Eagle Eye Takes Aim at 14.1 High Runs

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Slightly off topic:)

The ball set used was Aramith Tournament, is this correct? TV colors or traditonal colors?

Thanks.
 

Straightpool_99

I see dead balls
Silver Member
I haven't read a lot of the recent posts, but there was one post a few days back in one of the threads by I think RKC. I believe he said something to the effect that with a 5" mouth, and factory GC angles, two balls would touch at the throat of the pocket. (I'm paraphrasing and perhaps I'm remembering wrong...)

I went to my table, which is a factory GC4, with the factory pockets. When two balls are placed in the back of the jaws (throat), as far as they go before dropping off the slate, there is about 1/8" gap between them (by eye). I checked all 4 corners, in case the entire rail sub-assembly was shifted on the slate, making the shelf depth different on each pocket. All 4 were the same.

I'm the third owner, but it was always privately owned, never in a pool hall. I think its only had 3 re-coverings in its lifetime. I say this because I'm not 100% they are stock, but the probability is super high that they are.

When I saw the first pictures of the GC3 used here, I too thought the pocket facings were modified to be excessively easy, and excessively beyond a factory GC. However, seeing the more recent pictures, and going to my table and seeing its pocket, I now think they are at least in the ballpark of a stock GC.

Still, I agree a bevel gauge measurement would be nice to see.
About 20 years ago a local pool hall had stock GC3's and all the pockets were around 5 inches. If I had to guess, I'd say they were more than 5 inches, but I didn't measure them, other than putting balls together in the pocket opening and seeing plenty of a gap on the side. They were extremely easy pockets and the shelves seemed very shallow too. It's hard to imagine pockets being much easier without being bigger. I guess if you really hammer shots along the rails they may spit out more shots than a modified one, but at fairly hard and medium to soft speeds, if the ball touched the facing, it dropped, no matter if it hit the rail going in at any point. I remember playing on these as a C player and thinking these are easy tables. Back then I played on another brand with 5 inch pockets and dead rails, so that should be saying something. Dead rails lengthen the angle so it minimizes the push away from the pocket, should you contact the rail. The superspeed cushions on the GC's had plenty of bounce in them, and still brushing the rail didn't mean the ball blipped out. Whatever gains could be made by modifying these pockets must be miniscule and probably not a deciding factor unless you enlarge the pockets (IMO).

If you had to squeeze every advantage, I'd look into modifying the angle (very small effect) and changing the hardness of the facings (probably equal effect, if not more). Nobody ever thinks of the facings, but here there actually is a standard! "..The rubber of the facings should be somewhat harder than that of the cushions." Rather vague and open to interpretation. It doesn't even say "must", but "should". An unscroupulous person may manipulate both the thickness and hardness of the facing, and 99.9% of people would be none the viser. In all my time playing pool I've never heard of anyone even suggest the possibility of measuring the facing hardness or thickness during a tournament. Sure, people would react if they heard the table was "double shimmed", but what if a thicker facing was used? How about a thinner facing? Worn facings? Nope, never heard anyone care.
 

stevelomako

Needed now…more than ever.
Silver Member
Yeah but based on the best overhead corner pocket photos recently shown of the table with two balls frozen sitting just inside the mouth, and the work of some of the pool detectives on here, it is basically no longer a secret.

Whether they like it or not, we’re looking at a table with corner pockets that measure 5-1/4 inches at the mouth, 4-3/4 inches at the drop off point, and 139° pocket facing angles.

As far as I’m concerned until I hear otherwise from the organizers that have chosen to keep this a coveted secret, that’s is what it is.
Except you’d be wrong according to an expert.

Didn’t “the mechanic” explicitly state that they were parallel pockets without a doubt.


I know there is a photo on here of a digital caliper and it showed 4.95 or close to that for the pocket points. They could have measured it better with the inside of the caliper but they didn’t.


Anyway, at the beginning there were a lot of people that jumped on the “parallel pockets” train. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Except you’d be wrong according to an expert.

Didn’t “the mechanic” explicitly state that they were parallel pockets without a doubt.


I know there is a photo on here of a digital caliper and it showed 4.95 or close to that for the pocket points. They could have measured it better with the inside of the caliper but they didn’t.


Anyway, at the beginning there were a lot of people that jumped on the “parallel pockets” train. 🤷🏻‍♂️
The point is, until they release the specs which they show no interest in doing, we can speculate whatever we think they are.
 

