Mosconi/Reyes Cup

Flakeandrun

Flakeandrun

Well-known member
Non-playing captains... yawn.
Have to say it - Ridiculous concept.
There must be a more interesting way to involve Reyes in the inaugural event.
 
I'd go with...
Captains should play a rack to determine first break in team match. Call it "the 5 minute lag" match. I don't think they should be playing for points, but a ceremonial rack to kick things off with first break as the prize, i'd def be down for. And if it's Reyes...let him play a lag rack to start each day.
 
WobblyStroke said:
I'd go with...
Captains should play a rack to determine first break in team match. Call it "the 5 minute lag" match. I don't think they should be playing for points, but a ceremonial rack to kick things off with first break as the prize, i'd def be down for. And if it's Reyes...let him play a lag rack to start each day.
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I think Moscow/Reyes cup should always have playing captains moving forward.
For this event, I understand it is nice to include the big dog in some way. I like your idea of playing a rack for the lag in this event!
But having non-playing captains in general is just...
 
Flakeandrun said:
I think Moscow/Reyes cup should always have playing captains moving forward.
For this event, I understand it is nice to include the big dog in some way. I like your idea of playing a rack for the lag in this event!
But having non-playing captains in general is just...
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I'd rather see a 15-18 year old thrown in the ring.

Now you leave Efren alone. Efen will tell you what he's gonna do.
 
While I agree that having non-playing captains is unnecessary, it's not a bad way to recognize former greats.

Still, one must guess that Matchroom saw it differently, as they didn't go with one of the European Hall of Famers past or present such as Feijen, Appleton, Souquet, Ortmann, Hohmann, or Immonen. I think the choice of Immonen, who might have turned down the offer for health reasons, would have pleased many pool fans.

I'm sure Karl Boyes, who brings high enthusiasm to any event in which he plays any role, will prove a very solid choice as non-playing captain of Team Europe.

Yes, there were other ways of paying tribute to Efren (the Asian Mosconi), but I'll support Matchroom's decision here.
 
sjm said:
While I agree that having non-playing captains is unnecessary, it's not a bad way to recognize former greats.
...
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Considering the effect Johann Ruijsink seems to have had on teams in the past, I disagree with this. On the other hand, some captains have been worse than worthless.
 
Bob Jewett said:
Most players are incapable of leading a team. The non-playing captain has been a very large factor in the Mosconi Cup teams successes in the past, both positively and negatively.
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Should they become more capable? I think it would grow the sport, and certainly adds to its watchability for me (in a consumer sense). Rather than having someone being a post-game interview specialist, it becomes a true team-based game.
I'd love to see more team based events. I liked watching Zen Vs. Marboys recently. I think it adds a dimension to pool.
 
Bob Jewett said:
Considering the effect Johann Ruijsink seems to have had on teams in the past, I disagree with this. On the other hand, some captains have been worse than worthless.
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Please. Let's not pretend that these captains are working hard to train their respective teams for victory. Come to think of it, the teams haven't even been fully selected yet.

This is in no way similar to when Johan brought Team USA to train at his academy in Russia in the days leading up to the Kremlin Cup.
 
sjm said:
Please. Let's not pretend that these captains are working hard to train their respective teams for victory. Come to think of it, the teams haven't even been fully selected yet.

This is in no way similar to when Johan brought Team USA to train at his academy in Russia in the days leading up to the Kremlin Cup.
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I think being a captain, and more involved in the team, playing alongside them etc is a good string to the bow of pool, or it's promotion as a 'sport'
There is space for individual competition, and team-based endeavors moving forward I think. I quite like, and support the idea of franchise teams of players, or something along those lines (as mentioned, like the Yuan8/Zen team vs Marboys/TP team.
The match-ups I've seen have been entertaining.
 
if reyes would be in team asia then the opponent team would also need a veteran, for fairness, and europe doesn't have as many. ralf comes to mind but he's like 15 years younger than efren.
 
skogstokig said:
if reyes would be in team asia then the opponent team would also need a veteran, for fairness, and europe doesn't have as many. ralf comes to mind but he's like 15 years younger than efren.
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So don't put them in the team... It should be a role that honors his greatness, not proves old age. This is where some kind of ceremonial role, commentary role would be better. Again, not sure what works exactly, hence why I posted the thread to see what others thought :)
Personally, as mentioned, I just find 'non-playing captains' adds absolutely zero.
 
