How many countries could beat USA at pool

[jrctherake]

So the bottom line, in my opinion, is that other countries produce better players on average at the higher levels is because they treat pool as a sport and train accordingly

^^^^^^^^^I agree.

Most all of the player "I KNOW IN PERSON" look at pool as a past time. I know several strong "A" to shortstop speed players that do not consider pool or billiards in general a sport. At most they consider training for a match is running a drill or three. Lol

In other countries they diet, exercise etc.......like other athletes do. Maybe not to the same extreme but they do acknowledge the fact that it matters and follow through.

And that is but a small part of the problem.

Rake

 

[iusedtoberich]

This one was at Channel Nine studio in Toronto...
....we all had a great time.
And Alain Martel came up with the shot of the show....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIn-ZA2R5oQ


But we still lost the contest....:banghead:

Ha ha... Is this the video that someone made a spoof of and the player started punching everyone? Maybe I dreamt that...???

 

[Knels]

This one was at Channel Nine studio in Toronto...
....we all had a great time.
And Alain Martel came up with the shot of the show....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIn-ZA2R5oQ


But we still lost the contest....:banghead:

Oh man that was a good one! Believe it or not he is still playing like a demon today, I seen him take apart Dany Normandin at the provincials 11-1, gave him only five shots the whole match. Kk man I never saw that one in Toronto, just the airbase one. Joey Cicero is the one to watch these days, apparently he only started playing when he was 18, made it to pro level today at 30ish. Charette is another, works as a tennis coach for a living. Young talent is there, maybe we need to see an Ontario/ Quebec pro team battle?

 

[pt109]

Oh man that was a good one! Believe it or not he is still playing like a demon today, I seen him take apart Dany Normandin at the provincials 11-1, gave him only five shots the whole match. Kk man I never saw that one in Toronto, just the airbase one. Joey Cicero is the one to watch these days, apparently he only started playing when he was 18, made it to pro level today at 30ish. Charette is another, works as a tennis coach for a living. Young talent is there, maybe we need to see an Ontario/ Quebec pro team battle?

Alain is one of my favorite players....cracked 400 at straight pool and a 147 at snooker.

Alain used to warm up at tournaments by playing straight pool...I never warm up...
...so often I would rack for him....he ran 100 every time I did.

 

[jokrswylde]

I was thinking about this topic today in regards to each country in the world putting together their 5 best players. How many countries, with their 5 best players, could potentially beat the US in a Mosconi Cup format?

1) Taiwan
2) Philippines
3) England
4) China
5) Germany
6) Canada possibly if they had Pagulayan, Morra, Klatt and two others?

Not trying to demean the US pool scene in any way, just curious on other peoples thoughts on this.

The key phrase here is "could potentially beat ", vs. Would likely beat/ should beat.

In a true mosconi rules world tournament, with lets say the 7 best players (2 alternates) from individual countries ( not continents) ,which countries would be favored over the U.S.


Another interesting idea... take 7 random people off the street, who do you like vs. The U S? How many other countries have as many random bar bangers who can run a rack or two?

 

[Oze147]

As marek said, Poland, Russia and the Netherlands have to be considered, since this countries could form a team with 5 strong players.

I think Germany doesn`t deserve a spot on the list, because after Filler, Souquet and Hohmann, there is a big gap to find two other strong players.

Actually this goes for most of the European countries. The two or three top players could compete with the US, but the depth isn`t there to form a 5 man team.

 

[greyghost]

As marek said, Poland, Russia and the Netherlands have to be considered, since this countries could form a team with 5 strong players.



I think Germany doesn`t deserve a spot on the list, because after Filler, Souquet and Hohmann, there is a big gap to find two other strong players.



Actually this goes for most of the European countries. The two or three top players could compete with the US, but the depth isn`t there to form a 5 man team.

Top German players

Thomas Engert
Oliver Ortmann
Thorsten Hohmann
Ralph Souquet
Josh filler

.....I’d bet....if that were my stable I honestly wouldn’t be worried about the sky falling down against America.

