For Jay and Cuetechasaurus

Easier to explain...

i have two theories about the "lucky" thing... the first is they don't really want to explain much about the winning, especially explaining it in english language, they don't have that much vocabulary.... another is these Pinoy-cueists gambles a lot... and whenever you win in gambling, its always feel-good to say you are lucky so you don't let your opponent think you are really a great player than he is... who knows he might play you next time thinking you could not be as lucky... :-)
 
BallBuster said:
i have two theories about the "lucky" thing... the first is they don't really want to explain much about the winning, especially explaining it in english language, they don't have that much vocabulary.... another is these Pinoy-cueists gambles a lot... and whenever you win in gambling, its always feel-good to say you are lucky so you don't let your opponent think you are really a great player than he is... who knows he might play you next time thinking you could not be as lucky... :-)
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LOLz...kinda like running 3 - 4 racks and saying "Huh, musta got lucky....probably won't happen again." :D
________
 
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Questions?

OK, to answer some questions about the match between me and Efren: I think it was at Pheasant Run, but not positive about that or the year. We're hill-hill and he shoots a thin cut shot at his pocket at warp speed and sends the cue ball into the wrong side of the stack. Before he does this I have an advantage in the lie of the balls; so you'd think that by crashing into the wrong side of the stack that he'd have to sell out but no, our stalwart not only doesn't leave me a shot-he totally locks me up.
I mean there's no safety, no offensive shot, no nothing and when guys who don't bet their own money do that to me I admit I hate it but it doesn't in any way mean that I dislike them. And yes, I'm probably gonna say they were lucky.
Talking and thinking about this match gets me to recalling other interesting shots and situations. Maybe I'll do a DVD with just shots of the past. I can think of 5 or 6 just of Efren creations, one of which a pool-smart old-timer friend of mine called "The worst beat I've ever seen." He's right. It practically defies description.
 
Like Efren?

I'm going to address a couple of the previous threads. #1 is, like Efren? Of course, he is probably the sweetest most gracious champion we have ever had. Plus, I like all the Filipinos, Jose Parica most of all. And they like me. They have always been friendly and respectful to me. Probably because of my relationships with Effie and Jose. #2 Grady and I hardly ever agree, but as sick as it may sound, I too think that Efren's luck borders on the supernatural. I've tried to view it as objectively as possible, but I still am of the same opinion that as great as he plays, his luck is phenomenal. I will add another tid-bit however, the second luckiest player I ever seen was Luther Lassiter. Coincidence? Maybe it just goes with the territory. In my own experience the better I shot, the luckier I got. So maybe that explains it. #3 I dont really recall "chortling" at Grady playing the Filipinos. Especially since I never had a financial interest in any of those matches. If I did, I'm sure I probably had a selfish, sinister motive, maybe to heat him up and have him get out of line with me some kind of way. If that was the case it was strictly business not personal.

the Beard
 
Grady compliments Efren

I watched an Accu-stats 1P tape of the 1999 Derby City match between Efren and Nick Varner. Grady and Billy Incardone were commentating. Grady was very complimentary toward Efren, and praised his expertise-- even during the early games when Efren's game was way off.

Doc
 
Grady said:
OK, to answer some questions about the match between me and Efren: I think it was at Pheasant Run, but not positive about that or the year. We're hill-hill and he shoots a thin cut shot at his pocket at warp speed and sends the cue ball into the wrong side of the stack. Before he does this I have an advantage in the lie of the balls; so you'd think that by crashing into the wrong side of the stack that he'd have to sell out but no, our stalwart not only doesn't leave me a shot-he totally locks me up.
I mean there's no safety, no offensive shot, no nothing and when guys who don't bet their own money do that to me I admit I hate it but it doesn't in any way mean that I dislike them. And yes, I'm probably gonna say they were lucky.
Talking and thinking about this match gets me to recalling other interesting shots and situations. Maybe I'll do a DVD with just shots of the past. I can think of 5 or 6 just of Efren creations, one of which a pool-smart old-timer friend of mine called "The worst beat I've ever seen." He's right. It practically defies description.
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In honor of this thread, I had some San Miguel beer and watched the Accu-Stats tape of you and Efren from the legends of one-pocket tournament. (I know, the sacrifices I make for this forum :) ) Buddy Hall and Nick Varner were commentating.

Based on my calculations, he had three lucky rolls to your one. Nick and Buddy thought two other shots of Efren's were lucky, but I watched them a couple of times and am convinced that they were difficult shots that he managed to execute and got away with...which might be the same as a lucky roll, but at least seemed like he was trying to do what he did.

For the record, there was no negative body language or any other indication that either of these players held each other in anything but the utmost respect. And it was a LONG match.

Thanks for all you add to this forum.

