Dealing Cues Internationally

Pizza Bob

Pizza Bob

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Had a very interesting conversation last night, with a reliable source. Seems that Fish & Wildlife and Customs, both in this country and abroad have targeted cues that contain ivory.

Two stories that came to light really drive home the point. In one a an Ebay buyer won a cue auction and paid for it with PayPal. The buyer was unaware (naieve), and it wasn't disclosed on the auction site, that the cue was in Singapore. It fell victim to a custom's inspection and now the buyer has neither his cue nor his money.

Second story involved a Japanese buyer. In this instance Japanese customs intercepted an ivory ordained cue inbound from the US. Not only did they confiscate that cue, but they raided his home and confiscated ALL of his cues - a substantial hit, as this is how he made his living.

Legal ivory, that is used in cues built in this country, cannot cross international borders. To attempt it is to risk siezure. Just wanted to let people know that cues are now on the radar screen of the authorities.

Adios,

Pizza Bob
 
True enough Bob. Though I've never heard of customs actually entering someone's home and taking their collection, cues do get snatched up by customs.
 
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I haven't heard anything about this. It was getting tight about 10 years ago but then when the new law went into effect with the legal ivory all that stopped. I'd say the story about the cue from Singapore is that the guy just got ripped off. I wouldn't send a dime to Singapore. As for the Japanese customer, if something like that was to happen here the grapevine is too small that I wouldn't have heard something about it. All the cue dealers here carry the major makers, cues loaded with ivory etc... I just got a Paul Mottey delivered last weekend that has quite a bit of ivory in it too.

Not calling you out on this, man. Just conversing on the topic at hand.
MULLY
 
mullyman said:
I haven't heard anything about this. It was getting tight about 10 years ago but then when the new law went into effect with the legal ivory all that stopped. I'd say the story about the cue from Singapore is that the guy just got ripped off. I wouldn't send a dime to Singapore. As for the Japanese customer, if something like that was to happen here the grapevine is too small that I wouldn't have heard something about it. All the cue dealers here carry the major makers, cues loaded with ivory etc... I just got a Paul Mottey delivered last weekend that has quite a bit of ivory in it too.

Not calling you out on this, man. Just conversing on the topic at hand.
MULLY
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though you are right Mully. Singapore is like the international capital of Scams!!!
 
Yeah, I found a James White cue on the net, great pics, considered grabbing it, found out it was in Singapore and turned my computer off. hehe!!
MULLY
too many rip off stories about that place
 
Hi Bob,

Thanks for the warning.

I've noticed sellers in Taiwan and Singapore not using the term "ivory" anymore when selling their cues on E-Bay. I took my playing cue with me to China and I was a little concerned about it myself.

I know a cue maker who had his cue seized by Canadian customs one time, but they allowed him to pick it up on the way home.

Chris
 
mullyman said:
Not calling you out on this, man. Just conversing on the topic at hand.MULLY
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Mully:

No offense taken. I fully understand your skepticism, but of the two stories related, the one of the Japanese buyer is closer to "first-hand". My source sells to this buyer on a regular basis and he heard the story from the buyer himself.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

PS: I don't think it was Japanese Customs that raided his home, I think they reported him to whatever authority is responsible for enforcement (equivalent to US F&W) and they coducted the raid.

PB
 
pharaoh68 said:
though you are right Mully. Singapore is like the international capital of Scams!!!
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I would really like to know how did you come to have such an impression. Is it through personal experience or are you some sort of racist?

Hey Raist is a Singaporean too. Is he a scammer too? I think you should really practice some restrain. There are crooks everywhere in the world. A few bad hats doesn't make us a whole nation of crooks.
 
how in the world do you get a cue with ivory in it to another country????
i don't understand this at all
i know there is a schon dealer in germany
every schon, i think, has ivory in it
so, how in the hell does it get to germany legally????
 
If using paypal to buy anything use your credit card. If it is a scam paypal cannot help. They will only try to get your money back. If you use your credit card, the cc company will get your money back from paypal. PP tries to tell you get protection from them, but I do not believe they will go the extra step when the going get tough.
 
pharaoh68 said:
though you are right Mully. Singapore is like the international capital of Scams!!!
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please elaborate..would love to know how you come to think about Singapore that way?

pizza bob said:
It fell victim to a custom's inspection and now the buyer has neither his cue nor his money.
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Could you find out what is the ebay account name, or better still, the name of the Singapore seller?
 
