Fact or Fiction: Gambling Makes You A Better Player

Practice, Instruction, Introspection... You want to get better hone your skills.. Work on your particular game and mechanics at the practice table and hit balls until you hear them rolling in your sleep..... That makes you get better...

After you have the hours in and you think you have made improvements, MATCH UP.... I don't care if it's gambling, playing in a tournament or playing someone free sets as long as they are your equal or better and they have that on the line to lose and you have the desire to move up past them.

The match ups are where you see if you actually built a solid foundation or you built a house of cards. If the house of cards doesn't fall down, Match up again. Higher Stakes, Bigger tournaments, Longer sets for free with added internal pressure of not letting em get to 5 going to 7 or something like that. Keep raising the match up level until your foundations start to shake.

When you add enough pressure through the match ups you will see the flaws in your armor and you will have to go back to the practice table and address the issues. It may be certain shots you found out you miss under pressure. It may be your kicks and jumps are too weak. Your break needs work.. Your stroke fails you... If it's a weakness you are going to see it.
Address the issues and then you have to match up again to see if it's corrected. It's a viscous cycle. A cycle some people don't have the stomach for because you are gonna get bloody.

The match ups won't make you a better player all by themselves. What they do is to test the metal that you built your game out of.

I am pretty damn sure no one is going to go from the practice table to winning the US Open. The Filipinos have some idea on this, they expect to lose 100times before they can be a champion. If you think it's the losing that is the teacher here it's not. You take your loss and you go back to the practice tables and you fix whatever it was that beat you.

That's the hard part for lots of people. Most people offer up excuses as to what happened and why they lost. They refuse to take a serious look at what beat them so they end up sitting at a certain plateau for most of their lives.
 
just like alot of things it can make you shine or it can make you suck

its arbitrary from person to person.......


there are some high dollar gamblers that can't play worth a dam in tournaments....and I'm not necessarily talking about guys like Dippy.

its an all together mental state so it really does just depend on that person and how they adjust and take it.

playing for funzies is not like gambling and gambling is not like tournament play

so imop its all apples, oranges and bananas so there really aint nothing to compare them by except they are all fruit.

-Grey Ghost-
 
Many people don't like hearing that you have to gamble to improve your game. Most of the time, that statement that you need to gamble to improve, comes from people who gamble. :grin:

I think gambling can help you focus better or focus worse. If you are successful at gambling you are able to focus under that condition. If you are not successful at gambling (overall) you apparently are unable to focus under that condition.

I personally believe that a person can improve by playing in tournaments but mostly by putting in quality time on the pool table and of course, learning.

If you can afford to gamble and you're not adverse to gambling and/or if you can win more than you lose, I recommend gambling. It's just another dimension to playing with a different kind of pressure but the way I see it, is if you aren't going to be gambling on a regular basis, why start?

Many tournament players that do not gamble play WORLD CLASS. That should tell you something about whether gambling is needed to improve your game.

JoeyA (Likes gambling)
 
The Renfro said:
Practice, Instruction, Introspection... You want to get better hone your skills.. Work on your particular game and mechanics at the practice table and hit balls until you hear them rolling in your sleep..... That makes you get better...

After you have the hours in and you think you have made improvements, MATCH UP.... I don't care if it's gambling, playing in a tournament or playing someone free sets as long as they are your equal or better and they have that on the line to lose and you have the desire to move up past them.

The match ups are where you see if you actually built a solid foundation or you built a house of cards. If the house of cards doesn't fall down, Match up again. Higher Stakes, Bigger tournaments, Longer sets for free with added internal pressure of not letting em get to 5 going to 7 or something like that. Keep raising the match up level until your foundations start to shake.

When you add enough pressure through the match ups you will see the flaws in your armor and you will have to go back to the practice table and address the issues. It may be certain shots you found out you miss under pressure. It may be your kicks and jumps are too weak. Your break needs work.. Your stroke fails you... If it's a weakness you are going to see it.
Address the issues and then you have to match up again to see if it's corrected. It's a viscous cycle. A cycle some people don't have the stomach for because you are gonna get bloody.

The match ups won't make you a better player all by themselves. What they do is to test the metal that you built your game out of.

I am pretty damn sure no one is going to go from the practice table to winning the US Open. The Filipinos have some idea on this, they expect to lose 100times before they can be a champion. If you think it's the losing that is the teacher here it's not. You take your loss and you go back to the practice tables and you fix whatever it was that beat you.

That's the hard part for lots of people. Most people offer up excuses as to what happened and why they lost. They refuse to take a serious look at what beat them so they end up sitting at a certain plateau for most of their lives.
Click to expand...


