Eric Crisp - Sugartree cues REVIEW

[pharaoh68]

REVIEW OF ERIC CRISP:
Here's the story. Its kinda long.

Better than two years ago, I began to hear of a new, up-and-coming cuemaker out there named Eric Crisp. His cues were called Sugartree Custom Cues. Eric had a short wait at the time and good prices. More importantly, he had a reputation for building solid players with some really wild woods. So i was intrigued.

I contacted Eric and placed an order for a pretty plan cue. nothing too fancy. Eric agreed to the order, saying it would be done in about three months. I inquired about a deposit and he said none was required. I offered, but again, he said it was not necessary. So I sat back and smiled as I closed my eyes and waited for the monster player I had just ordered.

Three months passed and I checked in. I was told that the cue was coming along nicely. And he would send me some pics when he had a chance. Pics never came.

Several months came and went again and I sent Eric another email. I was told that during his move from Alaska to Arizona or New Mexico (or wherever he is now), the wood moved a little and that he might have to start over. I though, 'Well, I'd rather not have a warped cue so if it takes more time, it takes more time. No biggie."

A few more months still and I inquired again. I was told the woods oved and he would have to scrap it. My response. "That's ok. Since we're starting over, can we tweak the design some?" Eric said sure. He knew I wasnted burl and he was eager to do a forearm of black walnut burl. I was thrilled. He said he would sent pics of the blocks of burl he had. I never saw any.

I inquired again and was promised pics again. No pics came. Now I'm beginning to feel like I am getting the run-around. I mean, late is one thing. But 2+ years late?!?!

Two years or better had gone by since my DELIVERY date. Not my order date. Other people had their orders filled. Dealers were getting cues in mass quantities. Eric's popularity, his wait, and his prices soared. All the while, i never got my cue!!!

So, being a poster on another forum, I told my tale. I was kind enough to leave Eric's name out of it as I was just looking for opinions from other posters. Well, Eric saw my thread and he responded. He basically admitted outright that he was "playing peek-a-boo" with me and that I was more persistent, I might have my cue. He insisted that this was "just a hobby". Well, call me crazy but, a hobby stops being a hobby when you start taking orders and accepting money from people. No?

Here's the thing. I waited 2+ years and I never got my cue. Eric offered (in his response on the other forum) to fill my order. At which point I said I'd rather buy one on the second-hand market and give the money to someone else. I cancelled the order.

But here's the thing. I'm not the only person this has happened to. I know of other people who have never gotten their cues. So, why is it that so many people are quick to say how great Eric is?!?! I mean, he flat-out admitted that in my case, he was pretty much lying to me. So I ask you, is this good business???


REVIEW OF THE CUES:
I've owned and played with other Sugartrees that I got through outher people. They play pretty good.

 

[Bigjohn]

REVIEW OF ERIC CRISP:
Here's the story. Its kinda long.

Better than two years ago, I began to hear of a new, up-and-coming cuemaker out there named Eric Crisp. His cues were called Sugartree Custom Cues. Eric had a short wait at the time and good prices. More importantly, he had a reputation for building solid players with some really wild woods. So i was intrigued.

I contacted Eric and placed an order for a pretty plan cue. nothing too fancy. Eric agreed to the order, saying it would be done in about three months. I inquired about a deposit and he said none was required. I offered, but again, he said it was not necessary. So I sat back and smiled as I closed my eyes and waited for the monster player I had just ordered.

Three months passed and I checked in. I was told that the cue was coming along nicely. And he would send me some pics when he had a chance. Pics never came.

Several months came and went again and I sent Eric another email. I was told that during his move from Alaska to Arizona or New Mexico (or wherever he is now), the wood moved a little and that he might have to start over. I though, 'Well, I'd rather not have a warped cue so if it takes more time, it takes more time. No biggie."

A few more months still and I inquired again. I was told the woods oved and he would have to scrap it. My response. "That's ok. Since we're starting over, can we tweak the design some?" Eric said sure. He knew I wasnted burl and he was eager to do a forearm of black walnut burl. I was thrilled. He said he would sent pics of the blocks of burl he had. I never saw any.

I inquired again and was promised pics again. No pics came. Now I'm beginning to feel like I am getting the run-around. I mean, late is one thing. But 2+ years late?!?!

Two years or better had gone by since my DELIVERY date. Not my order date. Other people had their orders filled. Dealers were getting cues in mass quantities. Eric's popularity, his wait, and his prices soared. All the while, i never got my cue!!!

