Is being a known player a bad thing?

1pRoscoe

1pRoscoe

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was thinking about this the other day, as I was playing in a poolhall that I really never go to that often, as it is out of the way. I was looking for a decent money game, and someone asked if I wanted to play anything relatively cheap to start. He intro'd himself and I asked his last name, and he told me what it was. He is a known 9 ball player in Texas, and I knew that I didn't have a chance. I asked for a spot, which of course was laughed at (7out + breaks). Needless to say I have seen him play, and strictly from his reputation around this state as being a champion-caliber player, I knew I couldn't par without a spot.

So this got me to thinking.... Looking at the best amateurs and some pros, I'm sure that they gamble, but are not able to do so annonymously.

Is being that good a bad thing?

Discuss.... :D
 
i'd much rather be someone that is "Known" for his prowess on the pocket billiard table. it would be nice to walk into a pool hall/room and hear people say "that guy there can really play."

as far as gambling goes, if your a really good player you wont stay unknown for long. unless you go farther and farther away.

just my $.02
DCP
 
1pRoscoe said:
I was thinking about this the other day, as I was playing in a poolhall that I really never go to that often, as it is out of the way. I was looking for a decent money game, and someone asked if I wanted to play anything relatively cheap to start. He intro'd himself and I asked his last name, and he told me what it was. He is a known 9 ball player in Texas, and I knew that I didn't have a chance. I asked for a spot, which of course was laughed at (7out + breaks). Needless to say I have seen him play, and strictly from his reputation around this state as being a champion-caliber player, I knew I couldn't par without a spot.

So this got me to thinking.... Looking at the best amateurs and some pros, I'm sure that they gamble, but are not able to do so annonymously.

Is being that good a bad thing?

Discuss.... :D
Click to expand...

well it depends on your intentions.

would it be better if jeanette lee was unknown? nope, she makes money off being known.

and im sure oldhasbeen will comment on this, but for his intentions when he was on the road, it was better for him to be unknown.

like i said, it all depends on your intentions, if you're going to make money strictly off gambling, then no you don't want to be known. if you're not a big gambler and trying to make money by marketing yourself, then no its not a bad thing to be known as being known is how you make your money.

thanks
 
Well put vapoolplayer. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head when it comes to being a known player.

I do gamble and yes, it has become tougher since I started playing on the pro tour. People are reluctant to play based on that status. They don't consider that I got out there and worked hard to get there to get to the pro tour....as did all of the others. Yes, there are tons of others out there who play great but don't go to all the trouble of playing on the pro tour. So, even though I am not a top pro and I am liable to play bad at times...that is not taken into consideration.

Another thing that comes with being a known player is pressure. I have noticed that when I go to a pool room to play in local tournaments people that haven't seen me in quite some time or never before are totally amazed and in awe. Then if I lose a match...they are upset or disappointed in my play. Thinking because I am a pro I am supposed to win at all times.

It's not a bad thing at all. It is nice to see the joy it brings to people a good player is in the room. People are so happy to get a chance to see someone play or talk to someone that is a known player. It is an honor to make people happy...win or lose.

Take care,
Sarah
 
The Perfect Answer Will Be At The Dcc.

The perfect answer to this question will be at the DCC. Although it is very dated (1977), I feel it is very relevant to the financial aspects of the game of Pool today.

The St. Louie, Louie-OHB Poster was intended to show the different paths that a good pool player can take. They were originally two different sports special articles that appeared on December 26th & December 27th in the major St. Louis newspaper.

Now that the two articles have been combined into one poster and enlarged, it reflects the author’s intentions very well.

Because no one has heard of (yours truly) OHB, Buddy Hall has made some signed statements & comments to validate the OHB article.
St. Louie, Louie's article needs no explanation but I have made some signed statements & comments.

Why am I selling this poster at the DCC?
Is it strictly for financial gain and notoriety? NO!

While I will never apologize for making a profit, the true reason I am doing this is because:

I am an OHB and therefore couldn't care less about notoriety.

I know there is a market for this. My Daughter has proven that on eBay and it will go back on eBay (for twice the price) right after the DCC.

