If you could narrow down breaking advice to just a few tips...

CreeDo

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
My break has sucked forever. I'd call myself a solid B player, I'll usually get at least 2 or 3 runouts in a 3 hour session.
I'd say I make a ball on the break 1 in 5 times or worse.

I'm not superstitious, I believe it can be fixed and it's not just bad luck, but I swear I've tried everything. Can anyone comment on which of these is really important and helpful?

1. Start out slow so you can squat the cue ball, and gradually work up your speed... This works ok in 9b, soft break is good enough. But in 8b I just leave clusters.

2. Focus on the cue ball last/focus on the shadow under the head ball... Which of these is better? I like focusing on the CB last to avoid accidental english but then I feel like I can't aim at the head ball as accurately.

3. Lean forward, choke up on the bridge... I get that this will help with accuracy. Do most pros actually do this? I feel like a shortened bridge won't let me draw far enough back to generate much power. Dunno what leaning forward does.

4. Pause at the end of the backswing... Huge fan of the pause and I use it in my regular game, especially on long shots. But both in my regular game and when breaking, I feel like I can't generate a ton of power from a dead stop. So I can't really pause while breaking and I also have trouble doing it on long powerful draw strokes.

5. Aim a little low on the cue ball... I've also heard aim for the center. It feels like as the stick goes from a little angled (backswing) to more level (forward swing) the tip rises naturally. So I just aim low and let it. Bad habit?

6. Keep the back hand loose... I sort of get the idea is to prevent you from choking the forward momentum of your stick, but do I really need to keep it looser than what feels natural? I can't tell if this is helping at all.

-----

Above all else, where do you position the cue ball and aim? In 9b... I get how to position the cue ball to make the wing ball per joe tucker's DVD, but I still don't get it in even 25% of the time, and that's when I think I've found the sweet spot (usually all the way to the side).

In 8b I've given up trying to make a specific ball. I've seen shane pop the 2nd row of balls into the side pockets all day in 10b. But the same thing just isn't happening in 8b when I try it.

Also, I feel like I can't get a ton of power using a standard closed bridge. I feel like a rail bridge reduces chafing and gets a much better spread. But it feels less accurate. Should I ditch it? I think relying on the rail hurts my 9b game because the ideal break spot is a few inches from the rail, past where I can comfortably rail bridge. I settle for rail bridging plus cutting the ball a bit.
 
I have a crap break too, so take this with a grain of salt. I can generate a lot of power, I just don't have much accuracy.

#5 on your list only applies to certain people. You place your tip lower only if you raise your cue on the follow through. Mine does not, so I place it just below center. Use a stripe ball to ascertain where you are contacting the ball and adjust your starting position appropriately.

#3, I went by Wimpy Lassiters advocacy of starting the majority of your weight on your back foot, and then shifting your weight to your lead foot. I don't jump up though like Johnny Archer.

Playing a particular ball in 8 and 10 ball consistently is only possible if you can get a consistent rack. I have witnessed Shane do the same thing, but I have also seen matches where he had to hit and hope.

Part of your problem with playing the wing ball, may have more to do with a lack of accuracy than anything. That's where #1 comes in.

Are you following all the way through?

You should learn to use both bridges effectively. Depending on the table and how the balls are racking, it's good to have as many tools in your arsenal as possible. So I think it is paramount to be just as effective breaking from the side rail as from the center of the table.
 
Practice makes perfect--

I read yor post and thought of a training aid at brakrack.com, --?
search it --the spelling may not be right
I used one last year , the pool room owner said if you can use it an hour --no charge-usually $2 per hour plus table-----I paid him his $2 just for the sake of politeness.


No re-racking the balls it simulates a break on any size table(fully adjustable)
I used it on a 7' I got tired of counting at well over 100.
150 I think anyway, the break corrected itself as the aim starts to improve, your arm hurt more if you breaking incorrectly, I used it for approach,set,aim, execute---BORING as H**L but stick with it. After you "DRILL" with brakrack every time you are ready to break you remember what you did wrong and correct it as best you can. Always warm up don't break cold--practice strokes dry--most everyone plugs the table racks the balls-shock to your arm, lag with the cue a few times- you get that one back-LOL

Most difficult thing is to stun shot the 1b, helps with center ,l,r, whats to low (the ball jumps off the table),too high =weak too much follow dead center has to be relearned ,
my back gave out LOL repetition of a stressful action so to speak--- I'm 56, reminded me of chopping wood, or moving bricks.

Back hurt,sweating the pressure is on. everyone in the hall looks at you occasionally like what an idiot!! That look that says OK man I will give 2 balls , --lets play and quit that S**T you are breaking MY balls --LOL

If I had a table at home I would have one.
ALL GUTS the GLORY shows up later when MAGICALLY in a match, POW
I watched Earl Strickland over and over for approach , can't break like that but, You're THE man in the hall for that fleeting moment you realize that everyone noticed your efforts were not for not.

