NaySayers and YeaSayers

I'm not here to argue, just here with a question. I've never seen anyone playing a televised match (pro) making weird pivots to the CB. Do no pros need this or what's the deal?
BTW I think noone can be declared the winner until after a few head to head matches are played.
People who use the cte based aiming systems vs people who can see where to hit the OB just by looking at it.
Put some money up and stream them. I'd watch if just for the comedy factor alone.

At the end of the rainbow, you will find a pivoting system and manual cte got you there. A year from now i will tell you i use no aiming system other than i use a pivot and contact point on the ob. If you know of a pro who uses a pivot, ask him how he got there... this is my opinion.

Dr Dave i had that shot confirmed and the genius of this system is its simplicity, i will leave your other comments alone. :wink:

Sorry to all that has been offended by my punctuation in this post, i guess im not as bright as you all lol :thumbup:

I leave this for all those smart guys like PJ.banks, etc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKR0l7odlVI&feature=related
 
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They see the puzzle finally coming together now and understanding what the system really is about and that there are no negatives to it!


I hate to break it to you.....but most all of the naysayers had all the puzzle pieces put together long before the yaysayers...

The naysayers never said anything negative about the system....They just said it was not mathematically "exact" (as was claimed by yaysayers)......(unless of course the yaysayers can identify all of the pivot points for all of the shots)....as a matter of fact they even said that the method had benefits for those that struggled with PSR and alignment.....Even the head yaysayer JoeyA has said on multiple occasions that the method has helped him to find center CB.....how on earth could JoeyA (or anyone) consistently pocket balls without consistently being able to identify center CB....The unintended English had to cause a few misses over the years....until JoeyA got a "feel" for adapting to his offcenter hits.....That alone could benefit his shotmakeing....his improved shot making may have had nothing to do with the rest of the method at all....It may have been that one simple thing....We will never really know.

It would not be the first time someone found a seemingly insignificant detail that turned out to be a major detail that drastically improved their shotmaking.....I think it is called an Epiphany???

And BTW....good for JoeyA or anyone that has drastically improved their shot making from CTE or any variation therof....(or any other method for that matter)!!!!!

What I think is happening...even though they will NEVER admit it.....I think the yaysayers are finally coming to grips with the fact that that there is actually some feel involved in part of the method (as is with ANY method)....

Also....weather the steps of the method are exact or not was never disputed by the Naysayers.

The only real problem that the Naysayers had was understanding the exact chameleon like steps to the CTE method.....This is how you do it....no this is how you do it...her let me make a video.....disregard that video...it is all wrong........no you need to visualize two CTE lines.....no you just need one and then just follow the Arc (of the covenant probably) and the pivot point works itself out.....etc. etc. etc.

I think at this point....all of the yaysayers need to de-certify to save there "ars....ets":wink:
 
I hate to break it to you.....but most all of the naysayers had all the puzzle pieces put together long before the yaysayers...

The naysayers never said anything negative about the system....They just said it was not mathematically "exact" (as was claimed by yaysayers)......(unless of course the yaysayers can identify all of the pivot points for all of the shots)....as a matter of fact they even said that the method had benefits for those that struggled with PSR and alignment.....Even the head yaysayer JoeyA has said on multiple occasions that the method has helped him to find center CB.....how on earth could JoeyA (or anyone) consistently pocket balls without consistently being able to identify center CB....The unintended English had to cause a few misses over the years....until JoeyA got a "feel" for adapting to his offcenter hits.....That alone could benefit his shotmakeing....his improved shot making may have had nothing to do with the rest of the method at all....It may have been that one simple thing....We will never really know.

It would not be the first time someone found a seemingly insignificant detail that turned out to be a major detail that drastically improved their shotmaking.....I think it is called an Epiphany???

And BTW....good for JoeyA or anyone that has drastically improved their shot making from CTE or any variation therof....(or any other method for that matter)!!!!!

What I think is happening...even though they will NEVER admit it.....I think the yaysayers are finally coming to grips with the fact that that there is actually some feel involved in part of the method (as is with ANY method)....