I feel that in a strange way, the St. Louie, Louie article gives some important insight into what Louie's thoughts were about his previous decisions relating to Pool.

I KNOW this article about OHB gives some great insight into what a "Road Pool Hustler" went through to be successful. The feedback from people who have bought the article (on OHB only), on eBay has been that "They Had No Idea" this even could have been done. Quite a few have requested more.

As of right now the Poster will be for sale at booth #6 in the main corridor. The price will be $85.

SeeYa Soon @ the DCC.
TY & GL
 

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sarahrousey said:
Well put vapoolplayer. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head when it comes to being a known player.

I do gamble and yes, it has become tougher since I started playing on the pro tour. People are reluctant to play based on that status. They don't consider that I got out there and worked hard to get there to get to the pro tour....as did all of the others. Yes, there are tons of others out there who play great but don't go to all the trouble of playing on the pro tour. So, even though I am not a top pro and I am liable to play bad at times...that is not taken into consideration.

Another thing that comes with being a known player is pressure. I have noticed that when I go to a pool room to play in local tournaments people that haven't seen me in quite some time or never before are totally amazed and in awe. Then if I lose a match...they are upset or disappointed in my play. Thinking because I am a pro I am supposed to win at all times.

It's not a bad thing at all. It is nice to see the joy it brings to people a good player is in the room. People are so happy to get a chance to see someone play or talk to someone that is a known player. It is an honor to make people happy...win or lose.

Take care,
Sarah
Click to expand...

thanks, Sarah. That's exactly the answer I was looking for from someone's perspective such as yours...

:D
 
sarahrousey said:
I do gamble and yes, it has become tougher since I started playing on the pro tour. People are reluctant to play based on that status....... Take care,
Sarah
Click to expand...


so does that mean i can get the 6 out and the breaks??? :D :D :D
 
I know here in St Louis a 'known player' could get $500-$1000 worth of "courtesy" action just for coming to town. They would have to play up to a decent speed but not with much pressure. Not a bad payday for a trip to the Lou. These days with the internet, magazines, etc. it is hard for a player to sneak up on someone for any big action. I remember when Cecil Tugwell came to town about 8-10 years ago, there was a magazine article in a current billiard magazine about him winning the One Pocket championship over Efren the month before. Cecil tried to claim at first the picture wasn't him & then stated he just got lucky. The next pool room I saw him at in town, he came in wearing a blonde wig. He looked ridiculous, people still knew who is was.....and he still got the money. Louie Roberts has been the only pool player that I knew that would walk into a room, say 'I am the great St Louie Louie, who wants action' and then get it.
 
Best Hustlers Book I've ever seen.

whitewolf - "He had every city in the country listed just about and all of the players who gambled, their strenghts and weaknessess, etc".

While at the Johnston City Tournament during the last year - I got to know a good Player/Hustler named Eddie Burton. He gave me a map of the Carolina's and a 5 page description of who, when, where & how to play. I think I still have it somewhere. I was headed there about 3 weeks after the tournament and stopped in Paducah. I teamed up with a young straight shooter named Buddy Hall and headed west instead. Didn't get back to the Carolina's for almost a year and stayed (playing every day) for over 1 year.
IT WAS THE MOST INCLUSIVE, INFORMATIVE, & PROFITABLE HUSTLERS BOOK I'VE EVER SEEN.


TY & GL
 
Being Known

1pRoscoe said:
I was thinking about this the other day, as I was playing in a poolhall that I really never go to that often, as it is out of the way. I was looking for a decent money game, and someone asked if I wanted to play anything relatively cheap to start. He intro'd himself and I asked his last name, and he told me what it was. He is a known 9 ball player in Texas, and I knew that I didn't have a chance. I asked for a spot, which of course was laughed at (7out + breaks). Needless to say I have seen him play, and strictly from his reputation around this state as being a champion-caliber player, I knew I couldn't par without a spot.

So this got me to thinking.... Looking at the best amateurs and some pros, I'm sure that they gamble, but are not able to do so annonymously.

