So, what is next? Them telling you, you have to break at a certain speed?
Shane
Shane
Is "pattern" racking cheating in 9 ball?
- Thread starter Shortside K
- Start date
David,
I don't think we are arguing how to interpret the word random, we understand the definition. However, its feasable that we are arguing that this choice of wording was incorrect when the rules were printed. Did they really mean to say "random" or should it have said "in any order?"
This is almost laughable... its like saying "the rules are wrong".
Maybe they were incorrect when the rules stated that the "one ball at the front of the rack", or equally incorrect when they stated that "the 9 ball is racked in the middle of the rack".
I don't think we are arguing how to interpret the word random, we understand the definition. However, its feasable that we are arguing that this choice of wording was incorrect when the rules were printed. Did they really mean to say "random" or should it have said "in any order?"
This is almost laughable... its like saying "the rules are wrong".
Maybe they were incorrect when the rules stated that the "one ball at the front of the rack", or equally incorrect when they stated that "the 9 ball is racked in the middle of the rack".
Yeah. Even if you make a ball, they'll require you to hit the rack hard enough that you are more likely to lose control of the rock. Then they'll require you to break from the head spot or some such.orangecrush said:
I cheated in a fair sized tournament recently!
I got to practice my racking skills seven times playing a competitor with a monster break recently. Giving him a nice tight rack every time, he made two or three balls most breaks and spread the rest nicely. I put the one and the nine where they belonged and racked the other balls randomly. However, if the eight fell into place on the second row I moved it to the back since an optical illusion is created when a bright ball(the one) and a very dark ball(the eight) are placed side by side possibly causing a slight aiming error when someone is thinning the one and primarily hitting the second ball. For some reason he never complained about me stacking the rack!
I do think that "random" racking is unenforceable and should be eliminated in favor of a simple easy to learn pattern.
Hu
smittie1984 said:
I got to practice my racking skills seven times playing a competitor with a monster break recently. Giving him a nice tight rack every time, he made two or three balls most breaks and spread the rest nicely. I put the one and the nine where they belonged and racked the other balls randomly. However, if the eight fell into place on the second row I moved it to the back since an optical illusion is created when a bright ball(the one) and a very dark ball(the eight) are placed side by side possibly causing a slight aiming error when someone is thinning the one and primarily hitting the second ball. For some reason he never complained about me stacking the rack!
I do think that "random" racking is unenforceable and should be eliminated in favor of a simple easy to learn pattern.
Hu
double post
double tap, too quick with the trigger finger!
double tap, too quick with the trigger finger!
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Southpaw said:
You got action, Paw.
Do I ahve to hit the rack every time?
Bob Jewett said:
They don't call him "The Lizard King2" for nothin!
seymore15074 said:I did this maybe a dozen times this lifetime before I realized that I was wasting my time. Guess what happens when your oppenent misses? ...you now have a "difficult" run out..
I agree. If pattern racking is designed to make the runout harder. guess what happens when your opponent misses? Now YOU have the tough runout. It may help if your playing a pro who can put a few racks on you everytime you miss. But for the average player it aint gonna even things out or help you that much.
Just to illustrate
another rule not adhered to - That tapping the balls into place under Texas Express rules is a loss of game, and if continued can be loss of match.
Think you would get away with it as your opponent puts a little tap on the 1 ball to loudly exclaim, 'You lost that game'.
another rule not adhered to - That tapping the balls into place under Texas Express rules is a loss of game, and if continued can be loss of match.
Think you would get away with it as your opponent puts a little tap on the 1 ball to loudly exclaim, 'You lost that game'.
Snapshot9 said:
I never heard that one. Ill find out later if that ones true. I drink with one of the orignal writers of the texas express rules. But yeah youre right, youd never get away with that.
I don't have any brilliant solutions to offer, but insisting on "random" could get tricky, right? Late in a match, are you going to tell the TD it's about time your opponent put the 2 and 3 on the wings because he hasn't done it all night?:grin:
Personally, if the game matters and my opponent's playing well, I'm going to put the 7 and 8 there, and I'd expect to see the same ... the rest, sorta random, while maybe protecting my spot ball and not putting the 2 in the row behind the 9. Now how many have we got left to place randomly?
