Is Schmidt's and charlie 626 Legit

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
To Danny and others regarding the camera angle:

Here is Danny at the DCC high run challenge. His body completely blocks the rack. The scorekeeper in the corner is not watching in this moment. Did Danny move the break ball? Or rack high/low? Did he cheat? Of course I don't think so! But this is what you are all saying of JS.

What about in Danny's 351 run (I did not purchase it, so I did not see it). Was that also a single camera? Where his body blocked many of the shots and/or racking process? It probably was, as Danny wrote a few posts back that if he were to do it again he'd use two cameras.

Point being pool is a low budget activity, and most of us that play it are not super tech savvy, and camera savvy, and have money to burn to set up a studio with multiple camera angles to capture a "cheat proof" high run.

Danny, what if your 351 was 527? What would we have to go by except your word? Your body blocked the rack. You had no witnesses, did you? Would anyone have come to your house to take apart your Diamond and inspect it for "shaved slates"?

JS has a lot more. He has the footage (if you choose not to see it, that is your issue. He is making it available for everyone and anyone to view it at his showing events). He has several people who watched the run as it was unfolding. He has several runs leading up to it that were in the 400's.

The people watching the run live are probably more credible than the people who watched mosconi's run. They know they will be under scrutiny, so they better be firm in their convictions. Whereas the Mosconi run witnesses were probably people struck by fandom. There were rumors circulated over the years, that balls even popped out of the pockets during the 526 and were counted. Who knows what really happened.

IMO, what we have with JS's run, is probably the most evidence for any high run ever caught on tape. It is certainly well above and beyond what is typical for a pool "feat".
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Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The original claim was four people were there watching. That included the racker, his wife, and john's wife. I don't remember if they originally claimed the hall owner as a witness or not. While pj thought I was asking an impossible question to answer, the answer for all but maybe one or two of the people there has already been given.

john, hitting balls
the racker, racking
the room owner, getting ready to open
the room owner's wife, getting ready to open
one employee, getting ready to open.
john's wife, there, why, and what she was doing while every shot was taken is unknown.

Very unlikely that there were eyes on john at an angle to see the shot every moment of the run. Compare that to Willie Mosconi's run. Number of people there, unknown. Number that signed a document claiming to have seen the entire run, 38. I'm dubious about that number. However, most of these people were there as spectators to see an exhibition by a multi-time world champion. This was basically a one time thing too. They couldn't ramble in pretty much anytime the room was open and see Willie like they could watch john five days a week, week after week. Willie didn't have dozens and dozens of failed attempts to discourage spectators from thinking they were going to see something really special either.

Bottom line, the circumstances of Willie's run were much different than john's and there were many more spectators. Very easy to believe there were ten or more sets of eyes on every shot of Willie's. Also very easy to believe that john could have committed an unnoticed foul and perhaps didn't even consider it as these attempts were very much like practice runs. Very common to keep on if we have a minor foul in practice but any such thing would invalidate a record run.

john might have set a record, I think it is ridiculous to call it an exhibition record without any real spectators.

Gerry, there was no claim from john's camp that any spectators were there to watch the attempt. Original claims and updated claims during the week had zero unbiased witnesses present.

Logical, your point isn't without logic! While I would call myself more of a skeptic as I don't think you will find a statement from me anywhere that john didn't run 626 balls without a miss or foul, I would be far more easy to convince this was a legitimate record if john had 38 independent witnesses to his attempt.

Did he or didn't he? Only his hairdresser, and maybe john, know for sure!

Hu
I dunno,, man.

Isnt it a double standard to say that video needs to be evidenced and it does not suffice for witnesses (for the first 200 balls or whatever "what if" angle is being humored now)?
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
The original claim was four people were there watching. That included the racker, his wife, and john's wife. ...

Gerry, there was no claim from john's camp that any spectators were there to watch the attempt. Original claims and updated claims during the week had zero unbiased witnesses present. ...
- Schmidt's run of 626 was on May 27, 2019.
- The certification, signed by 8 witnesses, was dated the same day.
- The affidavit, referring to the certification, was signed on May 30, 2019 by one of the witnesses and a notary public.