Is being that good a bad thing?

Discuss.... I agree that it depends on your intentions. Obviously, it's not good to be KNOWN if you want to HUSTLE somebody... This seems to be a common MO in pool gambling....It's even glorified and romanticized in pool movies....The negotiating before a gambling match is supposed to level the playing field between the 2 players' abilities, but few people ever really want it to be a true 50/50 proposition....Seems most people want an EDGE...which is to make it less of a gamble that they will WIN. In the case of a really good player taking advantage of somebody because they don't know him, there's hardly any gamble at all; since the victim has hardly any chance at winning.
Hustling is deception and dishonesty, but that's what a lot of "gambling" pool players want to do...and being unknown is a big part of hustling...
Click to expand...
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
as far as gambling goes, if your a really good player you wont stay unknown for long. unless you go farther and farther away.

just my $.02
DCP
Click to expand...

I think someone should tell that to Vernon Elliot. :D
 
OldHasBeen said:
The perfect answer to this question will be at the DCC. Although it is very dated (1977), I feel it is very relevant to the financial aspects of the game of Pool today.

The St. Louie, Louie-OHB Poster was intended to show the different paths that a good pool player can take. They were originally two different sports special articles that appeared on December 26th & December 27th in the major St. Louis newspaper.

Now that the two articles have been combined into one poster and enlarged, it reflects the author’s intentions very well.

Because no one has heard of (yours truly) OHB, Buddy Hall has made some signed statements & comments to validate the OHB article.
St. Louie, Louie's article needs no explanation but I have made some signed statements & comments.

Why am I selling this poster at the DCC?
Is it strictly for financial gain and notoriety? NO!

While I will never apologize for making a profit, the true reason I am doing this is because:

I am an OHB and therefore couldn't care less about notoriety.

I know there is a market for this. My Daughter has proven that on eBay and it will go back on eBay (for twice the price) right after the DCC.

I feel that in a strange way, the St. Louie, Louie article gives some important insight into what Louie's thoughts were about his previous decisions relating to Pool.

I KNOW this article about OHB gives some great insight into what a "Road Pool Hustler" went through to be successful. The feedback from people who have bought the article (on OHB only), on eBay has been that "They Had No Idea" this even could have been done. Quite a few have requested more.

As of right now the Poster will be for sale at booth #6 in the main corridor. The price will be $85.

SeeYa Soon @ the DCC.
TY & GL
Click to expand...

have you thought about writing a book ohb? seems like it would be a good read. also, how big are the posters blown up to? when you get back from the dcc if you have some left i'll probably get one. i'll have to have it shipped as i won't be down in louisville.

thanks
 
If you have the game to back up the reputation, why would that matter? From experience, I can tell you that that if you play the best long enough -you can only stay under the radar for so long. I found that out after taking out guys like Gene Skinner. What ends up happening, is that sooner or later your anonymity takes a back seat to your greed. That is exactly what happened in my case. In the end, the only reason I wanted my identity concealed was to ensure that scales were tipped in my favor. So what does that say about my confidence? Very soon I will start posting a series entitle "Human Moves" where I will explain this in detail. Perhaps I will get with Mike and post it in my articles section here at this site. It pretty much takes the veil off of the pool room gambling mystique. Players that hide who they are and how well they play do it for one reason - to deceive. I know because I made a living off of doing that for a very long time.
 
If you have the game to back up the reputation, why would that matter? From experience, I can tell you that that if you play the best long enough -you can only stay under the radar for so long. I found that out after taking out guys like Gene Skinner. What ends up happening, is that sooner or later your anonymity takes a back seat to your greed. That is exactly what happened in my case. In the end, the only reason I wanted my identity concealed was to ensure that the scales were tipped in my favor. So what does that say about my confidence? Very soon I will start posting a series entitled "Human Moves" where I will explain this in detail. Perhaps I will get with Mike and post it in my articles section here at this site. It pretty much takes the veil off of the pool room gambling mystique. Players that hide who they are and how well they play do it for one reason - to deceive. I know this because I made a living off of doing that for a very long time.
__________________
Blackjack David Sapolis
 
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in AWE??

sarahrousey said:
Well put vapoolplayer. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head when it comes to being a known player.

