allison, use a shaft with even the slightest wobble in it?
I doubt it, so neither should you or I.
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I have nothing to prove this, but I'd bet that there are a fair amount of players playing professionally whose cues have a SLIGHT amount of wobble that is not detectable by the human eye but can be discerned when rolling on a hard flat surface.. don't other people agree??

There are guys playing professionally that have been using the same cues for years. Every cue is bound to develop a slight wobble over time.. wood moves..

For me, if it looks straight and rolls straight on felt, its fine. If the tip moves when rotating the cue in my hand, thats a clear no no.
 
jetlau3 said:
I have nothing to prove this, but I'd bet that there are a fair amount of players playing professionally whose cues have a SLIGHT amount of wobble that is not detectable by the human eye but can be discerned when rolling on a hard flat surface.. don't other people agree??

There are guys playing professionally that have been using the same cues for years. Every cue is bound to develop a slight wobble over time.. wood moves..

For me, if it looks straight and rolls straight on felt, its fine. If the tip moves when rotating the cue in my hand, thats a clear no no.
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I agree. I have seen lots of great players using warped cues. Unless the cue is severely warped, no real player gives a rat's ass. The cue's straightness, within reason, has nothing to do with how well a player pockets balls. If the player is concerned with the straightness of the cue, then they aren't focusing on the game. If their focus can be broken that easily then they likely aren't the caliber of player that Allison & Efren compete with.

The issue with the lathe is the centers. A dead center is used in the chuck while a live center is used in the tailstock. I know first hand that a center can be turning dead nuts itself, but the shaft can still be wobbling on it. Often times you gotta "tweak" things, grab the shaft while it's spinning to reposition it on the centers so it turns true with them.

Still yet, it comes down to perspective. At what amount of warpage does each individual feel is enough to consider a shaft warped? I'd personally bet my mortgage that any maple shaft will have detectable inconsistencies given the correct measuring equipment. So at what point are the inconsistencies severe enough to consider the shaft warped? Each person will have their own idea.
 
A completely straight cue is as common as a completely straight politician.

LWW
 
qbilder said:
I agree. I have seen lots of great players using warped cues. Unless the cue is severely warped, no real player gives a rat's ass. The cue's straightness, within reason, has nothing to do with how well a player pockets balls. If the player is concerned with the straightness of the cue, then they aren't focusing on the game.
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This is a good topic and one I often think about also. I do not recall the last time I had a shaft that was dead straight. Of the 30+ cues I have right now, my main player is probably the one with the most 'not-straightness':wink:. I usually tell people(people who do not know too much about cues) that if the tip and ferrule stay on the table, then it probably is not too big of a deal. It sucks when trying to sell a cue, and the beginner player rolls the cues and mentions that it is not straight, when they have no idea that 95+% of cues will have the same issue. I say unless the ferulle and tip leave the table, we should just call it taper roll:grin-square:.
 
we are splitting hairs

Tramp Steamer said:
I think we're splitting hairs here, partner.
I did some checking. The "Tool and Manufactureing Engineers Handbook" SM3 Third addition, chapter 5-51 says that lathes from 12 to 18 inches (swing) should have a runout of 0.003 and I'm assuming that is a three jaw chuck. So my bad. I was off a zero. However, a four jaw chuck can have 0 runout because it can be adjusted out.
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Probably talking .003 total runout at the faceplate which is a little worse than we expect these days but very common in a working machine shop. My Jet spindle had .0015 runout. So did my chuck. That would have added up to .003 except I tweaked on the chuck and faceplate to true it to .0005 measured at one inch from the chuck jaws on a piece of 1" drill rod.

We are splitting hairs but that is the point of this thread, people splitting hairs concerning wobble. A chuck with independent jaws can be adjusted to very near zero at one place however even the chuck with independent jaws won't let you hold a piece true for very many inches if you measure to .0001 or even .0005.

The truth is that it is a waste of time to measure how true a piece of wood is to the degree some people are trying to. If you can't see crooked in a cue, it isn't crooked for any practical purpose.

Hu
 
If all shots were taken with center ball hits and shot at the same speed of stroke, shafts might stay perfect for longer periods of time. Loading a shot and going 3 rails for shape, then next shot a long draw where only a portion of the tip stresses back down the length of the shaft, these are the variables that help movement in a shaft. Like most posters a small variance in shafts straightness will not affect your game.my 2 cents
 
how to tell if you have a warped cue

if a rat runs under your cue ,that may be a good sign your cue is warped.
take care john107: anderson sc
 
Straightest shaft i ever had was a shaft i had Tony Black Boar make me that was an inch longer then standard, that i had him take down to my final specs in front of my eyes on the lathe.

Stayed straight, and rolled straight basically every which way i ever tried to test it.
Never played with it much though as that extra inch threw the balance all off, and i eventually ended up selling it to a guy in Germany, after it just sat there for years, hanging.

Although, the only thing i noticed was that it had more growth rings per inch then any other piece of shaft wood i have personally seen. Something ridiculous like 52 or 54, i can't remember which, but to this day, i have yet to personally see a piece of shaft wood equal to that one.
I've seen pictures of shaftwood like that, but not in person.

Figures it would be the straightest shaft i ever saw as well.
 
when i check for straight, i roll and look under the shaft for light. 99% have a noticeable variance. The other 1 percent i probably caught on a good day, meaning if i checked it right now, it may be slightly different. I have also seen sticks that roll out pretty bad, but you cant really tell while your shooting. Then there are the sticks you can tell are crooked when you get down to shoot with it and turn it. I dont think any piece of wood will stay perfect forever.
 
wooble

Tramp Steamer said:
True enough 123, but you can look at it this way to. Would Efren, or Allison, use a shaft with even the slightest wobble in it?
I doubt it, so neither should you or I.
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I think Efren or Allison is just like any other pro. I have never seen one of them bother to check. I have only seen amatures bother with checking shafts. Every pro I ever seen just picked it up and started shooting. Butterflycues
 
Tramp Steamer said:
True enough 123, but you can look at it this way to. Would Efren, or Allison, use a shaft with even the slightest wobble in it?
I doubt it, so neither should you or I.
Click to expand...

Efren won the world 9 with a crooked shaft and cracked butt ( the $15 cue ).
 
measuring- technology

jetlau3 said:
I've only owned about 7 cues and only 3 have been customs, but EVERY single shaft I've ever owned has had at least a slight slight wobble.

My Buss has been kept inside, air conditioned, cared for very well, since the moment I got it from Jim. Both shafts, the one that has been played extensively, and the one that was until recently unchalked, have slight slight wobbles. They look dead straight and the wobble can not be detected by the naked eye, but when rolled on a perfectly flat surface, they do wobble a tiny bit. Can't tell when rolled fast but as the cue starts slowing down, it does indeed roll faster, then slower until it stops. Very slight wobble almost not noticeable to the eye.

Every for sale ad says "dead straight" and rolls straight together and apart.. is this true?? or do people just not mention it when the shaft only wobbles a tiny tiny bit when rolled??
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It is interesting what you mention.
There is now measuring equipment sensitive enough that you can show that nothing is dead straight. But can now say straight to x in xx length when supported at points y and z.
Usually points y an z are the airy points for that particular part.
Somewhere you have to decide at what value is an acceptable run out to be considered straight and fit for purpose.
A shaft held at the joint is not strong enough to have the tip at the same centerline.Gravity bends the tip from centerline.
 
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