Hope this helps,the rambling of an old man returning to the game looking for the instoke days of the past without the beer dope and women--More difficult to do than you might expect--It forces you to concentrate on one thing--The 1 ball how (fast,slow,left,right, or correctly) where the cue goes when you hit it a certain way ETC.

TRY a video game that lets you change the english and watch where the cb goes --not real but some what helpful -

I really haven't said much that you haven't heard before, maybe in a different light.
I do not teach , in fact I take lessons--topics of learning are fresh simply because I'm in the middle of them.
Watch better players, take lessons, don't pray, don't drink----focus.
Good Luck - sorry about a long drawn out answer.
We are getting a storm in Okla and I don't think I will chance a wreck in the Acura for a few racks of pool.
OH AND BY THE WAY I AM NOT PERFECT but I do practice when $$ allows it.
Thanks
New Guy
 
Practice break

I thought of something else--

my teach is trying to get me in the habit of a level cue ( with the table)
and new bridges !

On occasion I would make 1, 2 rarely 3 on a break --now 50% of the time almost always at least 1 or 2.

When you rack 9b place colors you can remember on the side s of the rack (i use 3b and the 8b ) to see where they go, if they drop how much they move kinda to estimate how much power has been transferred --I started and still use only 1b (not the one) but a color to watch .

Kinda difficult to watch them all, so pick out one or 2 point them on the sides/back of your rack .
Break and watch it several times with a different break stroke -amazing.

As usual I rambled on.SAT
My teacher said I was a 5.5-?6 speed . I've been back after 30 years for not quite 4 monthes.
I'd like to shoot / play / be rated 8--9 speed player someday==time will tell
I only practice about 5 hrs week maybe if I practiced 7 hrs I would be a seven LOL-J/J
Chris
 
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Any instructors out there?

Post Practice Makes Perfect . . . .

Please pm / post / Correct me . .
if ANYTHING I related or illustrated as if I was omnipotent ,PLEASE do.
I AM A STUDENT OF THE ART OF THE CUIST>and have a long way to go.
I wouldn't want to mis-guide Anyone -

I currently study 2 books-BYRNE'S Basic and Best Damn Pool Book Ever.
I take from a couple of great Totally different teachers-one is a PRO the other could be. Maybe he was and I know not of it.

I try to practice lessons received and incorporate 2nd opinions for polish .
One is able to take me to a new level with basics and technique, Gabe Owens takes current skills and presents a challenge to meet or it's back to to greens.
Gabe teaches in a PRO light, emphasis on entirely different issues of theory
( capitalize skills for the game ).
If I don't understand the mechanics of something he shows me .He shows me something close , if that doesn't KLIK , he will help me achieve the shot/exercise through a little different scenario, different set up with the desired results often w/similar theory , different execution, to actually USE /execute what he meant.
He -Gabe teaches at a level of accomplishment recognition and instills that EGO tender feeling of . .you will succeed if you try . . and if you don't ---add 5-10 hours practice before the next lesson or you're wasting you're $$.---LOL J/J

The other fellow plays a 9+ most all day long .If he can't see an improvement he also goes back to lesson before for review or in my case it's back to the book + green time,Practical billiards Techniques ,where I might be asked --"do you know what would have been the result if you made the shot like this" ? minor changes to bridge the next level foundation of skill set.

I would like to take some intense lessons CUE TECH possibly . After I get a foundation of basics and knowledge as an autopilot response, to approach,set, execute, CB control, safety, defense and position -for run out.
I have been in touch w/ Ricky Doyle about a few days.
I contacted them for a date and late spring /early summer , not finalized as yet but in the works. Hopefully the basic class sprinkled with some intermediate skill can be achieved come home and return for some PRO polish in the fall.

Only the POOL GODS know for sure. I might like to be a Senior (old) PRO someday.

My ONLY educated advice . . . .
Take lessons from someone you , trust, admire, or have good reason to
believe you can learn from. And remember you can't hustle a hustler.

Not all PROS can teach .. and not all teachers are PROS.
I feel very fortunate, as I have located a couple of capable people interested in me, not just the $$.I'm not just an ole 'dog that is looking for pettin'--they both make me feel like I am accomplishing something and have what it takes to maybe aspire to some level of excellence in another life endeavor.
You can never Know too much, nor will you ever know what the Pros know until you are one, . .nor will a person know what the teacher knows some people are just sorta blessed with that aura of knowledge .








until . . you play a game with a complete stranger
And even then the old guy at the far table playing one pocket still might beat 'ya. LOL

or is it L
---- = Luck -------------?
L
Thanks in advance for any correction, advice ,sympathy, empathy, . . blah ,blah. I get involved in this stuff and talk too much.