RC
 
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sixpack said:
In honor of this thread, I had some San Miguel beer and watched the Accu-Stats tape of you and Efren from the legends of one-pocket tournament. (I know, the sacrifices I make for this forum :) ) Buddy Hall and Nick Varner were commentating.

Based on my calculations, he had three lucky rolls to your one. Nick and Buddy thought two other shots of Efren's were lucky, but I watched them a couple of times and am convinced that they were difficult shots that he managed to execute and got away with...which might be the same as a lucky roll, but at least seemed like he was trying to do what he did.

For the record, there was no negative body language or any other indication that either of these players held each other in anything but the utmost respect. And it was a LONG match.

Thanks for all you add to this forum.

RC
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Sixpack, the match in question here is not that one. Its an after hours match that was shot single camera only, no commentary. The table is a gold crown and it looks like the setup from the Willards tournament that you can see in an old match accustats has with Buddy hall vs George breedlove. This match goes 4-3 whereas the one you are referring to is 4-1 (1998 LO1P).
 
Grady said:
...Efren's luck, despite his really being a great player, transcends that of normal human beings and enters the realm of the supernatural...
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I won't be the first to say this, but, Grady- you really have a knack for our language. That is a great sentence!
 
Bill, I don't know if Jose likes Efren or not but it is unlikely that he dislikes Efren. If there is anything there it COULD be some jealousy but even that is a matter of perspective. I have seen many poolplayers make negative comments about another pool player's abilities/records etc in the heat of battle or shortly thereafter.

Everyone that is a competitor is capable of expressing some bittnerness right after an important loss to another competitor. Sometimes THAT bitterness is directed at why the other competitor won and is just an emotional outburst and has little to do with how one actually feels about another person.
JoeyA

BillPorter said:
Let me admit right off that I have NO REAL INFORMATION on who likes or dislikes whom, but exercising my right to free speech, I'd just like to ask forum members to tell me one thing; who DOESN'T like Efren? I understand that Jose Parica has expressed a bit of bitterness at times about all the fame and adulation Efren has garnered and has stated on several occasions that he (Parica) holds a winning record in matches against Efren, so maybe he doesn't like him. The few times I have interacted with Efren, he was as friendly and sweet natured as you could ask for.
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uwate said:
Sixpack, the match in question here is not that one. Its an after hours match that was shot single camera only, no commentary. The table is a gold crown and it looks like the setup from the Willards tournament that you can see in an old match accustats has with Buddy hall vs George breedlove. This match goes 4-3 whereas the one you are referring to is 4-1 (1998 LO1P).
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Yes, I know. I was commenting on the general comment that Efren gets more luck than anybody else.

Cheers,
RC
 
freddy the beard said:
I'm going to address a couple of the previous threads. #1 is, like Efren? Of course, he is probably the sweetest most gracious champion we have ever had. Plus, I like all the Filipinos, Jose Parica most of all. And they like me. They have always been friendly and respectful to me. Probably because of my relationships with Effie and Jose. #2 Grady and I hardly ever agree, but as sick as it may sound, I too think that Efren's luck borders on the supernatural. I've tried to view it as objectively as possible, but I still am of the same opinion that as great as he plays, his luck is phenomenal. I will add another tid-bit however, the second luckiest player I ever seen was Luther Lassiter. Coincidence? Maybe it just goes with the territory. In my own experience the better I shot, the luckier I got. So maybe that explains it. #3 I dont really recall "chortling" at Grady playing the Filipinos. Especially since I never had a financial interest in any of those matches. If I did, I'm sure I probably had a selfish, sinister motive, maybe to heat him up and have him get out of line with me some kind of way. If that was the case it was strictly business not personal.

the Beard
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So now we know what it takes to be a great player. LUCK! Righhhttttttttt.
Efren's been getting the rolls in One Pocket for almost 20 years and Lassiter got all the rolls in 9-Ball for 30 years. Pretty fortunate fellows.

Of course when Effie is cutting those balls backward from off the end rail and Lassiter wasn't missing anything for days, it was more good fortune. I saw Luther play Straight Pool many, many matches and I could count on one hand all the shots he ever missed. And spot you a couple of fingers. To this day, I have never seen anyone remotely close to Efren in his ability to run balls when they are all down table.

All kidding aside, I will agree with Freddie on one important point. The good players get the rolls. It has to do with the choice of shots and how they execute them.
 
Better players are also at the table MORE. They get more rolls because they're at the table making more shots. JMHO.
 
About luck...

have you guys never heard a saying "more you practice, luckier you get" and if you have, have you really understood it?


And that's about it.
 
gulfportdoc said:
I watched an Accu-stats 1P tape of the 1999 Derby City match between Efren and Nick Varner. Grady and Billy Incardone were commentating. Grady was very complimentary toward Efren, and praised his expertise-- even during the early games when Efren's game was way off.

