Artemis vs SuperSpeed cushions.
You put Artemis on Gold Crown, it will bank shorter too.
Diamonds clearly bank shorter than most other if not all tables…so, why?
- Thread starter white1
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You put Artemis on Gold Crown, it will bank shorter too.
The boing coefficient has been thoroughly researched and prepared for master level reflective smear resistance.
Why?
The reason they play goofy is Diamond didn't know, and still doesn't know, what the hell they were doing, and let out goofy rails from the factory for 30 years.
How to adjust:
speed: play position for an extra rail when going across the table (pin ball machine bounce).
angle: you just have to know where it will go and deal with it.
How to adjust:
speed: play position for an extra rail when going across the table (pin ball machine bounce).
angle: you just have to know where it will go and deal with it.
Most of today's young guns cut their teeth on Diamonds. To them a Diamond is normal and other tables bank wrong.
Hu
Hu
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
They don't bank shorter, you're hitting it too hard.
OK, just to throw a little poop in the fan, I think snooker tables bank better than pool tables. No experience but I understand billiard tables do too.
Why are we hung in these rail profile and nose height issues?
Hu
Why are we hung in these rail profile and nose height issues?
Hu
I thought they addressed that issue?
Modern steel backed snooker tables apparently bank different than the older tables do to the rails being stiffer.
I still have a theory that Diamond rails are stiffer than other table due to the butcher block design. It could be a different brand cushion as well.
I have been aware of the steel in some snooker table rails for a few years. Almost counterintuitive to me, I didn't think it would matter significantly, however it does make a superior rail. I have wondered how that might affect pool tables if the same was done.
This is clearly a solution in search of a problem though. You adjust to tables where you play. In New Orleans the blue label Diamonds still bank fairly short. I went to Dallas for a week and the Diamonds played fantastic there. Of course I have found the worse the table the bigger the homefield advantage!
Hu
Next time compare the height and cut of the Diamond table’s rails with the cue ball and object balls equator line.
Then compare it with other brand pool tables. The Diamond rails are appreciably higher than other pool tables and
definitely bank differently. Just a smidge of English and controlling bank shot speed can easily remedy the situation.
Then compare it with other brand pool tables. The Diamond rails are appreciably higher than other pool tables and
definitely bank differently. Just a smidge of English and controlling bank shot speed can easily remedy the situation.
I don't think the wood material or rail construction have much to do with it. If the stiffness of the wood (laminated oak on a Diamond vs solid poplar on a GC) made much of a difference, I think we'd see a "bigger difference" where there is a rail bolt on a poplar rail vs where there is no rail bolt on a poplar rail.
ps, I think "butcher block" is the wrong term for what diamond does. Butcher block in cooking cutting boards usually refers to end grain sticking up in square blocks which is the best for the knife not whittling down the cutting board over time. Diamond rails are simply laminated together, with the grain cupping alternating direction, which is super common in any woodworking solid wood panel glue-up. The alternating grain orientation is to minimize warping over time.
I was at the Hopkins expo last month and talked a while about this with Philly's top table mechanic. He too was of the opinion that Diamond did everything great, except they completely ruined the rails bounce/angle, and he too could not believe a company of "players" would ever let those rails out the door for 30 years.
Anyway, he told me he has a durometer measuring instrument in his truck and measures every table he works on, and every new cushion he installs, and even keeps a scrap of the new cushions in his truck, all as a way to know if the cushions on a table are in need of replacement. He told me that Diamond cushions, both the Artemis on the 9' tables, and the Diamond black on the 7' tables, are about 10 durometer softer than just about every other brand of cushion. It was his opinion that this softness was the major cause of both the diamond fast speed, and the diamond short angle.
ps, I think "butcher block" is the wrong term for what diamond does. Butcher block in cooking cutting boards usually refers to end grain sticking up in square blocks which is the best for the knife not whittling down the cutting board over time. Diamond rails are simply laminated together, with the grain cupping alternating direction, which is super common in any woodworking solid wood panel glue-up. The alternating grain orientation is to minimize warping over time.
I was at the Hopkins expo last month and talked a while about this with Philly's top table mechanic. He too was of the opinion that Diamond did everything great, except they completely ruined the rails bounce/angle, and he too could not believe a company of "players" would ever let those rails out the door for 30 years.
Anyway, he told me he has a durometer measuring instrument in his truck and measures every table he works on, and every new cushion he installs, and even keeps a scrap of the new cushions in his truck, all as a way to know if the cushions on a table are in need of replacement. He told me that Diamond cushions, both the Artemis on the 9' tables, and the Diamond black on the 7' tables, are about 10 durometer softer than just about every other brand of cushion. It was his opinion that this softness was the major cause of both the diamond fast speed, and the diamond short angle.
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Butcher block is the proper term as it doesn't necessarily mean end grain sticking up. Look at butcher block counter tops.
I think the countertop industry messed up the term too. An endgrain cutting board is way, way better and is more traditional. (I've made a few myself, and the amount of work to make them is more than double). Anyway that's minutia in our discussion, I was just bringing it up for conversation
So he is saying it's not a rail issue it's a cushion issue.
They did fix the nose height issue with the blue label.
That was his opinion, yes.
But he also said he has not tested out his theory, for example putting a superspeed cushion on the Diamond rail, etc.
see post #30