Lil John's Big Stakes

Setting things Straight

I don't know what the deal is with your little $200, but your hit and run tactics everytime john's name is mentioned is getting old. I've known john for almost 20 years. I remember when he was 4 foot tall and couldn't make two balls in a row. And yes he has his faults and yes he has aired a few people in his day, but not once have I seen him not make it right once he was able to. Maybe he still owes you money, maybe not, I don't know what the deal is here. Players like john go busted from time to time though, its the nature of being a gambler who takes risk. If your were to call him, I can almost guarantee that if he owes you money he would pay you, even if $200 was all that he had left to his name. Also, what is your agreement with the customer when they order a custom case? Are they forced then to buy it? My guess would be no, or else you would force them to pay all up front, right? And if you just send cases to whomever on credit, well whose fault is it when you don't recieve your money? Even so, I can assure you that John would be more than happy to get square with you, if he hasn't already. Hell, I'll pay the balance myself if you want. I still owe john for a couch I bought from him a while back. The simple fact is that in this business everyone owes from time to time....all REAL pool players who haven't owed at some point in their life please make yourself known. The only thing that seperates the people in the pool world are the ones who eventually make it right and those who don't. I know many upper tier players, one fantastic one-hole player in particular, that owes thousands to numerous people and has never even offered to pay a nickel on the balance. John is not and has never been like that, that I KNOW to be a fact.

Players like John are a rarity these days and sometimes you have to take a little bad with the good like with all things. One of his predominate characteristics is that he doesn't quit until he is flat busted most of the time. If he matches up with someone he's usually in it until the money is gone and all credit has been exhausted. I think John knows this about himself and thats the reason he tends to bet high right out of the gate these days. I mean why play someone a $500 set when you know if he gets you stuck you'll end up losing $20,000 or whatever amount you have access to. May as well force your opponent to risk what your willing to risk everytime. This may not make sense to normal people, but for guys cut from a different cloth like John it makes perfect sense. He knows he can't quit once he matches up, so he does what he can to mitigate that fault. That's one of the main differences I've noticed in John now compared to 5 years ago. In past years, he would let some nit shoot $500 at his $20,000, not now though. If you want to play this kid now days, you have to be willing to risk you entire bank roll like he does everytime. Good for you John, make these guys risk something for a change......thats when you find out what a player is made of....the ultimate test. I know great players that have never risked a penny in their life and yea they may play better than john, but if both are matched up at the same time in the same place....well, I think I'll be watching the kid who risks everthing, everytime he screw his stick together.
There's something to be said for a kid who has been down and out as many times as John has and has stormed back everytime stronger than before. He gained my respect a long time ago. He's a good guy, he's never done drugs, and he's devoted his life to the game that all of us love. I can honestly say that he's been in some of the most exciting matches that I've ever seen on a pool table and I've seen a few in my day. Give him a break Mr. Justis, he's one of the good guys.
 
Housestick said:
I don't know what the deal is with your little $200, but your hit and run tactics everytime john's name is mentioned is getting old. I've known john for almost 20 years. I remember when he was 4 foot tall and couldn't make two balls in a row. And yes he has his faults and yes he has aired a few people in his day, but not once have I seen him not make it right once he was able to. Maybe he still owes you money, maybe not, I don't know what the deal is here. Players like john go busted from time to time though, its the nature of being a gambler who takes risk. If your were to call him, I can almost guarantee that if he owes you money he would pay you, even if $200 was all that he had left to his name. Also, what is your agreement with the customer when they order a custom case? Are they forced then to buy it? My guess would be no, or else you would force them to pay all up front, right? And if you just send cases to whomever on credit, well whose fault is it when you don't recieve your money? Even so, I can assure you that John would be more than happy to get square with you, if he hasn't already. Hell, I'll pay the balance myself if you want. I still owe john for a couch I bought from him a while back. The simple fact is that in this business everyone owes from time to time....all REAL pool players who haven't owed at some point in their life please make yourself known. The only thing that seperates the people in the pool world are the ones who eventually make it right and those who don't. I know many upper tier players, one fantastic one-hole player in particular, that owes thousands to numerous people and has never even offered to pay a nickel on the balance. John is not and has never been like that, that I KNOW to be a fact.

