Yeah, Deno was most likely in the dark, but to make remarks about other promoters was a bad move, never say never. It's called Karma and it will bite you every time
Interesting Quotes From Deno In The Latest Issue Of InsidePool....
- Thread starter Eydie Romano
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SlimShafty said:Yeah, Deno was most likely in the dark, but to make remarks about other promoters was a bad move, never say never. It's called Karma and it will bite you every time
The tendency to belittle the existing pool establishment has been the one of the very few constants at the IPT. The "we know how it's done and you don't" message that the IPT has consitently sent out to pool industry members, organizations, and establishments a is making them look really stupid right now.
Who is the CFO of the IPT? Under what name did the Tour license their company to operate in Illinois? How long will the players wait until they file a complaint with the Illinois States Attorney? They finished with George Ryan and are looking for another cause celeb. Especially in this election year. Even the Gov is under fire up there.
At their board meetings did anyone on the board question the CFO as to how much money they have and how they will pay off winners?
It seems to me that at every company board meeting the treasurer/finance officer reads off the financial status of the company. So in lieu of that there is absolutely no reason for any officer of the company not to know the financial status of the company. Especially the COO who is commonly known as the #2 man of the IPT. Ignorance is no excuse in a court of law. And surely, "I was just following orders" is not going to wash.
Oh well, it is only 18 days since paychecks were due.
Fall movies have started again so I will be able to devote more time to the TV.
Jake
At their board meetings did anyone on the board question the CFO as to how much money they have and how they will pay off winners?
It seems to me that at every company board meeting the treasurer/finance officer reads off the financial status of the company. So in lieu of that there is absolutely no reason for any officer of the company not to know the financial status of the company. Especially the COO who is commonly known as the #2 man of the IPT. Ignorance is no excuse in a court of law. And surely, "I was just following orders" is not going to wash.
Oh well, it is only 18 days since paychecks were due.
Fall movies have started again so I will be able to devote more time to the TV.
Jake
Deno WAS the voice of the IPT when I raised an issue of non payment several months ago. He promptly and loudly rebuked me for even questioning the integrity of the IPT. I only politely asked when I would be paid. It had been over a month with no word from anyone.
So, yes I hold him responsible now too, for whatever fate befalls the players. He is in bed with Kevin all the way. Bed bugs and all. He may have a little trouble showing his face around the pool room if these guys don't get paid.
So, yes I hold him responsible now too, for whatever fate befalls the players. He is in bed with Kevin all the way. Bed bugs and all. He may have a little trouble showing his face around the pool room if these guys don't get paid.
jay helfert said:
Well, seems to me there's got to be a limit to how much Deno will keep loyal to KT at the expense of his own (good?) name.....What's the big secret he's keeping? Just that KT has not released any funds for payment? Why can't he just come out and let people know what's going on? Orders from KT? Fear for his job? Ludicrous, all this silence and lurking about.......
Deno being the COO still answers to the CEO which I guess is KT. No matter what Deno wants to do he still can not authorize payouts that
are not available.
The one thing I would blame on Deno is the lack of communication. Thats
what a COO does. He runs the day to day operations and handles all issues. He might not speak but surely the IPT has PR people. I am surprised that they have not come forth by now.
Its seem like standard prcedure ofr companies to addresses issues like these quickly with statements usually buying themselves a little more time to handle things.
The players are now in need of an organization more than ever. Hopefully the IPT gets everything cleared up before to much damage is done.
IMO there have been to many lies and half-truths told by the IPT and KT
for much trust to be instilled in the players.
are not available.
The one thing I would blame on Deno is the lack of communication. Thats
what a COO does. He runs the day to day operations and handles all issues. He might not speak but surely the IPT has PR people. I am surprised that they have not come forth by now.
Its seem like standard prcedure ofr companies to addresses issues like these quickly with statements usually buying themselves a little more time to handle things.
The players are now in need of an organization more than ever. Hopefully the IPT gets everything cleared up before to much damage is done.
IMO there have been to many lies and half-truths told by the IPT and KT
for much trust to be instilled in the players.
frankncali said:
People with far more experience in the sport/industry of Billiards than myself have told me that this is entirely the crux of the problem - The male Pro players are, for the most part, either incapable or unwilling to organize together for their own benefit in any significant way. If they were they would have a tour organization more like the WPBA than the IPT.
Maybe what we need is both - A strong player-independant organization like the IPT with the will and capitol to build a quality Pro tour and make business decisions, and a non-profit players association that is purely dedicated to looking out for the best interest of the players on the tour. Something like the relationship between the Actors Union and the big Hollywood studios.
Perhaps existing organizations like the UPA could morph into such a role, especially as these existing organizations are likely to be totally marginalized if the IPT survives through 2007 and beyond.
Less than 20 days to wait for payment provokes this huge volume of threads and discussion about the demise of the IPT, their rape of the players, how much damage they have done to the state of pool ?!?
I think the worst that has happened is the lack of communication by Deno and Trudeau. I really don't think enough time has passed to lay this harsh judgment on the IPT that has taken most of the pleasure from reading the forums here lately.
Regular employees of any job generally get paid a few weeks after the work is done. Speaking of Reno, it hasn't been that much longer, especially considering so many of the people are "new employees" so to speak, with the issues of multiple addresses, no social security numbers, etc.