So, being a poster on another forum, I told my tale. I was kind enough to leave Eric's name out of it as I was just looking for opinions from other posters. Well, Eric saw my thread and he responded. He basically admitted outright that he was "playing peek-a-boo" with me and that I was more persistent, I might have my cue. He insisted that this was "just a hobby". Well, call me crazy but, a hobby stops being a hobby when you start taking orders and accepting money from people. No?

Here's the thing. I waited 2+ years and I never got my cue. Eric offered (in his response on the other forum) to fill my order. At which point I said I'd rather buy one on the second-hand market and give the money to someone else. I cancelled the order.

But here's the thing. I'm not the only person this has happened to. I know of other people who have never gotten their cues. So, why is it that so many people are quick to say how great Eric is?!?! I mean, he flat-out admitted that in my case, he was pretty much lying to me. So I ask you, is this good business???


REVIEW OF THE CUES:
I've owned and played with other Sugartrees that I got through outher people. They play pretty good.

On 4-16-08 @ 6:56am I posted a thread looking for an ebony nose BG. Eric responded @ 9:14am saying he had one and that he was not actively trying to sell it because it was in his collection but that he was not partial to it and would consider selling it to me. At 9:32am my thread was hijacked per pm to Eric and at 10:13am he sold the cue to the hijacker, posting to me that the cue was no longer available.

 

[JoeyInCali]

Last year I bought some shaft woods from an acquaintance of Eric.
I was supposed to get diamond grade. Half of them were not. The ones that were not, most of them I cut in half and found great coring dowels.
When Eric came back from a trip I told him about.
The lowlife Eric is, HE SENT ME SHAFTWOODS FROM HIS STOCK for free and apologized. I didn't pay for shipping even. He refused it. He just sent me his diamond grade shafts.

 

[BPG24]

That's interesting.

 

[JCIN]

An hour after I met Eric Crisp he gave me his personal playing cue to support TAR. He will always be a great guy in my book.

Brian you can come across as pretty harsh at times on the forums and you seem to embrace that. Look at your sig line. Perhaps a little of that came home to roost here.

He took no money from you. Maybe he just doesn't like you?

Not saying it is right or wrong but it would explain somethings.

 

[pharaoh68]

Last year I bought some shaft woods from an acquaintance of Eric.
I was supposed to get diamond grade. Half of them were not. The ones that were not, most of them I cut in half and found great coring dowels.
When Eric came back from a trip I told him about.
The lowlife Eric is, HE SENT ME SHAFTWOODS FROM HIS STOCK for free and apologized. I didn't pay for shipping even. He refused it. He just sent me his diamond grade shafts.

I think I see a tremendous difference between your story and mine Joey.

In YOUR story, he screwed you over and got caught, at which point he made good. Considering that you're an upstanding member of the cuemaking community, he was just doing right by you to save his own rep.

In MY story. I got screwed. He admitted he screwed me. I got jack and sh!t in return.

See any differences there?

 

[pharaoh68]

An hour after I met Eric Crisp he gave me his personal playing cue to support TAR. He will always be a great guy in my book.

Brian you can come across as pretty harsh at times on the forums and you seem to embrace that. Look at your sig line. Perhaps a little of that came home to roost here.

He took no money from you. Maybe he just doesn't like you?

Not saying it is right or wrong but it would explain somethings.

JCIN-

So he gave you ONE of his personal playing cues. What does that prove other than free publicity for Eric and his 'hobby'.

If hating me were the case, that'd be fine. At least I'd have an explanation. Instead, what I got were lies and an admission that I just wasn't annoying enough.

And for the record, I have a few of the email correspondence between us. I was nothing short of cordial and compimentary. Look where it got me.

Oh, and remember... I was kind enough to leave Eric 's name out of this the first time around. HE was the one who chimed in and said that he was just dodging me. Explain to me again how that is my fault?!

 

[TellsItLikeItIs]

Right-wrong-love-hate whats the difference. If you tell a man youre going to do something just do it! Pretty simple.

An hour after I met Eric Crisp he gave me his personal playing cue to support TAR. He will always be a great guy in my book.

Brian you can come across as pretty harsh at times on the forums and you seem to embrace that. Look at your sig line. Perhaps a little of that came home to roost here.

He took no money from you. Maybe he just doesn't like you?