Thank God for spell check.
Go check out the 9ball evaluation drill ----billiards.colostate.edu----
lots of information.

I got rated 5-6, with lots of potential.
OK I guess after 30 years away from the game !
I've been back about 4 months.
I don't expect to win very often especially the ones with out their own stick are the dangerous ones !--LOL

Chris
 
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How about ONE tip. Hit the head ball full! Let's say your talking about 9 ball or 10 ball or even 8 ball. The most important thing in a break is making contact EXACTLY where you intend to make contact.

I would rather have to slow my break down to 10 MPH and hit the head ball solid and stop the cue ball in the middle of the table, than to hit a 25 PLUS MPH break and the cue ball running everywhere because it didn't hit flush on the head ball.

Remember... the break is the most important shot in pool. It sets up everything that will happen during that game. Control your break well, control the game.

Bob
 
Accuracy is #1. Accuracy comes from solid mechanics. With solid mechanics, you can lengthen your bridge for power while maintaining accuracy.

Visit an instructor who has a strong focus on mechanics and uses video analysis, and you might be pleasantly surprised at the results.

In he meantime, you can test your mechanics using Robert Byrne's 'How true is your stroke?' in his Standard Book of Pool and Billiards. Instead of a cue ball, use the 9 ball with the stripe carefully aligned with the shot. Start at a slow speed with follow, and slowly increase your speed until the stripe no longer rolls true. That is the speed that your accuracy breaks down. Until you understand why it's breaking down, it will be difficult or impossible to improve it. See an instructor.
 
My number one rule for breaking...
Accuracy trumps power every time!

Betsy and Bruno! (Thanks Randy)

Steve
 
No criticism?

Boy ,i thought I would catch some kinds pooey from some one.
I was tired , catching a cold, couldn't sleep and waiting on a storm. OKla
I just felt like yappin'.

You guys were kind but I meant it students have teachers ,writers have critics. editors.

Cowboy I appreciate it,


Chris
 
Just for example:

a guy asked me about a better and more successful break- he s hittin 9 and 8 Ball........makin me scary, lol- he hit s the rack so extremly hard, but without any control. Described and explained him about accouracy etc.......and each sentence from my side was answered with a *But...!* :confused:

Then i offered him a bet (not high- just to make it interesting for him :p)
50 Breaks on 8-Ball and 9-Ball rack- he with his boom-boom break against my *controlled baby-break* ^^

Results:
Mark: 50 x 9 Ball-Break/ 21 x ball down/ 11 times cueball in middle position ( good position !)
Further he was just 12 times able to *see* the one-ball
Ingo: 50 x 9 Ball-Break/ 41 x Ball down/ 33 times cueball in middle in good position
In my case i was able to see the one-ball 29 times.


On 8-Ball:
Mark: 50 x 8-Ball Break / 29 times ball down / cueball scratched 7 times and 3 x left the table/ 15 times cueball in the middle position after *ball-down*

Ingo: 50 x 8-Ball-Break/ 33 times ball down / 1 cueball scratched/
Cueball 29 times in middle position after *ball-down*



And even after this *show-down* (lol) his answer was:
But the pro s are hittin also that hard like me..............
Some guys don t wanna understand or learn-even if they see it *live*
but i am sure he s still thinkin about it :) (in his mind :p)

Accouracy rules the pool-world!

lg
Ingo
 
the sound of a clean hit.. and the sound of a HARD hit...

are similar.....

but not the same...

(thanks Blackjack I get it now)

start at half of what your break is now....and then slow that down

stop trying to hit hard..


clean contact is crisp.. hard contact is loud... because you hear lots of contacts.. CB to head ball ,CB down or up .. all the balls bounce... you get a loud effect.. but all the energy spent bouncing all those ball a little bit.. is wasted..

to the untrained player... they sound the same..

start your break from scratch..

start slow and accurate.. and build speed slowly and quit when you are sinking balls and stopping the CB...

what more could you want?
 
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Thanks for all the advice everyone. New guy, you especially went above and beyond... but don't let carpal tunnel mess up your bridge hand lol.

Looks like number 1 on the list is actually number one... start at slower speed and build up.

I guess I haven't been taking my medicine on that one because it just pains me to make a slow square hit on the one and leave half the balls clustered in the rack area. I may have an issue with my fundamentals if I can't make a controlled hit that's hard enough to spread everything.

I guess I never got sold on accuracy over power because I really want to break and run out. I can win with clusters and outmoving and safeties but I'll admit I want the gold and glory. So I settle for hard inaccurate hits and figure as long as whitey's on the table and I made something, I can get out. That's kind of a scrubby philosophy, I know...

Anyway. I'll slow it down. I'll drop down to 50% speed and squat whitey every time even if it kills me, and see if there's any reason I can't go to 60-70-80% with practice.
 
