How to deal with a cue with Ivory in it?

dom_poppa

dom_poppa

Banned
How would this transaction work?

Seller is out of the country and buyer is from U.S. The money was sent and seller sends the cue but it's confiscated by customs. What happens now? Money back to the buyer?

What if instead of sending the cue, the seller sends a piece of ivory and now customs keep it and the buyer believes that the cue is confiscated and the seller keeps the money and the supposed cue.

???????
 
dom_poppa said:
How would this transaction work?

Seller is out of the country and buyer is from U.S. The money was sent and seller sends the cue but it's confiscated by customs. What happens now? Money back to the buyer?

What if instead of sending the cue, the seller sends a piece of ivory and now customs keep it and the buyer believes that the cue is confiscated and the seller keeps the money and the supposed cue.

???????
Click to expand...



This is real simple if you know you are engaging in a crime and you get screwed who's fault is it your's or the seller who may not know it was illegal. I think the best way to avoid this problem is to not participate in a criminal action in the first place!!!!!!;)

Like I said real simiple:smile:
 
manwon said:
This is real simple if you know you are engaging in a crime and you get screwed who's fault is it your's or the seller who may not know it was illegal. I think the best way to avoid this problem is to not participate in a criminal action in the first place!!!!!!;)

Like I said real simiple:smile:
Click to expand...

I know what you are saying but if you hired someone to remodel your home and he doesn't have a contractor's license...he would be in trouble. Not the person doing the hiring or buying of service.

As sellers, it is their responsibility, in my opinion, to know the laws. If they sent it out then it should be their loss and refund of money.

U.S. buyers should not buy overseas, is that what you are saying? I know Rolex watches are the same thing...customs will confiscate a Rolex watch if it's sent to the U.S.
 
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manwon said:
This is real simple if you know you are engaging in a crime and you get screwed who's fault is it your's or the seller who may not know it was illegal. I think the best way to avoid this problem is to not participate in a criminal action in the first place!!!!!!;)

Like I said real simiple:smile:
Click to expand...


dom_poppa said:
I know what you are saying but if you hired someone to remodel your home and he doesn't have a contractor's license...he would be in trouble. Not the person doing the hiring or buying of service.

As sellers, it is their responsibility, in my opinion, to know the laws. If they sent it out then it should be their loss and refund of money.

U.S. buyers should not buy overseas, is that what you are saying? I know Rolex watches are the same thing...customs will confiscate a Rolex watch if it's sent to the U.S.
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If you hire someone to remodel your home and you know he doesn't have a contractor's license, the blame is on you.

You know that importing ivory is illegal. If you order a cue from overseas, knowing that it is illegal to bring it into the country, you are at fault just as much as the cue maker.
 
Really no sympathy for the buyer - it is illegal to bring ivory into the U.S. under most circumstances. Buyer got caught trying to break the law - he needed to know the law and understand the risk he was taking trying to import something with ivory in it. His loss.
 
It is the buyer's responsibility and the buyer is SOL if the cue gets nabbed by customs.

If a homeowner does not check to verify that a GC has a license they are to blame and they are the one who will lose any monies paid to said GC.

Ignorance is no excuse.
 
to the op;

is this simply a hypothetical question or is there a specific story to tell?

there are plenty of cautionary tales to do with people trying to bring ivory products into the US.

the law is the law.

best,
brian kc
 
Wht ask

Kickin' Chicken said:
to the op;

is this simply a hypothetical question or is there a specific story to tell?

there are plenty of cautionary tales to do with people trying to bring ivory products into the US.

the law is the law.

best,
brian kc
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I agree no need to ask this question....
MMike
 
You knew what you were doing when you tried to smuggle Ivory into the US under the radar.

What should have happened is US Customs should have let you take delivery of the cue then arrested you for smuggling Ivory into the US.

You break the law you should get busted and pay the penalty.

Be glad all you lost was the money. You could have lost your freedom.

Maybe you should be asking US Customs this hypothetical question and see what they say.

I can give you the local number for US Customs as one of the agents is a friend.
 
Can anyone tell me what year ivory stopped being used in pool cues??? Do Meucci's have ivory?

When shipping a cue overseas do you just put Pool Cue as the description??
 
jwcosenza97 said:
Can anyone tell me what year ivory stopped being used in pool cues??? Do Meucci's have ivory?

When shipping a cue overseas do you just put Pool Cue as the description??
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Ivory has not stopped being used in pool cues and some Meucci's do have ivory.

It just that there are restrictions and guidelines (laws) on what ivory is legal, mostly to do with when and where it originated from.

best,
brian kc
 
dom_poppa said:
I know what you are saying but if you hired someone to remodel your home and he doesn't have a contractor's license...he would be in trouble. Not the person doing the hiring or buying of service.

As sellers, it is their responsibility, in my opinion, to know the laws. If they sent it out then it should be their loss and refund of money.

U.S. buyers should not buy overseas, is that what you are saying? I know Rolex watches are the same thing...customs will confiscate a Rolex watch if it's sent to the U.S.
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We are talking about State verse Federal law here, importing or exporting Ivory in any way shape or form is a Federal offense!!

Last two wrongs never make anything right!!:smile:
 
all of the right and wrong aside it is the sellers responsibility to have the cue reach your door.

if you are willing to take the chances of dealing with ivory then you should have made it clear in advance who was responsible.

here is an example .. two people steal a pool cue. one agrees to take it to the pawn shop and get 100 for it. but the pawn shop suspects it is stolen and holds it for the police to check it out. does the one that took it to the pawn shop owe 50 dollars to the other guy? no they take the loss equally.

in your case both agreed to break the law so both should split the loss unless an agreement was made to the contrary.
 
maha said:
all of the right and wrong aside it is the sellers responsibility to have the cue reach your door.

if you are willing to take the chances of dealing with ivory then you should have made it clear in advance who was responsible.

here is an example .. two people steal a pool cue. one agrees to take it to the pawn shop and get 100 for it. but the pawn shop suspects it is stolen and holds it for the police to check it out. does the one that took it to the pawn shop owe 50 dollars to the other guy? no they take the loss equally.

in your case both agreed to break the law so both should split the loss unless an agreement was made to the contrary.
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As a seller, I don't like the sound of that one bit...
 
jwcosenza97 said:
As a seller, I don't like the sound of that one bit...
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Its really quite simple. The seller and the buyer communicate (from the sound of lots of these threads people might want to try that BEFORE they complete the transaction) and discuss issues like:

a) what the customs forms will say

b) insurance

c) responsibility

If they can come to agreement, they have a deal, otherwise, they can both move on. If you are a buyer in a Country that bans the importation of ivory and you are interested in obtaining a cue with ivory from outside your Country, you best be ready to accept all financial responsibility for the shipment or your selection will be very small.

There are some very safe methods to ship and receive articles in situations like this, however, none of them consist of customs forms that say "ivory pool cue" and none are insured for $4000 and up.

Thanks

Kevin
 
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You could contant USCBP Fines Penalties and Forfeitures and see if the cue is in fact being seized or can be retrieved after paying a penalty. I am not familiar with the rules of CITES so can't say for sure if that would be an option. If it is, then I would assume splitting the fine would be the fairest route to go.
 
MitchAlsup said:
Especially all those incidences in 1776 through 1779.......
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Fore sure, and so on and so on. It always surprises me when pool players, who have a rep of dancing to their own beat, preach blind allegiance to rules simply because they are rules.

Thanks

Kevin
 
If your asking is it OK to not ship a cue to an overseas buyer and claim it got confiscated by customs, the answer is no.
 
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