Personally, if the game matters and my opponent's playing well, I'm going to put the 7 and 8 there, and I'd expect to see the same ... the rest, sorta random, while maybe protecting my spot ball and not putting the 2 in the row behind the 9. Now how many have we got left to place randomly?
The "bigger" tournies, are run by morons(player not up is placed around 20 feet from the table, as well as the "ref", wtf, not to mention the 30 second timer(It's amazing that the ref, or anybody for that matter, can see everything correctly from that far away, and what if you want to switch shafts lol, try doing that, running back/forth 20 feet and taking a shot in 30 seconds).
Well anyway, in "tournies", this issue can be easily fixed, by having the "ref" rack, instead of the traditional loser racks rule.
Well anyway, in "tournies", this issue can be easily fixed, by having the "ref" rack, instead of the traditional loser racks rule.
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TXsouthpaw said:
Texas Express Rules have sort of faded into the mist. I can't find anything verifiably "official" with a google search but the following purports to be the official rules but it is just a pdf file without any designated author.
2.3: Ball Tapping During Racking
Attempting to freeze numbered balls in a particular position by tapping or striking
them with the cue ball, another ball, or any foreign object is called ball tapping, and
is not permitted at any time, including during practice on a tournament-designated
table. A player may or may not be issued a warning for ball tapping before the
infraction is declared a foul; if determined to be a foul, the penalty is the loss of
one game per incident. Only the tournament director reserves the right to tap numbered
balls.
http://www.mariettabilliardclub.com/TexasExpress9-Ball-Rules.pdf
So, according to that rule, tapping is not NECESSARILY loss of game and if the above IS an official rule, it was/is a poor one since it leaves the loss of game decision up to the whimsy of the ref/td.
But then there is ANOTHER tapping rule which says that doing so IS a foul...period. ???????
7.7: Ball Tapping
Ball tapping during racking, in either a match or practice on an assigned tournament
table is forbidden. The penalty is loss of the game for each infraction; the tournament
director may impose the penalty with or without warning. (See rule 2.3)
I've asked a founding TE official to post what are the most recent rules but he declined.
Does anyone have a link?
Regards,
Jim
Big Perm said:
Neither the BCA rule set (which refers to the WSRs but is NOT the exact same rule set) are dictatorial, official and final such as the USGA Rules of Golf (which provide for local rule variations within limits).
So, except for tournaments that specifically ADOPT the BCA or WSR rule sets, it's like there's no law west of the Pecos pardner.
The DCC, for example, has its own rules on certain matters as do many other events.
So NO, pattern racking is NOT cheating by rule or ethics unless a specific rule set has been agreed to that prevents it.
Besides, have you seen anyone sit there and chart the opponent's racking pattern? I haven't.
Regards,
Jim
I don't usually set the balls in in any order but occasionally, if I'm playing someone that I think is a threat to run out a lot, I'll use this one
The only balls I set are the 1, 2, and 3. The others are random. The lines represent the general direction they will go and does not reflect any kisses off of other balls. The general idea behind this rack is that the person breaking will have to go up and down the table playing position, which we all know increases the chances of position mistakes. Have I had anyone run out on me with this rack? Sure, and I've run it out myself plenty of times, but there is a slight advantage to it. Then again, if the person breaking doesn't make a ball then I'm stuck with it. hehe!!
MULLY
The only balls I set are the 1, 2, and 3. The others are random. The lines represent the general direction they will go and does not reflect any kisses off of other balls. The general idea behind this rack is that the person breaking will have to go up and down the table playing position, which we all know increases the chances of position mistakes. Have I had anyone run out on me with this rack? Sure, and I've run it out myself plenty of times, but there is a slight advantage to it. Then again, if the person breaking doesn't make a ball then I'm stuck with it. hehe!!
MULLY
If I spot someone the 7 or 8 I make them rack it or both on the second row....Nick B said: