Fish eyes.

DanO

DanO

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Any tips for eliminating fish eyes on sneaky pete prongs before spraying? I buy my four pointers pre fabricated. The problem is those little 1/8” long glue voids that don’t fill on your first clear session. I end up sanding and clearing again to eliminate 75%, then repeating a third to get them perfect.

I seal my blanks with 20 minute epoxy but it won’t penetrate the problem. I’ve tried applying the 20 minute epoxy and wrapping the cue with cling wrap prior to my last turn with limited success. It just masks the voids and there they are after turning again. I’m comfortable with my sealer but it is what it is. Maybe it’s time for a change?

SG fills the voids but under light you can see a faint clouded white. I don’t like it.

I’ve been spraying Deltron PPG DC3000 for like 5 years now. I haven’t thinned it to see if that helps but that’s next unless someone slaps me along side the head.
 
fisheye is usually from something clinging to the surface ie: oil, silicone, etc. is this what you are having a problem with or is it just at the seams of the points?
 
Dano send me your mailing address & I'll send you a sample of my BLACK HEART SANDING PREP. If you use it pryer to final sanding, it will make all of those little torn fibers, stand up. Then when you do your final sanding, there is no fibers left to create a void in the finish...JER
 
DanO said:
Any tips for eliminating fish eyes on sneaky pete prongs before spraying? I buy my four pointers pre fabricated. The problem is those little 1/8” long glue voids that don’t fill on your first clear session. I end up sanding and clearing again to eliminate 75%, then repeating a third to get them perfect.

I seal my blanks with 20 minute epoxy but it won’t penetrate the problem. I’ve tried applying the 20 minute epoxy and wrapping the cue with cling wrap prior to my last turn with limited success. It just masks the voids and there they are after turning again. I’m comfortable with my sealer but it is what it is. Maybe it’s time for a change?

SG fills the voids but under light you can see a faint clouded white. I don’t like it.

I’ve been spraying Deltron PPG DC3000 for like 5 years now. I haven’t thinned it to see if that helps but that’s next unless someone slaps me along side the head.
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When you have voids to fill in the points, try this method. When you are at the finish turned point and begin final sanding save the dust and wood from your final sanding. Mix it with some epoxy and fill the voids and let it dry and sand it smooth and it will hide the void and blend.
 
Dano,

A heap of schellac before you air sand and then press in epoxy that is 100 degrees into any visible voids before you put on your layers of epoxy on. I use G5.

Make sure you use an automotive shop safe solvent before you spray and quick tac cloth wipe. Ban any cans of silocone spray from your shop. Also keep your booth and room at 80 degrees plus. After I turn off my vent blower I close my 12 inch vent damper valve and turn on a 1500 watt electric heater keeping the booth at 80 degrees while each coat flashes so cold outside air does not migrate into the booth.

Also make sure the cue in the same temp as the any coating before applications.

That works for me.

Rick
 
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Dan; are you wiping the Q down with a degreaser just before you spray? (I use mineral spirits & spray it while it's still wet from the thinner)...JER
 
Windex is fine as a degreaser, we used it all the time prepping cars(at least 2 a week..no fisheyes) for paint and I use it before my epoxy and before and between finish coats.

Can you post a pic? 1/8th void has me perplexed.
 
Voids

Not a pro here but do a lot and still learning..But would it not be easier to get the blanks built better to start with, with no glue voids? .... Not bashing just asking :withstupid:
 
CrukedStick said:
Not a pro here but do a lot and still learning..But would it not be easier to get the blanks built better to start with, with no glue voids? .... Not bashing just asking :withstupid:
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Very much easier said than done. Almost every trapper blank I've ever purchased have had this problem somewhere. It sometimes also happens when I build H/S cues and I fill the pockets full of epoxy and also cover the points in epoxy. I usually don't have much of a problem filling them however.

Dick
 
voids

rhncue said:
Very much easier said than done. Almost every trapper blank I've ever purchased have had this problem somewhere. It sometimes also happens when I build H/S cues and I fill the pockets full of epoxy and also cover the points in epoxy. I usually don't have much of a problem filling them however.

Dick
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I am glad I asked, now when I get around to buying blanks I won't be so quick as to call them junk..;)
 
Dan, are you talking about gaps on the points that don't have any glue filling them, so they just keep sucking up the clear? Or are you talking about voides where the clear just doesn't stick, creating an orange peel looking effect?

If it is just the gaps near the points from a less than perfect blank, I do like Craig said and mix some dust with 5 minute epoxy and fill them up.

If it is the fish eyes or orange peel where the finish just doesn't want to adhere on little spots...I don't know. I get it sometimes and sometimes I don't. I don't know if it is dirt/oil or temperature variances in the wood vs the finish. It drives me nuts though. I always wipe the wood down with thinner and don't touch it with my fingers, so I'm not sure why it happens sometimes. It is pretty much one of the leading reasons I hate finishing cues though.
 
