What percentage is Deflection in the overall knowledge of becoming a skilled player?
How important is mastering deflection?
- Thread starter Tom In Cincy
- Start date
PunchOut said:
I agree. It's just one of countless important aspects of the game. I fail to see the benefit of quantifying it....especially when other aspects (such as English) are completely useless without it.
(just my opinion, sorry if that sounded negative)
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OK, but there is a lot more to the game of pocket billiards than just making the shot.
I believe that after making the shot, there is still a lot left to becoming a winner. It takes a lot more skill to manage the table layout, know strategy, including cue ball control and know what to do and when, just to name a few other skills than just mastering deflection.
Becoming a better player by just Hitting center ball and using the rails and speed can also help the beginner and novice players.
Don't you agree?
I believe that after making the shot, there is still a lot left to becoming a winner. It takes a lot more skill to manage the table layout, know strategy, including cue ball control and know what to do and when, just to name a few other skills than just mastering deflection.
Becoming a better player by just Hitting center ball and using the rails and speed can also help the beginner and novice players.
Don't you agree?
PunchOut said:
You don't have to know a lot about deflection to know how to pocket a ball.
I want to know (hence the poll) by LD shaft owners and regular shaft owners, how important knowing deflection among the other learned skills are in the order of knowledge to become a better player .
LD shafts seem to help players be more confident in making shots, but after making a ball there is just more to winning. How much?
LD shafts and knowing about Deflection IMO is around 15-20% at the very most.
I want to know (hence the poll) by LD shaft owners and regular shaft owners, how important knowing deflection among the other learned skills are in the order of knowledge to become a better player .
LD shafts seem to help players be more confident in making shots, but after making a ball there is just more to winning. How much?
LD shafts and knowing about Deflection IMO is around 15-20% at the very most.
nathandumoulin said:
I chose 33.3 %
I chose 33.3% for a couple of reasons. For high level play, it is somewhat necessary to understand and to be able to counteract deflection and squirt; however, it is possible to play at a really high level by focusing on speed control and knowledge of angles and in that case you don't need to counteract the effects of deflection at all.
There are some things that require the ability to effectively use inside or outside english and not just follow and draw, but it's going to depend on what game you are playing as to how often they come up.
In a game like eightball and nineball, you can get away without using it as much as in a game like one pocket.
In a game like one pocket, if you don't know how to use inside and outside english, to throw bank shots, kill the CB off the rail etc... You will NOT be able to play it at as high a level as someone who does.
In nineball, most of the time, you can play safe or go multiple rails using angles and speed control and still play at or close to or even above someone who has squirt and deflection mastered.
Jaden
I chose 33.3% for a couple of reasons. For high level play, it is somewhat necessary to understand and to be able to counteract deflection and squirt; however, it is possible to play at a really high level by focusing on speed control and knowledge of angles and in that case you don't need to counteract the effects of deflection at all.
There are some things that require the ability to effectively use inside or outside english and not just follow and draw, but it's going to depend on what game you are playing as to how often they come up.
In a game like eightball and nineball, you can get away without using it as much as in a game like one pocket.
In a game like one pocket, if you don't know how to use inside and outside english, to throw bank shots, kill the CB off the rail etc... You will NOT be able to play it at as high a level as someone who does.
In nineball, most of the time, you can play safe or go multiple rails using angles and speed control and still play at or close to or even above someone who has squirt and deflection mastered.
Jaden
Mastering deflection
You just can't become a very good player without understanding deflection and its relationship to distance and power. There are just too many shots that come up requiring complete understanding of deflection.
You just can't become a very good player without understanding deflection and its relationship to distance and power. There are just too many shots that come up requiring complete understanding of deflection.
I agree, to get better it is a basic requirement to understand and be able to execute shots.
IMO, this, alone, does not guarantee you become a very good player. It is only a percentage of what is needed. Why do you think it is 50%?
IMO, this, alone, does not guarantee you become a very good player. It is only a percentage of what is needed. Why do you think it is 50%?
TWOFORPOOL said:
Tom In Cincy said:
Apparently I have misunderstood your poll question. Without understanding deflection you can't become a very good player so to me it is 100% important.
To me its like asking how good a person could play without a pool cue? Without complete understanding of deflection with regard to distance and speed its impossible to become a very good player.
If I understand the question correctly, you are wanting to know what percentage of your overall skill should deflection compromise?