I do gamble and yes, it has become tougher since I started playing on the pro tour. People are reluctant to play based on that status. They don't consider that I got out there and worked hard to get there to get to the pro tour....as did all of the others. Yes, there are tons of others out there who play great but don't go to all the trouble of playing on the pro tour. So, even though I am not a top pro and I am liable to play bad at times...that is not taken into consideration.

Another thing that comes with being a known player is pressure. I have noticed that when I go to a pool room to play in local tournaments people that haven't seen me in quite some time or never before are totally amazed and in awe. Then if I lose a match...they are upset or disappointed in my play. Thinking because I am a pro I am supposed to win at all times.

It's not a bad thing at all. It is nice to see the joy it brings to people a good player is in the room. People are so happy to get a chance to see someone play or talk to someone that is a known player. It is an honor to make people happy...win or lose.

Take care,
Sarah
Click to expand...
Come on, pay $75.00 to the bca and your a "PRO" player,.most people become pro players because they want to say" hey look at me Im a PRO"...most pros are unknown unless they go around telling everybody, cause most of them suck!! Most pro players wont play for $100.00 a game let alone $500.00..they want to play a trouny that cost more to enter they they will ever win..not to say you are one of these types of "PROS". Im sure your not,..but you know there are a lot of them out there
 
1pRoscoe said:
I was thinking about this the other day, as I was playing in a poolhall that I really never go to that often, as it is out of the way. I was looking for a decent money game, and someone asked if I wanted to play anything relatively cheap to start. He intro'd himself and I asked his last name, and he told me what it was. He is a known 9 ball player in Texas, and I knew that I didn't have a chance. I asked for a spot, which of course was laughed at (7out + breaks). Needless to say I have seen him play, and strictly from his reputation around this state as being a champion-caliber player, I knew I couldn't par without a spot.

So this got me to thinking.... Looking at the best amateurs and some pros, I'm sure that they gamble, but are not able to do so annonymously.

Is being that good a bad thing?

Discuss.... :D
Click to expand...


one can always parlay one's fame to his benefit.
 
sideshotscott said:
Come on, pay $75.00 to the bca and your a "PRO" player,.most people become pro players because they want to say" hey look at me Im a PRO"...most pros are unknown unless they go around telling everybody, cause most of them suck!! Most pro players wont play for $100.00 a game let alone $500.00..they want to play a trouny that cost more to enter they they will ever win..not to say you are one of these types of "PROS". Im sure your not,..but you know there are a lot of them out there
Click to expand...


That's a rediculous thing to say. I have seen her play many times. I would wager that if she were standing next to a table asking YOU to play .........100$ a rack, you would find an excuse not to play.

Damn forums, everybody's a world beater on paper............

~DC
 
For cheap-shot man

:p It's not how good you play it's how you match UP!!! In any game !!!! When I play poker I play the players, not the cards!!! I know I lived it!!! If I wanted to get action I'd tell [mark] them to post $$$ and I'd fly in a player, They always thought Who is this , 'Hell', :) I'll take her $$$$ Pucket & I had a ball doin that!! I would always end up with the money. The thought of playing Buddy or R.Allen was worth it to most. It's fun. it's something to BRAGG ABOUT!!!! Also If you dont know how to clock a player better View instead of putting a player down tisk,tisk Sara plays her ass off when shes mad!!Ha Ha HA HA ha,' Hay'. girl, :rolleyes: I'll stake it!!!! Your old friend B. J.
 
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crawdaddio said:
That's a ridiculous thing to say. I have seen her play many times. I would wager that if she were standing next to a table asking YOU to play $100 a rack, you would find an excuse not to play.

Damn forums, everybody's a world beater on paper............
Click to expand...

Sometimes people can't see the forest, but for the trees. When pros don't hit the mark at various events, suddenly there's a slew of opinions as to why, many times degrading the pool player. These result pickers just don't get it!

JAM
 
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