Not saying it is right or wrong but it would explain somethings.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I think I see a tremendous difference between your story and mine Joey.

In YOUR story, he screwed you over and got caught, at which point he made good. Considering that you're an upstanding member of the cuemaking community, he was just doing right by you to save his own rep.

In MY story. I got screwed. He admitted he screwed me. I got jack and sh!t in return.

See any differences there?

Not really because if he didn't send any of his shafts, I would have just returned them to the person who sent them to me.
We've exchanged goodies before with no problems so I wasn't going to put the blame on him so he wasn't really protecting himself.

 

[poolplayer2093]

Right-wrong-love-hate whats the difference. If you tell a man youre going to do something just do it! Pretty simple.

i think telling his story is what he aimed to do.

 

[JCIN]

JCIN-

So he gave you ONE of his personal playing cues. What does that prove other than free publicity for Eric and his 'hobby'.

If hating me were the case, that'd be fine. At least I'd have an explanation. Instead, what I got were lies and an admission that I just wasn't annoying enough.

And for the record, I have a few of the email correspondence between us. I was nothing short of cordial and compimentary. Look where it got me.

Oh, and remember... I was kind enough to leave Eric 's name out of this the first time around. HE was the one who chimed in and said that he was just dodging me. Explain to me again how that is my fault?!

It proves Eric will support the game. As far as publicity why would he care about that? He doesnt even take orders. I have the distinct feeling that if Eric ever gets tired of any aspect of cue building he will simply stop building cues.

I never said anything was anyones fault I simply put forth a theory. Sometimes shit just doesn't work out. Chalk it up and move on.

My experience with the guy has been great and he strikes me as a man that is going to do things his way and on his schedule. I don't know what you are after here. He could of communicated better and probably some other things but he didn't so why keep bringing it up ? A cuemaker that didn't provide sterling customer service to every single customer. Stop the presses. It is what it is.

 

[Birk1]

my story

I ordered a sugartree back in May of 2005...it was delivered Feb 2007 - over 1.5 years after my delivery date.

here is the kicker...the cue was not the right weight, not the right diameter at the handle and not EVEN CLOSE relative to the balance point I ordered (19inches from the bumper was my order - came balanced at 22 inches from the bumper)

you are not the only one who was / is not impressed.

 

[ridewiththewind]

Bri...I guess I just do not get why you would bring this up a good month, perhaps month and a half after the fact. You, yourself stated that you didn't even care about getting the cue, as you had already managed to own several, and sold them again. Then you publicly cancelled your own order.

Just not getting what you hope to gain by this post? You state that if a cuemaker accepts money for a cue, that it no longer make them a hobbyist...I think there are several cuemakers who would tend to disagree with you. These individuals make their cues because it is something they enjoy to do, and do not wish to have constraints or demands placed upon them...hence making the experience too much like work.

hobby ~ 1. an activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main occupation: Her hobbies include stamp-collecting and woodcarving.


Lisa <==== not on the list, and is okay with that.

 

[Bigjohn]

It proves Eric will support the game. As far as publicity why would he care about that? He doesnt even take orders. I have the distinct feeling that if Eric ever gets tired of any aspect of cue building he will simply stop building cues.

I never said anything was anyones fault I simply put forth a theory. Sometimes shit just doesn't work out. Chalk it up and move on.

My experience with the guy has been great and he strikes me as a man that is going to do things his way and on his schedule. I don't know what you are after here. He could of communicated better and probably some other things but he didn't so why keep bringing it up ? A cuemaker that didn't provide sterling customer service to every single customer. Stop the presses. It is what it is.

Sorry... but IMHO your responses to this thread are biased. If I had received the cue in question... and it was Free... I surely would have had a different response.

 

[poolplayer2093]

Bri...I guess I just do not get why you would bring this up a good month, perhaps month and a half after the fact. You, yourself stated that you didn't even care about getting the cue, as you had already managed to own several, and sold them again. Then you publicly cancelled your own order.

Just not getting what you hope to gain by this post? You state that if a cuemaker accepts money for a cue, that it no longer make them a hobbyist...I think there are several cuemakers who would tend to disagree with you. These individuals make their cues because it is something they enjoy to do, and do not wish to have constraints or demands placed upon them...hence making the experience too much like work.

hobby ~ 1. an activity or interest pursued for pleasure or relaxation and not as a main occupation: Her hobbies include stamp-collecting and woodcarving.