Often the euros are plus one just because they are breathing lol. They make good decisions and are methodical

We’re all guts and glory stuff mostly

To each his own


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[greyghost]

Top German players

Thomas Engert
Oliver Ortmann
Thorsten Hohmann
Ralph Souquet
Josh filler

.....I’d bet....if that were my stable I honestly wouldn’t be worried about the sky falling down against America.

Often the euros are plus one just because they are breathing lol. They make good decisions and are methodical

We’re all guts and glory stuff mostly

To each his own


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

,


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Oze147]

Top German players

Thomas Engert
Oliver Ortmann
Thorsten Hohmann
Ralph Souquet
Josh filler

.....I’d bet....if that were my stable I honestly wouldn’t be worried about the sky falling down against America.

Often the euros are plus one just because they are breathing lol. They make good decisions and are methodical

We’re all guts and glory stuff mostly

To each his own


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Engert doesn`t play anymore. (at least on professional level. Don´t know if he maybe still plays league matches in Germany.)
Ortmann is well past his prime. Don`t get me wrong, he is still a very good player and he still gets some good results every now and then, but he is not the first name that comes to my mind if I think about top players.

Germany still has some good players, but I don`t think that they can form a top team, at least not as strong as an US team or teams from China, Taiwan etc.

 

[westcoast]

As marek said, Poland, Russia and the Netherlands have to be considered, since this countries could form a team with 5 strong players.

I think Germany doesn`t deserve a spot on the list, because after Filler, Souquet and Hohmann, there is a big gap to find two other strong players.

Actually this goes for most of the European countries. The two or three top players could compete with the US, but the depth isn`t there to form a 5 man team.

Ortmann and engert are very good players or at least use to be- I don’t know if they play much any more.

Sorry- didn’t see somebody already posted on this

 

[Meucciplayer]

I don't see that many single European countries having more than a slight chance to win against a US team. Unless you scare the Americans off with boot camps etc. and provided you only pick the best without any strange requirements.

Some countries like the Netherlands have one outstanding player (Feijen) but you would have to have at least 4 out of 5. And that is where I can't see them winning. Van den Berg IMHO wasn't any better than the US average MC participant. So - Russia, yes, probably. The Netherlands and Poland, no. Germany - depending on who would be on the team besides Filler and Souquet. If they get Hohmann, they are a lot closer. Ortmann, I doubt he would still compete.

 

[marek]

Finland was number one last year European Champs medals. Came also second on team event. lost hill-hill deciding match...
5 really strong players. 5-10 more weaker pro speed players.
Also England is really strong. Spain top three is crazy strong.

England is mentioned by OP, Spain - i am not sure about 5 guys but i agree about top3 being super strong. As for Finland - Immonen and Makkonen are competitive with US top players, Siekkinen and Laaksonen are strong but even I can beat them,i dont think they would be ready for the challenge of US team. And I dont remember any other top finnish player atm,throw some names in to refresh my memory

 

[marek]

Hey Marek,

We had this conversation through pm not long ago. If we had that same conversation in open well, it would be some members that would not agree with us in the least.

We know what "most" of the problems are but nobody that matters cares and the average player has no clue.

Just like our pm conversations, I agree.

Rake

Yup true,after reading the whole thread i can tell some posters are really clueless/ignorant to the current state of pool in USA vs Europe...

 

[marek]

Agreed with the first four assuming you mean the UK (not just England). Germany, with Filler and Souquet, would be a very close match, but we'd be favored over Canada. Russia, with Gorst, Chinakhov, Stalev and two others would certainly give us a run for our money, but I see that as another very close match. Spain, with Alcaide and Sanchez-Ruiz would likely give us a run for our money, too.

More like Russia with Gorst, Stepanov, Chinakov, Lutsker and Dudanets btw that Russian team has almost beaten US team in their preparation for Mosconi Cup 2017..

 

[mikepage]

Yup true,after reading the whole thread i can tell some posters are really clueless/ignorant to the current state of pool in USA vs Europe...

These "just numbers" ought to provide some perspective. This is the top 5 players with 200+ games irrespective of whether the player is active now. No doubt in some of the counties there are players not on our radar that should be here.