Also....weather the steps of the method are exact or not was never disputed by the Naysayers.

The only real problem that the Naysayers had was understanding the exact chameleon like steps to the CTE method.....This is how you do it....no this is how you do it...her let me make a video.....disregard that video...it is all wrong........no you need to visualize two CTE lines.....no you just need one and then just follow the Arc (of the covenant probably) and the pivot point works itself out.....etc. etc. etc.

I think at this point....all of the yaysayers need to de-certify to save there "ars....ets":wink:

Im sure this post was better than the last one you directed at me, but my job is done and i have had enough of you guys going back and forth and i feel everything has been cleared up now :thumbup:
 
Come on, JoeyA, tell us what really happened between you and Lock N Load. Inquiring minds want to know.
Was it something he said? Something he did, like call your house at an inappropriate time? I mean c'mon man, you two were like milk and cookies there for a while, then all of a sudden kaboom, you kick poor LNL to the curb. I felt sorry for the dude.
Afterwards you declare a victory over the naysayers, in your ever popular big blue font, when there were only three of you involved in the thread in the first place, with the exception of LNL of course, who by now has taken you off his guest list and placed you on his shit list.
Maybe you oughtta leave the hippy lettuce alone for awhile.
 
...most all of the naysayers had all the puzzle pieces put together long before the yaysayers...
The "naysayers" had these "Hal Houle x angle" systems figured out as soon as they popped up on the internet 15 or more years ago. All the believers then believed the systems were "exact" too and all the rational people knew they weren't. Nothing has changed since then except the packaging - the latest "innovation" is pivoting.

It's always the system users themselves who seem unable to understand why things can't possibly work the way they want to believe.

pj
chgo
 
Facts here....facts there....

why some guys are getting that kind of aggressive........
Perhaps it would make sense to create a new forum-section like:
"CTE-Battlefield"

......
 
The "naysayers" had these "Hal Houle x angle" systems figured out as soon as they popped up on the internet 15 or more years ago. All the believers then believed the systems were "exact" too and all the rational people knew they weren't. Nothing has changed since then except the packaging - the latest "innovation" is pivoting.

It's always the system users themselves who seem unable to understand why things can't possibly work the way they want to believe.

pj
chgo

So Hal's only three shots in pool is wrong ?:confused:
 
Ratta, I did not do anything to anyone!

Facts here....facts there....

why some guys are getting that kind of aggressive........
Perhaps it would make sense to create a new forum-section like:
"CTE-Battlefield"

......

And I have been stepped on talked about in a bad way. I have no Idea why? You can't even be friends with a person these days!
Regards,
Lock N Load.
 
proof trumps theory every time

And I have been stepped on talked about in a bad way. I have no Idea why? You can't even be friends with a person these days!
Regards,
Lock N Load.


LnL,

I spent years working in Research and Development. What I learned there was that all of the theory, all of the things they could or couldn't prove on a piece of paper or computer didn't amount to a hill of beans when the rubber met the road. Ultimately what happened out in the real world was what mattered. After reading page after page of high blown thoughts pro and con about CTE I know little more about it than when I started. I think I learned one thing from one of Stan's posts.

On the other hand I see a very solid player that I have watched for years kick his game up a notch using CTE. When someone has been playing for a lifetime and suddenly his game takes a jump, that is huge. Fifty pages of testimonials about how wonderful CTE or Pro1 is wouldn't impress me as much as that one real world "proof" that it works.

Exact or inexact amounts to arguing over how many angels fit on the head of a pin. We can argue with equal validity that anything that is done by a human is exact or inexact, depends on how we define exact. How exact is a baseball players swing? Not very, it isn't exactly the same twice. Yet it often results in two objects traveling at a very high speed meeting at the one intersection that will get the desired result.

A small percentage of people will learn to use CTE/Pro1 effectively for themselves regardless of how or why and think it is wonderful. Most people won't find it effective in their testing for whatever reason and will decide it is snake oil. That is the way things always work out.