Doc
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I was thinking the same thing. I have some Efren/Archer matches and I never heard him say anything out of line. In fact all I heard too was complimentary...like Efren would scratch his head and Grady would say something like (and I am paraphrasing) " uh oh Efrens scatching the back of his head and when he scratches his head that usually means he is going to come up with some incredible shot" And then Efren proceeds to make some crazy kick and Grady just says "I am speechless. I just dont know what else to say":D
 
Ok, I retract my statement. Grady does not-not like Efren, he is just bitter towards him because he thinks he is lucky. I apologize for not being able to distinguish between an obvious bitterness and dislike stemmed from rivalry. You say Efren has supernatural luck, most other players say Efren is just really good, or they say that 'the better you play, the luckier you get'- a phrase which I might remind you doesn't actually mean what it states.

I just found it somewhat annoying that we were talking about Efren when he first came to the USA in another thread, and you (Grady) had to chime in and remind everyone that YOU won the one pocket event, and that YOU have beaten Efren playing even. It reminds me of people throwing a birthday party for some kid and another kid starts whining because nobody is celebrating his birthday, which is a few months later. We all apologize you weren't getting enough attention in that thread, even though it wasn't about you at all. To make ammends, I propose that from now on, we all must at least mention one of Grady's many accomplishments in each and every thread we post, even if it's just about cue tips. :rolleyes:
 
cuetechasaurus said:
Ok, I retract my statement. Grady does not-not like Efren, he is just bitter towards him because he thinks he is lucky. I apologize for not being able to distinguish between an obvious bitterness and dislike stemmed from rivalry. You say Efren has supernatural luck, most other players say Efren is just really good, or they say that 'the better you play, the luckier you get'- a phrase which I might remind you doesn't actually mean what it states.

I just found it somewhat annoying that we were talking about Efren when he first came to the USA in another thread, and you (Grady) had to chime in and remind everyone that YOU won the one pocket event, and that YOU have beaten Efren playing even. It reminds me of people throwing a birthday party for some kid and another kid starts whining because nobody is celebrating his birthday, which is a few months later. We all apologize you weren't getting enough attention in that thread, even though it wasn't about you at all. To make ammends, I propose that from now on, we all must at least mention one of Grady's many accomplishments in each and every thread we post, even if it's just about cue tips. :rolleyes:
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WOW! I figured out how the reputation works. I didn't know there was a ranking. If you click on "Member List" at the top of the page and then click on "Reputation" you can see how all the members rank. For example GRADY is ranked around 32 out of 4806. It cracked me up when I looked at who has the worst reputation at 4806 and it is cuetechasaurus. That would make him the most hated poster which makes sense. Maybe the moderator could do a ban on the most hated poster once every few weeks, kind of like the GONG show.

Wayne
 
I propose from now on we don't personally attack other users on the forums.

So, try not to do that when you come back from your week away from the forums.

Mike

cuetechasaurus said:
To make ammends, I propose that from now on, we all must at least mention one of Grady's many accomplishments in each and every thread we post, even if it's just about cue tips. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
 
A couple of comments:

Efren and Jose Parica are very friendly towards each other in person, I observed them once at Hollywood Billiards, spending a long time talking and laughing together for no reason other than they enjoyed each others company. I had heard the rumors to the contrary prior to this but watching them together dispelled the rumors.

A person with a very positive outlook in any aspect of life or games will have good things happen much more often that a person with a negative outlook. Conversely, a person with a negative outlook will have a lot more bad things happen. Efren may have the most positive outlook of anyone on a pool table which might explain some of the luck factor.

Wayne (WOW, he GONGED pretty quick LOL)
 
Grady also jokes about how there is a school in Mexico that teaches players how to luck balls in, get all the rolls...

I don't take any of this Grady-doesn't-like Efren stuff seriously. Every pool player remembers the lucky shots others have had against them. At the $$ level Grady gambles at, those memories are probably hard to forget.

Efren vs Parica?

Didn't Efren say Parica was his idol, or at least favorite player, when he learned to play pool? I doubt Parica has any problem with Efren, he just gets tired of hearing that Efren is much better than him. Efren definately has won bigger events the last ten years and OWNS one pocket these days, but the 20 years of Jose being maybe the top money player in the world makes a case for Jose being right up there.

People forget some of Parica's victories like the Roanoke one pocket tourney where he won 15 out of 16 games his last three matches to win the tournement. I think he also won one of the biggest prize money tourneys in Asia years ago- maybe late 80's where 40 or 50 grand was a huge payout for pool.
 
i have an opinion on luck based on another sport.

In tournament poker the belief is simple: Great players put themselves in a position to get lucky at the right times.

Is a little roll lucky sometimes? sure. But the great ones get lucky when it counts.

Me, i don't get lucky. :)
 
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