Yes, Deno needs to clarify the payment situation to all the players. But everyone who is not involved shouldn't interpret every single thing as evidence or proof of the demise of the IPT.
The fact is, if you look at the winnings of players who have received money from the IPT events so far this year, it adds up to more than all other US pro tournaments combined for the same period. And, I'm being conservative. I could say "in the Western Hemisphere" also. I could probably delete the qualifier, "pro", but I don't have time to add all that up to find out. Anyway, that's a lot of money pumped into pool players pockets already and firmly places the IPT as providing the most significant boost to pool in many years. Of course we all hope the IPT continues for many years, but if it does not, it has already made its positive impact.
I think the worst that has happened is the lack of communication by Deno and Trudeau. I really don't think enough time has passed to lay this harsh judgment on the IPT that has taken most of the pleasure from reading the forums here lately.
Regular employees of any job generally get paid a few weeks after the work is done. Speaking of Reno, it hasn't been that much longer, especially considering so many of the people are "new employees" so to speak, with the issues of multiple addresses, no social security numbers, etc.
Yes, Deno needs to clarify the payment situation to all the players. But everyone who is not involved shouldn't interpret every single thing as evidence or proof of the demise of the IPT.
The fact is, if you look at the winnings of players who have received money from the IPT events so far this year, it adds up to more than all other US pro tournaments combined for the same period. And, I'm being conservative. I could say "in the Western Hemisphere" also. I could probably delete the qualifier, "pro", but I don't have time to add all that up to find out. Anyway, that's a lot of money pumped into pool players pockets already and firmly places the IPT as providing the most significant boost to pool in many years. Of course we all hope the IPT continues for many years, but if it does not, it has already made its positive impact.
beetle said:
Beetle, if payments are NOT made , I think that the opposite can also be said. "it adds up to more unpaid money than all other US pro tournaments combined ever. And I'm being conservative. I could say in the entire World history of the sport"
i heard of 2 people who got through to the IPT today. One was told checks to be Fedexed tomorrow (dont forget to check Saturday delivery!) and the second was told 'checks go out next week'. The IPT people reached were Lindsey and Deno but i dont know which said what and it is also second hand info so FWIW only.
All kidding aside...
At the players meeting in Reno the players should have been told that they were not going to be paid at the end of the tournament...That did not happen.
When the tournament ended the players were told that the checks would be mailed in a few days...that did not happen.
The timing of the cancellation of the London tournament due to "lack of venue" fueled the mistrust and raised questions regarding the solvency of the IPT.
We all know that $h*t happens and that this Tour is in its infancy and will have growing pains... but it is ESSENTIAL for the Tour to succeed that the players are kept in the loop and not lied to especially when it comes to payment of winnings.
Not doing so totally undermines the legitimacy of the Tour.
Statements like the checks did not arrive, it is too difficult to pay on site, you'll have the payments in a couple of days (that was 2 weeks ago) etc. etc. just does not cut it.
The IPT management speaks of professionalism but right now are far from being professional... They speak with forked tongue.
An immediate coup d'etas is in order! POWER TO THE PEOPLE! VIVE LA REVOLUTION!
ruk
At the players meeting in Reno the players should have been told that they were not going to be paid at the end of the tournament...That did not happen.
When the tournament ended the players were told that the checks would be mailed in a few days...that did not happen.
The timing of the cancellation of the London tournament due to "lack of venue" fueled the mistrust and raised questions regarding the solvency of the IPT.
We all know that $h*t happens and that this Tour is in its infancy and will have growing pains... but it is ESSENTIAL for the Tour to succeed that the players are kept in the loop and not lied to especially when it comes to payment of winnings.
Not doing so totally undermines the legitimacy of the Tour.
Statements like the checks did not arrive, it is too difficult to pay on site, you'll have the payments in a couple of days (that was 2 weeks ago) etc. etc. just does not cut it.
The IPT management speaks of professionalism but right now are far from being professional... They speak with forked tongue.
An immediate coup d'etas is in order! POWER TO THE PEOPLE! VIVE LA REVOLUTION!
ruk
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Nostroke said:
I have heard the exact thing, BUT I have also heard that they were mailed last week and due this past Tuesday and so on and so on.............
It does not look like one bit on damage control is being done to rectify any of this situation, whatsoever! It seems to me, that any other major corporation such as this would be on the phones with the PR guys sweeping up this mess. Could they just care less?
I just don't understand why a formal PR has not been done nor a personal letter to the players, out of common courteousness for the people that have supported their business.
Eydie Romano said:
It is obvious that the IPT management group feels that they don't owe anobody anything ... after all, they are the best thing that happened to the sport since people stopped playing this game on grass.
Who are we to question their management or their ethics? How dare anyone do that?
ruk
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Nostroke said:
Ha Ha.
They are now playing the delay game. Keep telling them (the suckers) something to delay them. Keep dangling that carrot in front of their noses just out of reach.
The above quote of Nostroke looks plausible since I mentioned to look for checks on Oct 2nd. I was joking people. Now they are going to get the checks out tomorrow. Sure. Most likely Monday Oct 2nd. Sure. Then you have to wait 2-3 days for the checks to arrive.
So now they have put everyone off until next Friday.
Pretty slick.
I would have given some credence to that story if it was mentioned here or on the IPT website. Until then, you all are just spitting in the wind.
Jake