Texas Carom Club

9ball did to billiards what hiphop did to america
Silver Member
Yeah Schmidty got it very wrong
Wonder how many times this has been posted to his page by now tagging him and Shaw lmao
FB_IMG_1643170867747.jpg
 

cueman

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Except you’d be wrong according to an expert.

Didn’t “the mechanic” explicitly state that they were parallel pockets without a doubt.


I know there is a photo on here of a digital caliper and it showed 4.95 or close to that for the pocket points. They could have measured it better with the inside of the caliper but they didn’t.


Anyway, at the beginning there were a lot of people that jumped on the “parallel pockets” train. 🤷🏻‍♂️
Measuring with the inside of the calipers would have flipped them upside down.
 

gerryf

Well-known member
One thing that I have not seen in this discussion is that (supposedly) Mosconi did not miss after running 526 balls in exhibition but simply stopped shooting (perhaps he ran out of time in the exhibition or was tired).
In Mosconi's book, he says he missed 527.
 

gerryf

Well-known member
And there are reports from someone who seems to have been there that it was a hard shot on the six ball.
Mosconi described it as :
"
On March 19, in Springfield, Ohio, I ran 526 balls, a record that still stands. I was playing a two-hundred-point match against an amateur by the name of Earl Bruney in the East High Billiard Club. He made three balls off the break, then I ran two hundred and just kept going. The run took two hours and ten minutes, which means that over that span I averaged four balls a minute. I finally missed a difficult cut shot, but by that time I was weary; it was almost a relief to have it come to an end."

Cohen, Stanley; Mosconi, Willie. Willie's Game: An Autobiography . Open Road Media. Kindle Edition.
 

Poolgeorge

New member
John Schmidt Equipment List
14.1 Challenge IV

Easy Street Billiards
Monterey, California

  • Rebco Pocket Billiard Table 4-1/2 x 9
  • Drop Pockets - No Ball Return
  • Simonis 760 Tournament Cloth Green
  • 5-inch Corner Pockets
  • 5-1/2 inch Side Pockets
  • Sardo Rack
  • Super Aramith Pro Belgian Billiard Balls
  • Predator P3 Red Butt
  • Predator Revo 12.4mm Carbon Composite Shaft
  • 19.5 oz and 58 inches
  • Techno Dud Tip by Outsville
  • Taom Pyro Blue Chalk
  • Predator Second Skin Billiard Glove
  • Predator Urbain 3x5 Hard Case Red
There are no rules. JS proved that beyond a doubt. Gimmicked everything involved. Been given a 2-1/2 year free pass. Same professors of
faith for one player, but not for any others, who just went to a venue and played what was there.
Just saying!...
I've said my piece. Call me whomever you wish.
Is the predator urbain for sale
 

Dan White

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Mosconi described it as :
"
On March 19, in Springfield, Ohio, I ran 526 balls, a record that still stands. I was playing a two-hundred-point match against an amateur by the name of Earl Bruney in the East High Billiard Club. He made three balls off the break, then I ran two hundred and just kept going. The run took two hours and ten minutes, which means that over that span I averaged four balls a minute. I finally missed a difficult cut shot, but by that time I was weary; it was almost a relief to have it come to an end."

Cohen, Stanley; Mosconi, Willie. Willie's Game: An Autobiography . Open Road Media. Kindle Edition.
I wonder if he had any circus shots during that run. I've never actually heard the run characterized in any way, which makes me think it was the usual "so easy anybody could have done it" kind of exhibition.
 

Poolgeorge

New member
John Schmidt Equipment List
14.1 Challenge IV

Easy Street Billiards
Monterey, California

  • Rebco Pocket Billiard Table 4-1/2 x 9
  • Drop Pockets - No Ball Return
  • Simonis 760 Tournament Cloth Green
  • 5-inch Corner Pockets
  • 5-1/2 inch Side Pockets
  • Sardo Rack
  • Super Aramith Pro Belgian Billiard Balls
  • Predator P3 Red Butt
  • Predator Revo 12.4mm Carbon Composite Shaft
  • 19.5 oz and 58 inches
  • Techno Dud Tip by Outsville
  • Taom Pyro Blue Chalk
  • Predator Second Skin Billiard Glove
  • Predator Urbain 3x5 Hard Case Red
There are no rules. JS proved that beyond a doubt. Gimmicked everything involved. Been given a 2-1/2 year free pass. Same professors of
faith for one player, but not for any others, who just went to a venue and played what was there.
Just saying!...
I've said my piece. Call me whomever you wish.
How much for urbain case
 
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