CreeDo said:
I'll drop down to 50% speed and squat whitey every time even if it kills me, and see if there's any reason I can't go to 60-70-80% with practice.
Click to expand...

Now you're talking like someone who really wants to improve!!!


Steve
 
1. Start out slow so you can squat the cue ball, and gradually work up your speed... This works ok in 9b, soft break is good enough. But in 8b I just leave clusters.

This is good to do, as each table breaks diff. Great asset to be able to control and squat the rock at all speeds. As for 8 ball remember you only want to break as hard as it takes to get maximum expansion of the rack, and not hit it so hard so that the balls contract and come back and cluster together.

2. Focus on the cue ball last/focus on the shadow under the head ball... Which of these is better? I like focusing on the CB last to avoid accidental english but then I feel like I can't aim at the head ball as accurately.

You shoot every shot looking at the OB last, why change that? Learn to hit the CB more accurately, and don’t use too much power as it will certainly degrade your accuracy.

3. Lean forward, choke up on the bridge... I get that this will help with accuracy. Do most pros actually do this? I feel like a shortened bridge won't let me draw far enough back to generate much power. Dunno what leaning forward does.

IT DOES NOTHING having your weight forward will not help you generate power., now having a forward stance is a diff story, as opposed to being square like a snooker player. Since your delivering forward w/power a forward stance as opposed to a square stance will keep you more balanced (your more tripod like in a forward stance) Also know you can generate more power by being higher in your stance than down low. I do choke up but only about a handspan at most. So i might get 4" less of a backswing....that still leaves plenty of room

4. Pause at the end of the backswing... Huge fan of the pause and I use it in my regular game, especially on long shots. But both in my regular game and when breaking, I feel like I can't generate a ton of power from a dead stop. So I can't really pause while breaking and I also have trouble doing it on long powerful draw strokes.

You need to work on your stroking mechanics more.

5. Aim a little low on the cue ball... I've also heard aim for the center. It feels like as the stick goes from a little angled (backswing) to more level (forward swing) the tip rises naturally. So I just aim low and let it. Bad habit?

AIM WHERE YOU INTEND TO HIT THE CB(unless you got funny eyes like Rodney morris or something)

6. Keep the back hand loose... I sort of get the idea is to prevent you from choking the forward momentum of your stick, but do I really need to keep it looser than what feels natural? I can't tell if this is helping at all.

A loose grip can deliver much more power than a tight grip. Just like throwing a punch, you can’t physically throw a punch with a clenched fist as fast as you can with a loose fist w/ a clench prior to impact. LOOSE GRIP

-----

Above all else, where do you position the cue ball and aim? In 9b... I get how to position the cue ball to make the wing ball per joe tucker's DVD, but I still don't get it in even 25% of the time, and that's when I think I've found the sweet spot (usually all the way to the side).

In regards to the AIM point, unless I’m trick breaking like the side break in 8 ball, you should be aiming for a full hit on the face ball. Depending on where you place the CB you can use the contact points b/t the object balls b/h the lead ball as a reference.

In 8b I've given up trying to make a specific ball. I've seen shane pop the 2nd row of balls into the side pockets all day in 10b. But the same thing just isn't happening in 8b when I try it.

As far as bridging off the rail, and depending on how the table breaks (lets just say it breaks equally well from any spot for easiness sake) I don’t care for breaking off the side rail and making the 1 ball, I much prefer a shallower angle of entry in b/t the center and the side rail and making a wing ball and squatting the rock with the 1 coming off the long rail back to the side I broke the balls from. I think the math/ percentages b/c of being able to place the 1 ball for an open shot make it a better break shot in 9ball


In all you seem to be in a great frame of mind, just keep that good attitude. Dont forget to always PAY ATTENTION that is the biggest key to learning.

best wishes,
Grey Ghost
 
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break cue tips

I was enamoured by the prospects of high tech tips- phenolic, G-10...

However, I found that chalking became a 2nd career with these tips.

I was advised to switch to the Samsari hard & experienced no significant decrease in power.

Excellent, experienced players, whose ranks unfortunately do not include me, appear to favor leather.

The axiom- "Accuracy trumps power" also appears to rank as, at least, the 11th commandment.

Hurling your body into the air & other acrobatic follow throughs appear to be limited to Johnny Archer & a few others

As, in the martial arts, tension & homicidal urges regarding the CB, are counter productive.
 
Above and Beyond?

Cree-do

I was up late and couldn't sleep .

As a result TMI.

Thanks guys for puttin' up with an old guy.


That's why I figured I would change
the handle New Guy to . .


Chris
 
found the correct spelling of breakrak

The correct place to look up the "Breakrak"
is www.breakrak.com
be prepared tho as with any other tool it is gonna cost that being said I will find a way to get one
Irish
 
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