Players like John are a rarity these days and sometimes you have to take a little bad with the good like with all things. One of his predominate characteristics is that he doesn't quit until he is flat busted most of the time. If he matches up with someone he's usually in it until the money is gone and all credit has been exhausted. I think John knows this about himself and thats the reason he tends to bet high right out of the gate these days. I mean why play someone a $500 set when you know if he gets you stuck you'll end up losing $20,000 or whatever amount you have access to. May as well force your opponent to risk what your willing to risk everytime. This may not make sense to normal people, but for guys cut from a different cloth like John it makes perfect sense. He knows he can't quit once he matches up, so he does what he can to mitigate that fault. That's one of the main differences I've noticed in John now compared to 5 years ago. In past years, he would let some nit shoot $500 at his $20,000, not now though. If you want to play this kid now days, you have to be willing to risk you entire bank roll like he does everytime. Good for you John, make these guys risk something for a change......thats when you find out what a player is made of....the ultimate test. I know great players that have never risked a penny in their life and yea they may play better than john, but if both are matched up at the same time in the same place....well, I think I'll be watching the kid who risks everthing, everytime he screw his stick together.
There's something to be said for a kid who has been down and out as many times as John has and has stormed back everytime stronger than before. He gained my respect a long time ago. He's a good guy, he's never done drugs, and he's devoted his life to the game that all of us love. I can honestly say that he's been in some of the most exciting matches that I've ever seen on a pool table and I've seen a few in my day. Give him a break Mr. Justis, he's one of the good guys.


Good guy bad guy has nothing to do with it. If he can bet 10 or 20 thousand
surley he can pay the little $200.00 he owes. Mr. Justis should not have to look for him to get his money.
 
I agree completely with you roadrunner, and I don't know exactly what transpired between Jack Justis and John. I've been in the military now for a few years and haven't spoken with John in a while. I'm sure there is more to this story than is known though. I've never seen John not pay someone that he owes, I don't buy that. Not to say that it didn't happen, I just find it hard to believe. Now I have many times seen him owe for a while when he gets cleaned out, but he ALWAYS pays eventually. Who hasn't owed at one point or another though. Everyone goes bust occassionally, its part of the game. To be clear, I have nothing against Jack Justis, hell I've owned a few of his cases through the years. (among the nicest out there in my opinion) And he certainly has a right to complain if he got stiffed, but I'm just suggesting that he give John a phone call like a mature adult instead of demeaning his character on this message board. Sorry if some don't agree, but he's my friend and he deserves better.
 
Just wanted to mention that I heard it through the pool grapevine that the picture used by Sports Illustrated of Little John came from none other than AzBilliards' Diana Hoppe [Poolpics by Hoppe].

Thanks for sharing the article. I knew that it was coming forthwith, but didn't know when. Great read.:)

JAM
 
Housestick said:
I don't know what the deal is with your little $200, but your hit and run tactics everytime john's name is mentioned is getting old. I've known john for almost 20 years. I remember when he was 4 foot tall and couldn't make two balls in a row. And yes he has his faults and yes he has aired a few people in his day, but not once have I seen him not make it right once he was able to. Maybe he still owes you money, maybe not, I don't know what the deal is here. Players like john go busted from time to time though, its the nature of being a gambler who takes risk. If your were to call him, I can almost guarantee that if he owes you money he would pay you, even if $200 was all that he had left to his name. Also, what is your agreement with the customer when they order a custom case? Are they forced then to buy it? My guess would be no, or else you would force them to pay all up front, right? And if you just send cases to whomever on credit, well whose fault is it when you don't recieve your money? Even so, I can assure you that John would be more than happy to get square with you, if he hasn't already. Hell, I'll pay the balance myself if you want. I still owe john for a couch I bought from him a while back. The simple fact is that in this business everyone owes from time to time....all REAL pool players who haven't owed at some point in their life please make yourself known. The only thing that seperates the people in the pool world are the ones who eventually make it right and those who don't. I know many upper tier players, one fantastic one-hole player in particular, that owes thousands to numerous people and has never even offered to pay a nickel on the balance. John is not and has never been like that, that I KNOW to be a fact.

Players like John are a rarity these days and sometimes you have to take a little bad with the good like with all things. One of his predominate characteristics is that he doesn't quit until he is flat busted most of the time. If he matches up with someone he's usually in it until the money is gone and all credit has been exhausted. I think John knows this about himself and thats the reason he tends to bet high right out of the gate these days. I mean why play someone a $500 set when you know if he gets you stuck you'll end up losing $20,000 or whatever amount you have access to. May as well force your opponent to risk what your willing to risk everytime. This may not make sense to normal people, but for guys cut from a different cloth like John it makes perfect sense. He knows he can't quit once he matches up, so he does what he can to mitigate that fault. That's one of the main differences I've noticed in John now compared to 5 years ago. In past years, he would let some nit shoot $500 at his $20,000, not now though. If you want to play this kid now days, you have to be willing to risk you entire bank roll like he does everytime. Good for you John, make these guys risk something for a change......thats when you find out what a player is made of....the ultimate test. I know great players that have never risked a penny in their life and yea they may play better than john, but if both are matched up at the same time in the same place....well, I think I'll be watching the kid who risks everthing, everytime he screw his stick together.
There's something to be said for a kid who has been down and out as many times as John has and has stormed back everytime stronger than before. He gained my respect a long time ago. He's a good guy, he's never done drugs, and he's devoted his life to the game that all of us love. I can honestly say that he's been in some of the most exciting matches that I've ever seen on a pool table and I've seen a few in my day. Give him a break Mr. Justis, he's one of the good guys.