Of the 8 people who signed the certification, 4 of them would certainly be considered part of John's "team" -- his wife, the room owner, the racker, and the racker's wife. I don't know whether the other 4 were present for the entire run. The certification says they "witnessed" the run of 626.
 

logical

apart of their 'semi public'
Silver Member
- Schmidt's run of 626 was on May 27, 2019.
- The certification, signed by 8 witnesses, was dated the same day.
- The affidavit, referring to the certification, was signed on May 30, 2019 by one of the witnesses and a notary public.

Of the 8 people who signed the certification, 4 of them would certainly be considered part of John's "team" -- his wife, the room owner, the racker, and the racker's wife. I don't know whether the other 4 were present for the entire run. The certification says they "witnessed" the run of 626.
I'm pretty sure the BCA made their decision based primarily on the video. I understand the reluctance by some to want to see the full video before being 100% convinced. It's the completely baseless and personally motivated attacks on John's integrity that reflects so poorly on the pool community that motivates me to engage in this debate about a record which frankly, I don't even really care much about.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 
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ShootingArts

Smorg is giving St Peter the 7!
Gold Member
Silver Member
- Schmidt's run of 626 was on May 27, 2019.
- The certification, signed by 8 witnesses, was dated the same day.
- The affidavit, referring to the certification, was signed on May 30, 2019 by one of the witnesses and a notary public.

Of the 8 people who signed the certification, 4 of them would certainly be considered part of John's "team" -- his wife, the room owner, the racker, and the racker's wife. I don't know whether the other 4 were present for the entire run. The certification says they "witnessed" the run of 626.

I just went by the count that john and his group was releasing. It indeed changed from four to five to six to eight.

Hu (dated 1963BC)
 

Texas Carom Club

play 1cushion & balkline
Silver Member
No need to be condescending.

Many of us do know what we're talking about and even know far more than what has been discussed here. But since you want to play that card...

Lou Figueroa

That particular comment wasn't being condescending, I'm guilty of it of course,

But no, we don't know why, and has been said many a time
 

Dan Harriman

One of the best in 14.1
Silver Member
I keep being reminded of the song from Devo 'Freedom Of Choice'. In the song's lyrics it says 'Freedom Of Choice - is what you want', then it says 'Freedom From Choice- is what you got'. With the bca/j.s 626 announcement it would make sense that 1st Option = 'The People' would like to have a CHOICE purchasing unedited footage (in disc format) 2nd Option = or go to one of their 'semi public' theatrical productions and view that material from a theater seat. Here is my sales pitch - and it is a good one. 'Freedom of Choice -is what you want' . Freedom FROM Choice - is what you got. Welcome to the fake news hollywood industry. There is zero 626 discs being sold - and or offered to the public - for purchase - yet Mosconi's run has been surpassed? As with unedited footage - in disc format - it has to be legit. The semi public and general public are one in the same - both would like the Freedom OF Choice - i.e theater seat or standard disc sales. in relation to how they choose to view this 626 footage. I too would have paid $100.00 for a disc of an unedited 626, after waiting two years to see any verifiable evidence in disc form - it's safe to say their claim is just that - a claim. No new record from schmidt - just a publicity stunt, trying to belittle Mosconi's long standing achievement. Wow the fake news crowders must have really been desperate to try and pull this stunt.
 
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Dan Harriman

One of the best in 14.1
Silver Member
OK, Danny, that’s all fine with me.

But I will tell you that I just spent an hour talking to Bobby and his version of your interactions is quite different. In any case, we spent most of the time talking about the logistics of his project and I feel it will be a great opportunity for those players that are invited and choose to participate.