Wow! I had no idea they were cracking down as hard as they were. I shipped a cue to Taiwan recently ( a few months ago) and it got through with no problems. I was told that if it was shipped in a USPS Express Mail tube, that the customs was less likely to inspect than if it was shipped in another type of tube or box.

I also had a off-white Delrin joint protector that was drilled clear through, that I had added to the cue to protect the pin during shipping...it matched up to the ivory joint perfectly! I suspect that at a cursory glance, they may have thought the entire joint was Delrin and let it through...unless they didn't inspect the shipping tube at all. There were no j/p's on the shafts. Lucky, I guess.

Lisa
 
I don't think its right to call Singapore an international capital of scam.. :mad: i've lived in Singapore all my life and i certainly don't think she's what you've claimed..
 
MasterClass said:
There are crooks everywhere in the world. A few bad hats doesn't make us a whole nation of crooks.
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tap, tap, tap

I knew there is a trouble brewing when I read the posts earlier. Good for you guys to stand up for your country.

I've done many deals (buying and selling) with Singaporeans and never had a single issue. There are many Singaporean AZ'ers out there as well.
 
invisible boy BHQ asked a question above
anyone have any thoughts???​
 
pharaoh68 said:
though you are right Mully. Singapore is like the international capital of Scams!!!
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Hi,
I am from Singapore and I do not see the need for you to label my country like that.
There are scammers everywhere in the world. I do not see the need for you to tag Singapore as you have quoted in your post.

Please kindly get your facts right before making such an irresponsible post.


mullyman said:
too many rip off stories about that place
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Hi, Mully
Please kindly provide some evidence so that we can know such things coming from my country.
If you are unable to do so, I think it is a bit unfair for you to label my country like this.


For your information, the pool community in Singapore is small and almost everyone is acquainted in some way. If there is any scam going on, you can just post it here anytime and we can help to identify it.

I believe there are many AZ members from Singapore who truly respect this forum and I hope that we can get some respect back as well.
 
I know a certain cue maker that will only declare the value of the cue up to $100 no matter how expensive it is. Once it leaves his hands, he is not responsible for it. I have heard several dealers from overseas say that if it is insured for anywhere near it's full value that they usually never receive it due to either customs seizing it because they saw the high insurance number, opened it, and noticed that it contained ivory or people stealing them.
 
Back to the original topic. I think you just have to be aware of the possibility of having your cue examined and possibly confiscated. Some may be more stringent than others. Especially if you insure the package for $3000 and state that it is a billiard cue. Kinda like putting a Rolex in a box, insuring it for $4000 and noting that it is a watch on the box. It has a much better chance of not arriving. I've had stuff go missing shipping it within the continental U.S.

Scams are all over the world, I had a Mottey about 2 years ago that pics were posted on about 4 different scam auctions. There are crooks everywhere.
 
gutshot said:
I know a certain cue maker that will only declare the value of the cue up to $100 no matter how expensive it is. Once it leaves his hands, he is not responsible for it. I have heard several dealers from overseas say that if it is insured for anywhere near it's full value that they usually never receive it due to either customs seizing it because they saw the high insurance number, opened it, and noticed that it contained ivory or people stealing them.
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I agree....when I sold my Skip, I was told by the purchaser to not go over 150.00 or 200.00 (can't remember now) for insured value. He accepted full responsibility. I also included on the customs form that it was used (which it was) and that it was a gift. It seemed to have worked out fine, as the buyer had the cue within 4 days of my shipping it to Taiwan.

Brent....I think the bottom line is, cues made here in the US containing pre-ban ivory CAN NOT be shipped outside of the US, legally. It's a crap-shoot if you do. I am not sure how Schon would handle their overseas distribution to Europe...they could have documentation allowing them to distribute overseas, or, the cues tagged for overseas sales may well be made with a faux-ivory.

Lisa
 
Jazz said:
I've done many deals with Singaporeans and never had a single issue. There are many Singaporean AZ'ers out there as well.
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I've never had an issue either...ever. You want to talk about cue scams...what about the multitude of top players who tell cuemakers "yes I'll play with your cue and promote it" and then when they are given a cue...they sell it at the next event. Thats a scam...and right here in the good ole U.S. Thats why I've never given a cue to a pro...if they have a Varney then they paid for it!
I'm with Gutshot too...I always declare value at $100-150. And I never write "Varney Cues" on the box or label either. I find it best to label it "cue parts" on the customs form & never mention the word pool.;)
 
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