Lisa <==== not on the list, and is okay with that.

i think he just wanted to let people know that mr crisp isn't as perfect as everyone makes him out to be. he didn't do right by him and that he might not do right by other customers. not that i'm saying he won't but there's a chance he won't. it just seems that the demand out weighs the supply and that really kinda leaves the buyer at the makers mercy.

for the record i liked the sugartree i had and i'd deffinetly buy another, but seeing as mr crisp said in the tar interview he has enough orders to keep him busy until he dies i really don't see the point in trying to order one (same reason i won't order a sw). When (yeah i said when) i buy another one it'll be second hand

 

[ridewiththewind]

i think he just wanted to let people know that mr crisp isn't as perfect as everyone makes him out to be. he didn't do right by him and that he might not do right by other customers. not that i'm saying he won't but there's a chance he won't. it just seems that the demand out weighs the supply and that really kinda leaves the buyer at the makers mercy.

for the record i liked the sugartree i had and i'd deffinetly buy another, but seeing as mr crisp said in the tar interview he has enough orders to keep him busy until he dies i really don't see the point in trying to order one (same reason i won't order a sw). When (yeah i said when) i buy another one it'll be second hand

Eric admitted quite publicly that he is indeed NOT perfect. This thread would have made more sense to me had it come shortly after this very public discussion...but to let 30-45 days transpire...it comes off more as sour grapes than anything else, IMHO.

I do not, nor have ever owned a SugarTree, nor know Eric personally. I have nothing to gain by responding here...other than to point out that there a many 'hobbyist' cuemakers who feel very much the same as Eric does with regards to their cuemaking. If we begin to alienate them, they will just find another way to spend their free time, and we as a collective, will be out some very, very fine cuemakers.

BTW...cuemakers are human too...while many try very hard...they cannot please all of the people all of the time, there is always going to be someone, somewhere, that is disappointed. We here in the US, in particular, have somehow gotten this sense of 'entitlement' that I just do not get. Contrary to popular belief, we cannot always get what we want.

I recently received a cue from a 'hobbyist' cuemaker...one I had been waiting for an opportunity to acquire one from since about 2000. The day he told me he had a cue in mind for me, I was tickled to death for the opportunity. I still waited well over a year...almost closer to 1.5 years for the cue to be finally completed, but I was told upfront that patience was going to be a requirement, as this particular maker does has a LIFE. Gotta say, it was well worth the wait, and the cue, while simple enough, was everything I could have possibly hoped for, and then some! I know that I will NEVER part with it.

For me, it was a cue that I had hoped for one day, but never counted on it...so when the opportunity presented itself, I was incredibly grateful for it...I certainly never felt that I was entitled to own one, or that the cuemaker was entitled to build one for me. I guess, with regards to cues from makers, I consider the opportunity to have one built for me as a priviledge...certainly not a right...especially when no money has changed hands.

Lisa

 

[ccn7]

What I'd like to know from all you past ST owners, what have you replaced your ST cue with. Just curious, are you buying them for playing or collecting or just to turn it fast and make a few bucks. Especially if its a custom to your order why would you then sell it trade it or whatever. Anyways just some thoughts i had if you care to enlighten me a lil bit i'd appreciate it very much thank you all.
Another curious mind with to much time on my hands.

 

[JoeyInCali]

What I'd like to know from all you past ST owners, what have you replaced your ST cue with. Just curious, are you buying them for playing or collecting or just to turn it fast and make a few bucks. Especially if its a custom to your order why would you then sell it trade it or whatever. Anyways just some thoughts i had if you care to enlighten me a lil bit i'd appreciate it very much thank you all.
Another curious mind with to much time on my hands.

My opinion is a lot of the former ST owners just could not pass up on making a few dollars.

 

[ridewiththewind]

My opinion is a lot of the former ST owners just could not pass up on making a few dollars.

I agree, Joey....much the same as what happened with Kerry's cues several years ago.

The shame of all this is...the very people that most of these cuemakers had intended to make cues for, the players, never really got a chance to experience these makers' work...as the flippers did a fine job of driving up the prices to the point that most players could not afford anyways. Everyone wants a piece of the pie.

Lisa

 

[pharaoh68]

A cuemaker that didn't provide sterling customer service to every single customer. Stop the presses. It is what it is.

Sterling customer service?! Re-read the post JCIN. He didn't provide ANY service. All I got were promises that turned out to be lies.

Thus, the negatvie review.