Lou Figueroa
I do wish whirld pro all the success with his deal in wash uh ton dc, I think he will provide more transparency with the adjudication details than the bca/j.s. has with their 626 claim. I really do hope they record some great runs, I am sure honesty will prevail and that any of the top runs will have quality video unimpeded and unedited footage. My favorite quote = ' With Great Power - Comes Great Responsibility', I see zero responsibility or accountability with their theatrical 626 production. I am sure there will be some responsibility with Chamberlain's 14.1 challenge - but bobbie should not have stated in this thread that he would play me in 14.1 - I assume he meant for the $. Some people just need to be a blowheart and sound importet' - while others really mean what they say - I am the ladder of the two.
 
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Dan Harriman

One of the best in 14.1
Silver Member
My "premise" was simply that those well known pool players were going to the showing, in reply to you saying that no real 14.1 players would go to such a show. Everything else is what you read into it.

Pretty much, its understood that you wouldn't believe anyone having viewed it. I suspect that SVB, or Appleton, or anyone else would satisfy your conditions. So its all just a barkfest here in this thread.
Not sure what u meant with "you wouldn't believe anyone having viewed it'. I do know that it is a common sales tactic to use words like anyone or nobody - as if to try and isolate an opinion. That last part of yer sentence = having viewed it. No I have not viewed it and yes there does seem to be huge question marks all over the 626 claim - many other top players agree with my opinion. j.s/bca's phony 626 will fail the graph test - I would lay 2-1 that it would at this juncture.
 
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Dan Harriman

One of the best in 14.1
Silver Member
Danny would you take Nick Varner's word for it if he saw the unedited run and confirmed it?
I will accept the run - when I am able to view it in standard disc format i.e. at home. Would never call Nick a fibber but again - I would have paid good $ to see it in disc form - after two years of waiting to see verifiable evidence - i WILL NOT PAY FOR A SEAT AT THEIR THEATER SHOW.
 

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I will accept the run - when I am able to view it in standard disc format i.e. at home. Would never call Nick a fibber but again - I would have paid good $ to see it in disc form - after two years of waiting to see verifiable evidence - i WILL NOT PAY FOR A SEAT AT THEIR THEATER SHOW.
Now it is 2yrs.

Damn!
 

Dan Harriman

One of the best in 14.1
Silver Member
Ha ha, you can bet the house if it was in his back yard and someone put up the $50 for him, he would not attend.
U are right about that - never liked theater shows much - after the invention of cell phones. But I - and many others would have paid good $ for a disc of this so called 626 run. I have my own $ and or I bet my own. I am holding my own - and the sum of yer's. If you have any other comments or questions I stand willing and able to help clarify my position to u - usedtobee.
 
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gerryf

Well-known member
just a publicity stunt, trying to belittle Mosconi's long standing achievement. Wow the fake news crowders must have really been desperate to try and pull this stunt.

Ha! Ha!
Danny are you trying to pull off your own publicity stunt here?
You keep beating the same dead horse that you've been beating since Schmidt wowed the world of straight pool! You have repeatedly made up false stuff (NDA remember?), and you keep repeating it until your publicity stunt is exposed. Then you come up with a new one, until it too gets exposed.

Maybe some day you can set a record too! But right now, none of the prominent pool players that have viewed the video seem to be on Schmidt's side.

Do you remember this from when you ran 200_+?

Post by Danny Harriman, Mar 17 2007
It's nice to know that there is some interest in this project and thanks for the feedback, I am currently working on getting someone to help me edit the footage. Untill I here back from my computer whiz I will continue my effort on capturing a three hundred ball run on film. Wish me luck, I'll need it cause even though the table is not double shimmed it is a bit difficult to even draw whitey due to the wet environment.
Sincerely, Danny Harriman

Gee! it sounds like you were trying to foist a 'chopped up video'.

Ha! Ha! You're a lot of fun!!

Now you say you'd pay good money to see Schmidt's video 'at home'. There are posts on here where you say you have no interest in seeing the video - you just want US Naval Intelligence to analyze it.

Danny, you just keep providing so much entertainment. Ha! Ha! You're a good laugh!!
 
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