Years ago I discovered that I could work to tolerances using hand tools that it would be almost impossible to duplicate in the finest tool room relying on machines. The same technique is credited with putting several people in a Hall of Fame, bettering a world record, and making a man bald! :D :D :D The lesson is that we don't all get the same results from the same thing. (Last I knew the bald headed man is still working on getting in the Hall of Fame though.)

Hu
 
LnL,

I spent years working in Research and Development. What I learned there was that all of the theory, all of the things they could or couldn't prove on a piece of paper or computer didn't amount to a hill of beans when the rubber met the road. Ultimately what happened out in the real world was what mattered. After reading page after page of high blown thoughts pro and con about CTE I know little more about it than when I started. I think I learned one thing from one of Stan's posts.

On the other hand I see a very solid player that I have watched for years kick his game up a notch using CTE. When someone has been playing for a lifetime and suddenly his game takes a jump, that is huge. Fifty pages of testimonials about how wonderful CTE or Pro1 is wouldn't impress me as much as that one real world "proof" that it works.

Exact or inexact amounts to arguing over how many angels fit on the head of a pin. We can argue with equal validity that anything that is done by a human is exact or inexact, depends on how we define exact. How exact is a baseball players swing? Not very, it isn't exactly the same twice. Yet it often results in two objects traveling at a very high speed meeting at the one intersection that will get the desired result.

A small percentage of people will learn to use CTE/Pro1 effectively for themselves regardless of how or why and think it is wonderful. Most people won't find it effective in their testing for whatever reason and will decide it is snake oil. That is the way things always work out.

Years ago I discovered that I could work to tolerances using hand tools that it would be almost impossible to duplicate in the finest tool room relying on machines. The same technique is credited with putting several people in a Hall of Fame, bettering a world record, and making a man bald! :D :D :D The lesson is that we don't all get the same results from the same thing. (Last I knew the bald headed man is still working on getting in the Hall of Fame though.)

Hu

I am truly hopeful that the vast majority of readers here understand this to be the truth, Hu. All the arguing and bickering back and forth isn't truly "proving" anything, save for creating some intersting discussion.

It obviously works to some extent for some people. It doesn't for some others, meaning ones who have actually tried it. (As opposed to the ones who simply dismiss it out of hand, with no first hand evidence of what is good about it and what isn't.)

That should be enough.

Nicely done, Hu. You ought to hang out here more often. :p
 
The "naysayers" had these "Hal Houle x angle" systems figured out as soon as they popped up on the internet 15 or more years ago. All the believers then believed the systems were "exact" too and all the rational people knew they weren't. Nothing has changed since then except the packaging - the latest "innovation" is pivoting.

It's always the system users themselves who seem unable to understand why things can't possibly work the way they want to believe.

pj
chgo

Just posted on Stevie Moore's Facebook:

"Won Mezz Classic in Vineland NJ at Q Ball Billiards. Thank You Jose Garcia and room for your hospitality. I would like to say thank you to my sponsors as well. Mr Cuess II in Atlanta GA, Layer 3 Communications Atlanta GA, Hamricks Clothing Gaffney SC. Also,* Stan Shuffett @ justcueit.com for his ever giving knowledge. Pro One is power!"*

I guess Stevie Moore is a Yaysayer.

Also....

CJ Wiley teaches a "reverse" model of what we're discussing here. He teaches 3 CB targets that are aligned to 2 OB targets. He was damn near unbeatable a few years ago when he was playing. Is he a whack job who is giving out bad information as well?

I guess you know everything whereas REAL players don't know anything. I wonder why pros don't go to PJ for information?????? You should call Stevie and CJ up and offer them some help.
 
Just posted on Stevie Moore's Facebook:

"Won Mezz Classic in Vineland NJ at Q Ball Billiards. Thank You Jose Garcia and room for your hospitality. I would like to say thank you to my sponsors as well. Mr Cuess II in Atlanta GA, Layer 3 Communications Atlanta GA, Hamricks Clothing Gaffney SC. Also,* Stan Shuffett @ justcueit.com for his ever giving knowledge. Pro One is power!"*

I guess Stevie Moore is a Yaysayer.

