Jim Baxter Joint Protectors

Tom,

I have been nothing but polite and professional to you, in every email/PM that we have exchanged. You had been working with me since your first PM, so in all honesty, it should not have been a shock that I made them. I have been making joint protectors for over a year now and yes, I am human and do sometimes make mistakes.

We did agree on a specific design, which they were made to.

As written in a PM and in our order book:

Ebony top
Red veneer
Tannish veneer
Maple venner
Ebony body
.030 silver ring
.015 black ring
1/16" stitch ring (black red black, in maple, 8 stitches)
.015 black ring
.030 silver ring
1/4" black phenolic

3 piece set
Radial Pin
.850 joint diameter (I believe they came out to around .852 after finishing.)

I accept full responsibility that the silver rings spread out, or as Alton said "flaired" during turning. Our cutting tool has since been replaced so this should not be a further issue. I am sorry that I missed the mistake and placed them on the shipping table. We normally double the veneer colors so that they actually stand out, and I used an ivory ring (not white) in place of the maple veneer, since we have had problems with darker veneer colors bleeding into the lighter ones. I should have ok'ed this with you, but it had not been a problem in the past, again, my mistake.

You recieved a picture of the set. You stated "They look great" and asked about shipping priority mail instead of 1st class. (Which is included in all our JP prices.) You decided on priority mail and sent us your payment.

Afterwards, you sent another PM and stated that the silver rings looked bigger than the ones on your cue, and asked what options were available after you recieved them and compared them to your cue. You were told that if they were too thick, you could send them back and we would remake them or give you a refund.

You were also concerned that the finish would not match the finish on your cue, and again, were told you may return them if you were unhappy.

There would not have been an issue for us to remake them with a smaller silver ring, free of charge.

Granted since we are working from a picture, even with all the measurements stated, there are some cases that they will not match up perfectly. Only way for things to be exact is to have people send us a spare shaft, which a few people have done.

We have always stood behind our work and we have corrected any and all issues that have come up. Most everyone understands that and has worked with us to come up with a fix that both sides were happy with.

Your set was paid for and shipped, end of story. We cannot go back in time and not ship them to you, if we could, it would have already been done.

I understand you are not happy with the set. You are not happy that we shipped them to you. You are not happy with us in general. That has been stated multiple times. There is not much we can do about that now. Only thing I can do is apologize for any mistake I might have made and move on.

I am sorry that you felt my work was "shitty" and that it was not worth your time or energy to let us work with you and fix the problem.

Again, sorry.

Christy (Shop "Assisstant")
 
Jim Baxter said:
Tom,

I have been nothing but polite and professional to you, in every email/PM that we have exchanged. You had been working with me since your first PM, so in all honesty, it should not have been a shock that I made them. I have been making joint protectors for over a year now and yes, I am human and do sometimes make mistakes.

We did agree on a specific design, which they were made to.

As written in a PM and in our order book:

Ebony top
Red veneer
Tannish veneer
Maple venner
Ebony body
.030 silver ring
.015 black ring
1/16" stitch ring (black red black, in maple, 8 stitches)
.015 black ring
.030 silver ring
1/4" black phenolic

3 piece set
Radial Pin
.850 joint diameter (I believe they came out to around .852 after finishing.)

I accept full responsibility that the silver rings spread out, or as Alton said "flaired" during turning. Our cutting tool has since been replaced so this should not be a further issue. I am sorry that I missed the mistake and placed them on the shipping table. We normally double the veneer colors so that they actually stand out, and I used an ivory ring (not white) in place of the maple veneer, since we have had problems with darker veneer colors bleeding into the lighter ones. I should have ok'ed this with you, but it had not been a problem in the past, again, my mistake.

You recieved a picture of the set. You stated "They look great" and asked about shipping priority mail instead of 1st class. (Which is included in all our JP prices.) You decided on priority mail and sent us your payment.

Afterwards, you sent another PM and stated that the silver rings looked bigger than the ones on your cue, and asked what options were available after you recieved them and compared them to your cue. You were told that if they were too thick, you could send them back and we would remake them or give you a refund.

You were also concerned that the finish would not match the finish on your cue, and again, were told you may return them if you were unhappy.

There would not have been an issue for us to remake them with a smaller silver ring, free of charge.

Granted since we are working from a picture, even with all the measurements stated, there are some cases that they will not match up perfectly. Only way for things to be exact is to have people send us a spare shaft, which a few people have done.

We have always stood behind our work and we have corrected any and all issues that have come up. Most everyone understands that and has worked with us to come up with a fix that both sides were happy with.