My mistake on calling the problem a fish eye. Sorry for the confusion. This is not being caused by any contaminates left on the cue prior to spraying. It is a glue gap when the prongs are forced into the forearm. I'm then having limited success filling the open glue gap prior to final clearing. My clear pools around it instead of flowing in and covering.

Maybe I'll try putting some epoxy in my microwave to raise the temp before I seal it again tonight. If that works I will try the dust mixing idea on my next one while it is still over sized.

I have to play leagues tonight. I'm planning on spraying the problem cue tomorrow night. Not my first rodeo with this problem and I see a few spots that I'm pretty sure will give me the same lame results if my second epoxy seal coat does not wick in. I'll take pics after my clear hardens tomorrow night.

I've purchased blanks from 3 different suppliers with the same results. You are going to see voids on something. I think it's just the nature of the process of how they are made, no matter who your supplier is. You buy a $40 blank, you get a $40 blank. If this should not be the case then someone needs to point me in the right direction.

Thanks for all the fast responses.
 
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For the glue gaps I just use the dust and 5 minute epoxy because it isn't a structural issue. I put it in the lathe at finish size and lay the epoxy on just thick enough to cover the gaps in the point that is top up. I only put it on the visible gaps to minimize sanding once dry. I let it set up enough that it won't run, rotate the next point top up and do it again. The next day I just hand sand the epoxy build up back to flush. It is good to spray after that. I'm sure there are faster ways but that's how I do it.
 
I use a slow-set, thin viscosity epoxy so it completely fills the void. Only filling the surface may create finish problems in the future. That seam can and will move a little due to temp or humidity changes causing the finish to lift.

Its easier to fill if you do it before the final pass and you may have to apply the epoxy a few different times as it runs into the seam.
 
Full Splice gaps.

I had those.
Thought the guy didn't use enough glue so had gaps between the handle and forearm..
I used thin superglue, as it just runs down into the gap, let it dry and repeat till the gap is filled.. :cool:

Alton < Not a Cuemaker..I used superglue.. ;)
 
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I ended up using a slow set 20 min epoxy 4 times, sanding in between before the gaps fully filled. The clear turned out perfect. Thought I had her licked but here we go again. This one I’ve tried 20 minute twice and still gaps. For the heck of it I mixed up a very small batch of my PPG DC3000 that I spray and wiped that on with a glove. Thought I might have been on to something but I’m still stumped. I’ve done SG before but I don’t like the milky looking results especially with ebony. Any other ideas out there? These gaps are vey very small. You can only see them when you turn the cue under a bright light. The big problem comes when I spray it the clear will pool around them.
 

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fish eyes

I don't refinsh cues but I do auto body and paint work for about 40 years
fish eyes can be a problem in the finish aswell. I have found out over the years that the air source can cause a problem. If any impurities from the
air system get in air line it can cause fish eyes. Most shops as my self will
only up date when equipment won't work any more. My compresor is over
20 years old with that much use some thing has got to wear out like the rings and will let contaminates into the air lines. I have had good luck with my compresor works fine and has produced clean air a long time, but just to make sure, I do have a dryer in line that will clean up the air to a good standard. I know spraying cues is different. when I spray my first coat
of what ever it might be I start on a place that don't show a lot. like on one of the lower rear 1/4 panels to get a look at what could be a problem.
and can make adjustments if need be. I know a cue don't have a 1/4 panel. If my first coat of material is not laying down like it should, what ever it might be I will lighten up my spray on the gun control and will not wet the surface as much the first coat. Just to get a tack coat most of the time the tack coat will hold down a problem. I have many times put two light coats on before I wet it down to get the flow out I want. I do use a good wax and grease remover. Clean the surface before sanding,
If you sand before cleaning you can put the problem deeper in the product.What ever problem you can have with paint and other body repair
I have had it. Good luck with your cue work. john
 
Hi Dan,

Use heavy shellack before sanding then G5 at 90 degree temp and rub in hard with your finger to fill gaps.

The 20 minute stuff generally take longer than 20 and it can soak.

Good Luck,

Rick
 
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Dan; I think people are thrown off the track by your miss nameing these things "fisheyes". What you are talking about are "VOIDS" in the glue. Fisheyes are a problem stemming from the finish. If you are spraying your finish you will have to learn to FLOOD the area with the clear (without creating runs). Your 1st pass will seal the hole left by the lack of glue. Then after the 1st pass has dried, to where you can just barely leave a fingerprint, spray the area again. This pass should be slightly heavier, at that spot. Give it a minute or so to begin to set up & spray the whole Q again. After that pass has dried, repeat these steps. Let the Q dry overnight, sand & repeat...JER
 
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