What he said! That's exactly what I was trying to say. It is the competition that brings out the best in us (or worst), but it is the time at the practice table that works out the kinks. If you want to work out the kinks while gambling then have at it. For me, I follow The Renfro's template.
 
I suppose it varies depending on the person. Some people might be super motivated and have a strong will to win, even with nothing on the line.

For me, I want something on the line. When it's just for fun, or even for a small bet, I don't bring my best game. Or I bring it for a few games and then lose interest/fade.
 
Gambling and Tournaments only help you focus more because there is something at stake.
Focus is needed to become a better player. How many of us can play by oursleves and run out most of the time while no one is watching? Most of us can make the shots, but can you make them while you are playing someone? That takes focus and dicipline. The pros all have the focus and dicipline to do the same shots over and over. Thats what makes a great player, making the shots consistantly.
 
BasementDweller said:
What he said! That's exactly what I was trying to say. It is the competition that brings out the best in us (or worst), but it is the time at the practice table that works out the kinks. If you want to work out the kinks while gambling then have at it. For me, I follow The Renfro's template.
Click to expand...

BD;

I think you had your mind made up from the start, which is fine. But, I believe gambling helps improve your game substantially.

You only need to go as far as the front page on AZ to see the articles on the mental aspect of the game. Practice, drills etc are great for the mechanics of the game. Matching up, as Renfro suggested, is also good if you can find that quality of player that will spend the time with you for nothing.

But you don't get the mental toughness without significant practice on the mental side of the game. Getting into the zone, and staying there. Think of Chris B., aren't many tougher for a buck. Playing for something on a regular basis teaches you to reach down and find that place that you need to be to win. Trying hard in a fun set will not. The perfect example is the easy shot we all miss, especially after just making a tough one. We lose our mental game, and jump up and miss the easy shot. You don't need practice to make that shot, its the mental lapse that gets you. Gambling helps condition you mentally to not lose your focus.

I believe controlling the mental part of the game is a significant improvement worth attaining. Think how good you would play if you never missed that easy shot. Short tournament races don't get you there, and either does fun pool.

BTW, strategy also changes as the stakes increase, which is also an improvement, especially in 1P.
 
Neil said:
It seems like a number of you don't understand why gambling can make you a better player. To truly get the cash, you are going to match up to have the best of it.

What really makes the difference, is the MOTIVATION to do your best. For many, that means money. Not enough to go broke, but enough that it is going to sting a little when you lose.
Click to expand...

Gambling certainly increases the pressure on you to play your best. However, when you lose the bet especially a large bet, one has to wonder what was actually accomplished.

Consider, for example, that Gabe Owen recently lost 40K of his and his backer's money playing Dippy Dave in one pocket. Is Gabe a better player for the experience? Perhaps, but the bottom line is he and his backers are out 40K.

While trying to make Dippy look like a chump, Gabe is now another notch on Dippy's totem pole. There's a very expensive lesson to be learned here. :cool:
 
Last edited:
Fact or fiction

When you gamble, does the person who beats you show you anything?
You will undoubtedly see them shoot shots you don't know and win your money , but you could watch a video and learn the same shots for free.
One thing for sure, if you gamble.....no one in the pool room will ever show you anything.
Why would they, you are a fish.
I gambled most of my life and I won and lost, the only thing that makes you better is practice, with practice comes confidence and with confidence comes winning. Play in tournaments to get pressure , they are much tougher to overcome than just 1 guy.
Also, 1 last piece of advice, if the guy you are playing is chirping and having fun , joking with the rail and it's a big party, pack up your stuff, you are in a trap 99% of the time.
Gambling when you are an established player is one thing , gambling to learn to play is something propigated from 150 years ago so that con men didn't have to work.
 
Gambling makes you better

Gambling isn't what makes you better, but it is a way to confirm what you know and what you can do. As stated by the last poster it also hleps assure that the opponent is giving his best.

Nothing tells you as much about your game or how you rate versus others that a 4+ hour grind with an opponent. However it's done, in multiple sets or a long "ahead race" that type of competition cannot be duplicated in a tournament.

I gamble for first place plus money so many nights at these weekly events, before the tournament event starts. Get knocked out first round....good.... more time to gamble up. I like nothing more than putting something I've perfected in practice into use in a money match. That's why I play the game.

Not everybody has the heart to gamble up, that's okay. Some won't put themselves to the test and others only play when they get the nuts. I think the pool hall can be the best casino in the world. You name the game, the spot, the bet and you control the outcome. What's better than that?? Better than a game of chance with a house advantage.

There's alot to consider though when picking opponents, the locksmithing ect... Only play those who will pay as well as they take your money, to do otherwise is foolish. I play minimu 3 sets or agree to one and done ahead of time. None of this quitting because you are ahead crap.
 