Flakeandrun said:
So don't put them in the team... It should be a role that honors his greatness, not proves old age. This is where some kind of ceremonial role, commentary role would be better. Again, not sure what works exactly, hence why I posted the thread to see what others thought :)
Personally, as mentioned, I just find 'non-playing captains' adds absolutely zero.
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i heard somewhere pinoy tv will broadcast it (?) so presumably they will have pinoy comms. maybe they will have efren on, we don't know. after all the captain has already done most of his job when a match is on, picked the wildcards, picked the match line up. can really only be a moral support at that point
 
skogstokig said:
i heard somewhere pinoy tv will broadcast it (?) so presumably they will have pinoy comms. maybe they will have efren on, we don't know. after all the captain has already done most of his job when a match is on, picked the wildcards, picked the match line up. can really only be a moral support at that point
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They've committed to non-playing captains now, and I would guess that you are pretty much spot on. Just saying, I think it's a waste of creating a potentially more interesting spectacle.
 
From what I can tell, the Mosconi Cup non-playing captains and vice captains have been as follows, with the captain(s) of the winning team in bold:

Year -- Team USA, Team Europe

2003 -- Nick Varner, Oliver Ortmann
2006 -- Varner, Johan Ruijsink (tie)
2007 -- Kim Davenport, Ruijsink
2008 -- Varner, Alex Lely
2009 -- Varner, Lely

2010 -- Varner, Ruijsink
2011 -- Charlie Williams, Ruijsink
2012 -- C. J. Wiley, Ruijsink
2013 -- Buddy Hall (vice), Ruijsink
2014 -- Mark Wilson, Ruijsink

2015 -- Wilson, Marcus Chamat
2016 -- Wilson, Chamat
2017 -- Ruijsink, Chamat
2018 -- Ruijsink & Jeremy Jones (vice), Chamat
2019 -- Ruijsink & Jones (vice), Chamat

2020 -- Jones & Joey Gray (vice), Lely & Karl Boyes (vice)
2021 -- none, Lely & Boyes (vice)
2022 -- Jones, Lely
2023 -- Jones, Ralph Eckert
 
AtLarge said:
From what I can tell, the Mosconi Cup non-playing captains and vice captains have been as follows, with the captain(s) of the winning team in bold:

Year -- Team USA, Team Europe

2003 -- Nick Varner, Oliver Ortmann
2006 -- Varner, Johan Ruijsink (tie)
2007 -- Kim Davenport, Ruijsink
2008 -- Varner, Alex Lely
2009 -- Varner, Lely

2010 -- Varner, Ruijsink
2011 -- Charlie Williams, Ruijsink
2012 -- C. J. Wiley, Ruijsink
2013 -- Buddy Hall (vice), Ruijsink
2014 -- Mark Wilson, Ruijsink

2015 -- Wilson, Marcus Chamat
2016 -- Wilson, Chamat
2017 -- Ruijsink, Chamat
2018 -- Ruijsink & Jeremy Jones (vice), Chamat
2019 -- Ruijsink & Jones (vice), Chamat

2020 -- Jones & Joey Gray (vice), Lely & Karl Boyes (vice)
2021 -- none, Lely & Boyes (vice)
2022 -- Jones, Lely
2023 -- Jones, Ralph Eckert
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Interesting and insightful as ever AtLarge!
Genuinely struggle to see the purpose in a non-playing captain...

I would understand if it had some managerial aspect, coaching etc. Like a football manager - but these guys are hardly Alex Ferguson's... Just seems like they are there for a bit of banter and post-game babble.

Playing captain with a team manager, sure, that could work - or just a playing captain; in charge of strategy, or a coaching element. Whatever.

But like I said, having some element of Team based competition is interesting to me as a consumer. Could be City based teams, Franchise based teams, country based... whatever. Franchise or City based I like, because it feeds into things like World Teams, and Mosconi/Reyes cup (continent based teams)

Doesn't take anything away from the individual game, simply adds a new dimension to potential pool fans.
 
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