 

[S.Vaskovskyi]

Yup true,after reading the whole thread i can tell some posters are really clueless/ignorant to the current state of pool in USA vs Europe...

100% agreed. For example only Poland which is not so big country in comparison with USA has such a strong field of players so many over there do not imagine. The main problems were already mentioned and tĥe most sad news for USA team... it will be a big surprise for me if it will change in the nearest future.
I haven't seen somebody mentioned Atlantic cup - very similar team tournament where the best european juniors compete with their american best youngsters. After all three cups if I remember correctly it was obvious european team has the players who deal much better with preasure. It is not surprising because as it was said the pool as a sport is organized much better in Europe and that makes young talents to become better players. Just one example... look how European championships for youth are organized each year and look in the eyes of those kids who have their dreams to come true. They are the future and they are very eager to get on the boat and the rivalry is so hard...

 

[Oze147]

Some countries like the Netherlands have one outstanding player (Feijen) but you would have to have at least 4 out of 5. And that is where I can't see them winning. Van den Berg IMHO wasn't any better than the US average MC participant. So - Russia, yes, probably. The Netherlands and Poland, no. Germany - depending on who would be on the team besides Filler and Souquet. If they get Hohmann, they are a lot closer. Ortmann, I doubt he would still compete.

When it comes to outstanding players, the US has quite the same situation with Shane as the only one, who really is an outstanding player.
The US overpowers most European nations, when it comes to the players they can put in at #3,4,5.

And I think people underestimate the Polish team. So far they might not have a world beater like Kaci, Ouschan or Filler, but besides Russia they might be the only nation, that can put together a team of five nearly equally strong players.

...and for the rest...Greece, Austria, Germany...they all would struggle do fill up their 5th spot or maybe even 4th spot.
But I guess European fans are also quite critical when it comes to judge our pool players. Maybe someone like Ortman and Ludwig could produce against the US players...same goes for Bjisterbosch or Aaarts. And then Germany or the Netherlands could be competetive.

 

[mikepage]

100% agreed. For example only Poland which is not so big country in comparison with USA has such a strong field of players so many over there do not imagine. The main problems were already mentioned and tĥe most sad news for USA team... it will be a big surprise for me if it will change in the nearest future.
I haven't seen somebody mentioned Atlantic cup - very similar team tournament where the best european juniors compete with their american best youngsters. After all three cups if I remember correctly it was obvious european team has the players who deal much better with preasure. It is not surprising because as it was said the pool as a sport is organized much better in Europe and that makes young talents to become better players. Just one example... look how European championships for youth are organized each year and look in the eyes of those kids who have their dreams to come true. They are the future and they are very eager to get on the boat and the rivalry is so hard...

Poland really stands out in Europe. It has about the population of California and yet has 10 players who play at US top 20 speed. I agree about juniors. The rest of Europe is not that different from the USA -- performance pretty commensurate with population

 

[Maniac]

These "just numbers" ought to provide some perspective. This is the top 5 players with 200+ games irrespective of whether the player is active now. No doubt in some of the counties there are players not on our radar that should be here.

Once again, let me repeat myself. Your Fargo Rates are merely numerical statistics. Statistics do NOT win the Mosconi Cup. The ability to play under extreme pressure and the amount of heart a player shows when things are not going his way play a large part in the competition.

Europe undisputedly plays better under pressure and seems to have more heart. You may see it differently, but this is the way I've seen it over the past 10 years or so.

Maniac

 

[mikepage]

Once again, let me repeat myself. Your Fargo Rates are merely numerical statistics. Statistics do NOT win the Mosconi Cup. The ability to play under extreme pressure and the amount of heart a player shows when things are not going his way play a large part in the competition.

Europe undisputedly plays better under pressure and seems to have more heart. You may see it differently, but this is the way I've seen it over the past 10 years or so.

Maniac

Lol. Heart and playing under pressure are things I am not addressing.

And which is it? Indisputable? Or others may see it differently? Can’t have both.