Gambling makes you a better player.

It can also make you a "broker" player. :grin:
 
There are ways to motivate yourself on the practice table.

Practice for an hour, if you miss more than X number of balls during that hour, no sex with the missus that night :grin:
 
Just on the Tournaments v Gambling argument

I don't know about where you guys live, but there aren't tournaments every week let alone every night. With a small wager, you can get a pressure match any night of the week (or day). If you only wait to play in tournaments, it might be 2-3 times a month only.

As others have said, the wager doesn't have to be big. I often play for the tab (table hire costs plus drinks we have both put on the tab).

And if you are playing someone weaker, you can give them a handicap, play someone stronger, get a handicap.

There is actually a lot of pressure playing someone weaker, because you expect and are expected to win.
 
There are plenty of examples in Pro sport of talented athletes which had the skill but not the mental game early on their career, but through regular tournament play, because mentally tough

Agassi and Federer stand out as examples to me. In the early part of their careers, they lost regularly to less talented players.

Pool is a game where when you reach a certain level, it is possible to beat and be beaten by any player of the same level, especially in short races. That is why the mental game is so important.
 
Evidence: How often do CHAMPIONS come out of league play ? Hardly any. How many come from money players or open class tournament play ( the desire to win $ ) ? MOST of them. Serious pool rooms and serious action cultivate serious play. They bring out your inner champion when you come up around this higher level of play.:wink:
 
Fact or Fiction

I need to restate what my first post had in part.
I should have said that there are people who enjoy gambling and make as fair a game as possible, {everyone wants to have a slight edge , no problem}and sometimes win sometimes lose. If that is you, then I have no problem with that. I no longer gamble, that is a personal choice.
I also understand playing a great player for a reasonable amount for the privilege of saying you played them and to see what it is like to play someone of that calibre.
There is nothing wrong with a fair game.
That is a game where either one of you could win, that both of you have the money to pay off if you lose and that if you lose you will pay and not have to be chased down.
The people I was speaking of are the ones who play the 5 ball better than someone and they give them the 7 or 8 ball.
The people who dog every new kid in the pool room to play and if they ever lose they don't pay.
All the low life bed bugs that hang around, never spend a dime except the few dollars in time it takes them to rob somebody, and they ruin poolrooms all over this country by running off people on their first or second visit.
I can't understand why room owners allow them, from a business standpoint it seems suicidal.
The last time I played was a fine example, two guys bantered back and forth about playing each other for 10 dollars. One of them was 2 or 3 or maybe more balls better than the other guy, they ended up playing and the weaker guy got killed . He asked to adjust after 1 game and the other guy says no way. Then they argued for an hour or more making it unenjoyable for everyone else in the room.
$10.00 and thats the scenario about 90% of the time I have seen, is it worth it?
 
gambling

I once played a guy in a casual $20 8 ball game. He let's me shoot his stripe ball and foul after he broke and made his first shot, then missed while my back was turned talking to a mutual friend. Then he calls foul, knowing full well that I didn't know he was stripes. I quit him, paid him off at 1-0 in a race to 4. That was the best $20 I ever spent. I will never play this scum again, period. Life's too short to play with jerks.

You have to make it abundantly clear what you will and won't tolerate. Sharking and slow pay will not be tolerated. Some people deserve your respect and others don't. I like beating the later type all the more, making them pay as they go.
 
I think alot of people fail to see the true benefits of playing for money.The match you are playing (and gambling on) is not where you see the results.

A great many things contribute to a person improving:
practice,coaching,competition,improved confidence,improving your game knowledge,and knowing the TRUTH about your own abilities.When you have pressure on you all the facets of your game may come to the surface,especially in a long match.Often after a long session of playing sets I have a better understanding of where my game is at(when I'm playing at peak for much of the session).After the match I usually see multiple things to work on.

This past weekend I played some sets with an old friend for about 4 hrs,I got pretty loose on him and won easily.But after the session I noted that my safety play could have been much better,as well as my break,and a few times I played very poor patterns during a run out.

To get better you need to know the real truth about where your game is,pressure situations tell you where you are at.
 
PoolSharkAllen said:
Gambling certainly increases the pressure on you to play your best. However, when you lose the bet especially a large bet, one has to wonder what was actually accomplished.

Consider, for example, that Gabe Owen recently lost 40K of his and his backer's money playing Dippy Dave in one pocket. Is Gabe a better player for the experience? Perhaps, but the bottom line is he and his backers are out 40K.

While trying to make Dippy look like a chump, Gabe is now another notch on Dippy's totem pole. There's a very expensive lesson to be learned here. :cool:
Click to expand...

That lesson may not be over yet though. Gabe is seasoned and will get over this pretty quickly!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top