Now that is what I call a pointless ramble.
 
It's not pointless in the least.

Jack Justis is ribbing him, but I agree, it gets a bit old.

First hand, John told me that he put a $300-350 deposit (I don't recall the exact amount) and had this case made. When it was finished he was to give Jack the rest of the money, which was $200. That time came, he didn't have it. LJ really wanted the case, but couldn't get it, which I understand.

What I don't understand is why Jack continues to bring it up. You should be happy as shit, Jack, you made somewhere around $700 on that case!! You got John's deposit AND sold it on ebay for over $300!!!

:rolleyes:
 
And not to mention the fact that you got everyone and their mother jabbing John over the case...even on other messege boards...geez.

Even I only whine here about Kevin Carson...and even then I have let that go.

Shorty
 
Shorty said:
And not to mention the fact that you got everyone and their mother jabbing John over the case...even on other messege boards...geez.

Even I only whine here about Kevin Carson...and even then I have let that go.

Shorty



Sorry new here but was a lurker for a while! But I remember you whinning about how Scott ripped off $25 from you!!:D :D :D
 
Anyone know the title to the thread about the Lil Jon/Ruberto scandal? I'd be interested in reading that.
 
Housestick said:
And if you just send cases to whomever on credit, well whose fault is it when you don't recieve your money?

What a great concept.
When you get ripped off its your fault!

Anyone willing to send me a custom cue on credit?
If I dont pay you its your fault Yo Ho Ho!
 
Reminds me of a guy with 'heart' that I busted once- owed me near $1k...mentioned it a couple of months later...he replied, "now you asked for it, you ain't never gonna get it"!
 
High stakes gamblers vs gamblers with limits

Housestick said:
I don't know what the deal is with your little $200, but your hit and run tactics everytime john's name is mentioned is getting old. I've known john for almost 20 years. I remember when he was 4 foot tall and couldn't make two balls in a row. And yes he has his faults and yes he has aired a few people in his day, but not once have I seen him not make it right once he was able to. Maybe he still owes you money, maybe not, I don't know what the deal is here. Players like john go busted from time to time though, its the nature of being a gambler who takes risk. If your were to call him, I can almost guarantee that if he owes you money he would pay you, even if $200 was all that he had left to his name. Also, what is your agreement with the customer when they order a custom case? Are they forced then to buy it? My guess would be no, or else you would force them to pay all up front, right? And if you just send cases to whomever on credit, well whose fault is it when you don't recieve your money? Even so, I can assure you that John would be more than happy to get square with you, if he hasn't already. Hell, I'll pay the balance myself if you want. I still owe john for a couch I bought from him a while back. The simple fact is that in this business everyone owes from time to time....all REAL pool players who haven't owed at some point in their life please make yourself known. The only thing that seperates the people in the pool world are the ones who eventually make it right and those who don't. I know many upper tier players, one fantastic one-hole player in particular, that owes thousands to numerous people and has never even offered to pay a nickel on the balance. John is not and has never been like that, that I KNOW to be a fact.

Players like John are a rarity these days and sometimes you have to take a little bad with the good like with all things. One of his predominate characteristics is that he doesn't quit until he is flat busted most of the time. If he matches up with someone he's usually in it until the money is gone and all credit has been exhausted. I think John knows this about himself and thats the reason he tends to bet high right out of the gate these days. I mean why play someone a $500 set when you know if he gets you stuck you'll end up losing $20,000 or whatever amount you have access to. May as well force your opponent to risk what your willing to risk everytime. This may not make sense to normal people, but for guys cut from a different cloth like John it makes perfect sense. He knows he can't quit once he matches up, so he does what he can to mitigate that fault. That's one of the main differences I've noticed in John now compared to 5 years ago. In past years, he would let some nit shoot $500 at his $20,000, not now though. If you want to play this kid now days, you have to be willing to risk you entire bank roll like he does everytime. Good for you John, make these guys risk something for a change......thats when you find out what a player is made of....the ultimate test. I know great players that have never risked a penny in their life and yea they may play better than john, but if both are matched up at the same time in the same place....well, I think I'll be watching the kid who risks everthing, everytime he screw his stick together.
There's something to be said for a kid who has been down and out as many times as John has and has stormed back everytime stronger than before. He gained my respect a long time ago. He's a good guy, he's never done drugs, and he's devoted his life to the game that all of us love. I can honestly say that he's been in some of the most exciting matches that I've ever seen on a pool table and I've seen a few in my day. Give him a break Mr. Justis, he's one of the good guys.
With no regard to the alleged $200 owed on a pool case, are you implying that in the case of a high stakes gambler that goes bust that his obligations to others should be put on hold as a token of respect? If that is the precedent of high stakes gambling why gamble such small amounts of $50-60 grand?
 