I would say a pretty low percentage. There is no one skill that should use up your entire knowledge base. Pool is based largely on knowledge so there is a lot to master. Each individual skill is important, essential even. But I wouldn't sacrifice my understanding of throw, or speed control, or angle measurement, or any other skill just to understand deflection better.
I would say the largest percentage of your skill should probably have to do with your stroke. But even it should not be the majority of what you know (majority as in half +1).
I may not have interpreted the question correctly...
I would say a pretty low percentage. There is no one skill that should use up your entire knowledge base. Pool is based largely on knowledge so there is a lot to master. Each individual skill is important, essential even. But I wouldn't sacrifice my understanding of throw, or speed control, or angle measurement, or any other skill just to understand deflection better.
I would say the largest percentage of your skill should probably have to do with your stroke. But even it should not be the majority of what you know (majority as in half +1).
I may not have interpreted the question correctly...
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Tom In Cincy said:
Sorry Tom, I understand what your asking now (sometimes I don't see the forest thru the trees).
Of all the skills required to become a very good player (pocketing, shot selection, imagey, decisions, deflection, mental toughness, etc) I would say understanding deflection is around 5% of a players total playability and knowledge. Mental toughness is the highest which I believe is about 75%.
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PunchOut...Yep, you sure are missing something here. Deflection doesn't matter at all...unless you are shooting with sidespin, which is NOT necessary much of the time (almost never just to make the shot, and only part of the time, for position play).
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
PunchOut said:
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Mastering Deflection
Scott, do you think 10% - 15% of shots in 9 Ball reqire sidespin (including follow/draw with sidespin)? There seems to me to be alot of balls close enough to a rail that follow and draw alone will not sufficiently change the angle off a rail needed to play position. As you know there are other shots not close to a rail that would require need some sidespin. Since your a Master Instructor I would sincerely like to hear you opinion on this matter.
"Part of the time" is alot of shots! I would say in 9 Ball its around 10% - 15% of the shots IMO. Hard to break and run a rack when there could be 1 or 2 shots requiring some sidespin.Scott Lee said:
Scott, do you think 10% - 15% of shots in 9 Ball reqire sidespin (including follow/draw with sidespin)? There seems to me to be alot of balls close enough to a rail that follow and draw alone will not sufficiently change the angle off a rail needed to play position. As you know there are other shots not close to a rail that would require need some sidespin. Since your a Master Instructor I would sincerely like to hear you opinion on this matter.
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Knowledge? None. You don't have to know anything about squirt (deflection) in order to compensate for it effectively.
Skill? Lots. You must be able to compensate for squirt effectively or you won't be able to play even intermediate level pool.
I disagree with those who say that sidespin only needs to be used occasionally. The use of sidespin can be avoided, but it will mean getting somewhat worse shape and hitting somewhat harder on lots of shots, which can be a greater cost than the slightly reduced accuracy of learning to shoot with a little sidespin.
IMO, sidespin is a necessity and so being able to compensate for squirt (whether you know it or not) is a necessity. I don't know how to put a percentage on it; it's just required.
pj
chgo
I go along with PunchOut... being able to judge the deflection is omnipotent, I never use english, unless I have to, in order to get to the next ball or overcome a natural scratch. Without some idea of the cue balls deflection off line, my shotmaking would be in peril.
Good Luck in your game..
Good Luck in your game..
Talking 9-ball:
On the break, there should be no deflection.
When playing offense, as most shots can be hit with center ball, most shots don't have a deflection issue.
When playing defense, extremely few shots involve deflection.
Deflection matters, but it would be tough to argue that it makes up a significant portion of what a player needs to master to become a good player.
To me, stance, alignment, balance, arm position, follow through, speed control, pre-shot routine, tactical judgement, offsensive shot conceptualization, defensive shot conceptualization. equipment selection and maintnenance, and billiard knowledge combine to make up about 95% of the skill package needed to be a world class nine-ball player.
I voted for 10%, but I think it's even less.
On the break, there should be no deflection.
When playing offense, as most shots can be hit with center ball, most shots don't have a deflection issue.
When playing defense, extremely few shots involve deflection.
Deflection matters, but it would be tough to argue that it makes up a significant portion of what a player needs to master to become a good player.
To me, stance, alignment, balance, arm position, follow through, speed control, pre-shot routine, tactical judgement, offsensive shot conceptualization, defensive shot conceptualization. equipment selection and maintnenance, and billiard knowledge combine to make up about 95% of the skill package needed to be a world class nine-ball player.
I voted for 10%, but I think it's even less.