Your set was paid for and shipped, end of story. We cannot go back in time and not ship them to you, if we could, it would have already been done.

I understand you are not happy with the set. You are not happy that we shipped them to you. You are not happy with us in general. That has been stated multiple times. There is not much we can do about that now. Only thing I can do is apologize for any mistake I might have made and move on.

I am sorry that you felt my work was "shitty" and that it was not worth your time or energy to let us work with you and fix the problem.

Again, sorry.

Christy (Shop "Assisstant")
Click to expand...


Wow.

Monstermash, I was just about to reply to your posts, but after reading this, I really do not think there is anything left to be said about the matter. By me, you or anyone.

The bottom line is mistakes were made, and you will be made whole again. End of story.
 
I have read all the posts and just wanted to say the end result was.... Jim said "send them back for a full refund". He or they have admitted the silver rings were not to spec! I don't understand why this had to blow up other than Monster wanting to hurt Jim's business out of anger. I think Monster is ticked that he agreed to accept delivery even though he thought they were not what he ordered (i.e the thickness of the silver rings). Both are at fault.... Jim's silver rings were not to spec and Monster should have said " I won't take delivery of the caps", Jim has done his part by saying he will refund the purchase price but the only conclusion I can make on Monster's part is , he is ticked he has to pay shipping to him and back to Jim. Monster's comment, "I will ask a refund from PayPal" only shows he wants to hurt Jim's business, when Jim said he would refund him personally! Just my 2 cents on this matter since Monster put it out on the forums for all to comment on.

Todd
 
I don't think that the maker can do anything more than refund / remake the JPs to make it right. When you have something custom made, mistakes can happen, miscommunication being the most common... the important part is that they acknowledge and resolve the issue sans cost to you.

Also, the fact that the assistant did the JPs... well, I imagine it is common practice for many makers to get help when overloaded, etc. They are the name that guarantees the quality, they create the methods, processes and working philosophy, but they don't necessarily have to perform every task at the shop. This happens with cues, why wouldn't it happen with JPs? Not saying it is right or wrong, just that it happens.

I have realized from reading this thread, that if not sending the cue / shafts to match them... it is better to choose a design for the JPs that won't require so exact specifications.

I once had a plain tulip set made (not by Jim Baxter) that wouldn't fit the radial pin in my butt... so tight it cracked and had to use a pliers to screw it off; I guess remote cue matching is rather difficult. I just kept the shaft protectors.
 
Well I have never bought a set of joint protecters from jim, he did however send me a free set with the sweet R-6 he sold me. I recieved the cue when he said i would and it was as described. Jim is a class act:thumbup::
 
I have had dealing with Monster since this , and I think it was just a bad moment , we all have them , he is a alright guy . Jim
 
Dead horse hell more like skeleton!

Jim Baxter said:
I have had dealing with Monster since this , and I think it was just a bad moment , we all have them , he is a alright guy . Jim
Click to expand...

Jim,your work is beautiful,you are human ( you were conceived weren't you?)
So as far as I know only 1 perfect no mistakes ever man in creation and I haven't heard of another!
I am sorry for dragging this skeleton thru the street again but when I feel someone like Jim's work bad mouthed it get my Irish up
Just know he has taken care of things that were my customers fault and I will continue to purchase JP's and cues from this talented and artistic Gentleman
Cordially
John Baker
aka Irish
 
Baxter is being criticized for workmanship and he doesn't deserve it. The issue with the rings is all on the OP........If you were dead set on the exact same size as the cue, why did you approve rings twice as large......Duh?

Because the OP couldn't visualize or comprehend that the JP would be twice the thickness as the cue's, OMG......he said it was OK.....that ends it right there. T

Besides, there's nothing wrong with the JP rings either......they look fine. If the OP wanted the exact same size, he should have so stated so with Jim and never approved the larger size rings in the protectors.

But he didn't do that did he?????/ And he never insisted that Jim make the protectors with the same size rings as the pool cue........did he???? And he OK'd making the protector set with rings that he was clearly told would be twice as thick which he completely comprehended and then explicitly approved doing.....didn't he?

And now he doesn't like the design look which he was directly involved with approving.........grow up, shut up, apologize to Jim Baxter and the rest of the Forum for wasting everyone's time with this nonsense which is nothing more than a fool's errand.

Jim, the protector set looks superb....you do not owe the buyer an apology, any refund whatsoever or making another set of protectors. The OP is just being a royal smuck......totally ignore him and his few & far between supporters or other posters suggesting that you should do anything else........NUF SED!
 
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