I think HouseStick's post is getting disected in too many different ways. The man merely stated his opinion on the subject. He was very thorough in his belief of Lil' Jons reputation as a stand up guy, is there anything wrong with that? He even offered to pay the $200 owed to Justis because he knows he'll get paid from Lil' Jon. Granted, Lil' Jon may owe Justis the $200 for a custom case he ordered, in which he did pay a deposit, but he didn't get the case, from what I understand. So who's losing money here? None of us know what the whole story is here other than Lil Jon owes $200. Would this have even come up without the recent article of him betting tens of thousands of dollars a set? I don't think so. Oh well, who the hell am I to put my .02 in anyway? I'm just a guy with an opinion and I love to exersise that right to share it. Peace, John.
 
Rude Dog said:
I think HouseStick's post is getting disected in too many different ways. The man merely stated his opinion on the subject. He was very thorough in his belief of Lil' Jons reputation as a stand up guy, is there anything wrong with that? He even offered to pay the $200 owed to Justis because he knows he'll get paid from Lil' Jon. Granted, Lil' Jon may owe Justis the $200 for a custom case he ordered, in which he did pay a deposit, but he didn't get the case, from what I understand. So who's losing money here? None of us know what the whole story is here other than Lil Jon owes $200. Would this have even come up without the recent article of him betting tens of thousands of dollars a set? I don't think so. Oh well, who the hell am I to put my .02 in anyway? I'm just a guy with an opinion and I love to exersise that right to share it. Peace, John.

He doesn't owe Jack shit.... lol

He paid Jack $350 deposit, case was made, LJ didn't have the $200 to cover the full price, Jack sold the case on ebay. The only person out anything is LJ the initial deposit.
 
1pRoscoe said:
He doesn't owe Jack shit.... lol

He paid Jack $350 deposit, case was made, LJ didn't have the $200 to cover the full price, Jack sold the case on ebay. The only person out anything is LJ the initial deposit.

I can't believe I am responding to this but this is the facts as they happened.

Last March at the SBE, Sarah Rousey came to my booth and introduced LilJon and stated he would like one of my cases. I wrote up the order which came to a total of $620 including shipping. I explained to him that I do not discount my prices but since he was well known on the gambling circuit and a friend of Sarah's I would make an exception to my policy and reduced the price of the case to $300 including shipping. He mentioned that he was short and gave me $100 deposit and said, just call me when the case is ready and I will send the $200 balance. I called Jon around the end of April and told him the case was ready to ship. He asked if I could bring the case to Vegas on May 15 since he would be playing in the 8-Ball Championships. I agreed and gave him my cell # to call when he arrived. After not hearing from him, I called and was informed he would be there the next day. Several days passed and no word. Called again and was informed he would not be making the trip to Vegas. He told me he would put a check in the mail and that I was to ship the case upon our return to Florida. Upon our return to Florida, you guessed it, no check. We then called at least 5 times and each time was given excuses about being robbed twice in one week but would send the check in a few days. The days grew into weeks until I finally gave up and put the case on ebay. Case sold on ebay for $320 plus the $100 deposit. It's not about the $200 I lost for being the nice guy, its about honesty and integrity. When someone tells you one thing and does another, it leaves a bad taste in your mouth. I had just about gotten rid of that taste when the article appeared. I did learn a lesson though.....get the money up front....LOL.
 
Jack Justis said:
A friend of Sarah's I would make an exception to my policy and reduced the price of the case to $300 including shipping.


Tell you what Jack, I am a friend of sarah's *wink ,wink* I will give you $300 for a case and I havent even seen the thing. Do you want the $300 now? Give me your paypal info I need to buy myself a christmas present anyways!
 
I guess the saying is right..... there are three sides to a story.

Jack - my apologies, I was given first hand information two which didn't appear to be accurate, however I think there is also a third, but it's irrelevant at this point.
 
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