Also....

CJ Wiley teaches a "reverse" model of what we're discussing here. He teaches 3 CB targets that are aligned to 2 OB targets. He was damn near unbeatable a few years ago when he was playing. Is he a whack job who is giving out bad information as well?

I guess you know everything whereas REAL players don't know anything. I wonder why pros don't go to PJ for information?????? You should call Stevie and CJ up and offer them some help.

Iron_Sheik_Segal.JPG


Pic posted because it says I can't give you any more rep
 
Just posted on Stevie Moore's Facebook:

"Won Mezz Classic in Vineland NJ at Q Ball Billiards. Thank You Jose Garcia and room for your hospitality. I would like to say thank you to my sponsors as well. Mr Cuess II in Atlanta GA, Layer 3 Communications Atlanta GA, Hamricks Clothing Gaffney SC. Also,* Stan Shuffett @ justcueit.com for his ever giving knowledge. Pro One is power!"*

I guess Stevie Moore is a Yaysayer.

Also....

CJ Wiley teaches a "reverse" model of what we're discussing here. He teaches 3 CB targets that are aligned to 2 OB targets. He was damn near unbeatable a few years ago when he was playing. Is he a whack job who is giving out bad information as well?

I guess you know everything whereas REAL players don't know anything. I wonder why pros don't go to PJ for information?????? You should call Stevie and CJ up and offer them some help.

Great post. I think the answer is obvious.
 
Just posted on Stevie Moore's Facebook:

"Won Mezz Classic in Vineland NJ at Q Ball Billiards. Thank You Jose Garcia and room for your hospitality. I would like to say thank you to my sponsors as well. Mr Cuess II in Atlanta GA, Layer 3 Communications Atlanta GA, Hamricks Clothing Gaffney SC. Also,* Stan Shuffett @ justcueit.com for his ever giving knowledge. Pro One is power!"*

I guess Stevie Moore is a Yaysayer.

Also....

CJ Wiley teaches a "reverse" model of what we're discussing here. He teaches 3 CB targets that are aligned to 2 OB targets. He was damn near unbeatable a few years ago when he was playing. Is he a whack job who is giving out bad information as well?

I guess you know everything whereas REAL players don't know anything. I wonder why pros don't go to PJ for information?????? You should call Stevie and CJ up and offer them some help.

The NAYSAYERS, the whole lot of them are going down in FLAMES. Their disparaging remarks about CTE/Pro One are being shot down by player after player.

Patrick Johnson and a whole lot of other NAYSAYERS have a lot of crow to eat. MORE TO COME. :D:D
 
Just posted on Stevie Moore's Facebook:

"Won Mezz Classic in Vineland NJ at Q Ball Billiards. Thank You Jose Garcia and room for your hospitality. I would like to say thank you to my sponsors as well. Mr Cuess II in Atlanta GA, Layer 3 Communications Atlanta GA, Hamricks Clothing Gaffney SC. Also,* Stan Shuffett @ justcueit.com for his ever giving knowledge. Pro One is power!"*

I guess Stevie Moore is a Yaysayer.

Also....

CJ Wiley teaches a "reverse" model of what we're discussing here. He teaches 3 CB targets that are aligned to 2 OB targets. He was damn near unbeatable a few years ago when he was playing. Is he a whack job who is giving out bad information as well?
He's giving out bad information if he's saying his system doesn't rely on feel.

He may be a whack job if he can't figure out the difference between "not exact" and "doesn't work" (after having it explained ad infinitum). Sound like anybody you know?

pj
chgo
 
The NAYSAYERS, the whole lot of them are going down in FLAMES. Their disparaging remarks about CTE/Pro One are being shot down by player after player.
Which remarks, Joey? Be specific and show us you're not just another internet aiming systems go-off.

pj
chgo
 
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