Once again, buyers beware...this sale was a ripoff attempt!!
- Thread starter realkingcobra
- Start date
Thank you Zach, do you have any pictures of the stretcher that you can post?
Don't ever...ever...ever, send paypal as a gift. You have zero recourse though paypal now.
However you can probably get this guy through ebay. The bolded part is a huge no-no in the ebay world and if you can prove through saved messages that he asked you for payment off of ebay for an item he had listed on ebay they might delete his account. Not a solution but at least a step.
I'm going with Wendy and her husband on Monday to see about filing criminal charges agains Jerry/seller for selling her a different table than what she was told she was buying. The pictues of the table on Ebay, which is the table she thought she was buying, is in NO WAY what he dropped off at her house, that's nothing more than a bait'n switch scam to get her money, for a pool table that isnt' worth shit as it was delivered. Kind of these stands on the side of the road selling TVs. She stopped and looked at the TV that was showing a movie and it looked great, so she bought one in a box and when home. When taking the TV out of the box, she only then found out, the TV had a broken screen and was junk!!!
This. Small claims court would be the route you'd likely have to go. Small claims court is actually fun, as no lawyers are allowed, you just come tell your case in front of a judge....and you've got a good case, especcially with your expert witness (RKC) if he's willing to appear on the buyers behalf. If you win, you'll get a judgement against the seller (Jerry).....and then the sucky part comes, and that's collecting the judgement.
I agree its 100% shady and a very disgraceful way of doing business, but I don't really see it as criminal.
On a personal note after reading this thread and many othre builds RKC has done, I only wish he lived closer to me, I'd love to completely refinish and restore my GC2.
When a business decieves a customer...across state lines, that's called "Deceptive Business Practice" and takes a customers money for something being sold, then delivers the customer something OTHER than what they bought....with INTENT, it becomes a criminal act. The BEST thing Jerry could have done would have been to first offer Wendy her money back in full and come pick up the pool table. Second best thing he could have done, was to say hey, I made a mistake, let me make it up to you, I'll send you what ever parts it takes so Glen can make your table right, just let me know what I need to send out there!....but no, I get threatened to be sued for libal, and the only effort Jerry has made to even try and make this deal right, was to send the wrong stretcher...and even argue about that as in the table DON'T even need one...yet Brunswick sold EVERY GC with a stretcher mouned between every set of legs....why?
Glen
Glen
agreed. i don't know pool tables, but i do know furniture. and there's a reason that past 84"L, there is a CENTER SUPPORT, for STRUCTURAL REASONS.
yes, interstate & criminal. but hear me when i say: it's easier to prove CIVIL NEGLIGENCE & more rewarding financially.... cause if he's convicted CRIMINALLY, then wha - ? $1250 fine & probation?
vs
$3750 retribution? and she keeps the table? (cause you know he'll never waste his time/$$$ call-tagging it; he's already GOB!)
she'll win hands down - if for no other reason, than she's a woman.
your resolution is completely fair - just UNDO the transaction, and then it didn't exist....
yes, interstate & criminal. but hear me when i say: it's easier to prove CIVIL NEGLIGENCE & more rewarding financially.... cause if he's convicted CRIMINALLY, then wha - ? $1250 fine & probation?
vs
$3750 retribution? and she keeps the table? (cause you know he'll never waste his time/$$$ call-tagging it; he's already GOB!)
she'll win hands down - if for no other reason, than she's a woman.
your resolution is completely fair - just UNDO the transaction, and then it didn't exist....
When i sued in small claims court, the guy had a lawyer show up every time with him.
I still beat them-outfoxed them by 47 miles. I collected too! At the great cost of $35 to the New York City Marshal who had my check for $3k in about a week.
While im here a big **** you to Avistar Parking.
I still beat them-outfoxed them by 47 miles. I collected too! At the great cost of $35 to the New York City Marshal who had my check for $3k in about a week.
While im here a big **** you to Avistar Parking.
I guess it varies by state, but a lot of small claims court hearings, you're not allowed legal representation.....unless that has changed, its been 20 years since I've had to sue anyone in small claims court.
That's what i was thinking-plus maybe they are allowed in the preliminary hearings but not the actual 'trial' They threw in the towel before that with me.
At this point in time, I think Wendy wants a pound of flesh instead of $1,250
Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure she's going to have to be able to prove "intent (that he did it on purpose)". Unless you guys have information that hasn't be given to us yet then I doubt they can do that. BUT if he delivered a different table than what was pictured then it's very possible. But in all honesty I'm not a lawyer and only guestimating.
Cobra you should show him this post. And also get his side of the story. I'd like to see what he has to say about everything. Everything seems really condemning. But like they say there's always 2 sides 2 a story.
If you'd go back and read what I've posted, you'll see that I've copied and posted emails from him to me. Also, as I've already said, Wendy bought a GC3 pictured for sale on ebay, posted by him as the table he was selling, and as I've said already...THAT table is NOT the table that Wendy recieved....so, if that don't show intent what does? He KNEW he wasn't delivering the table he sold her, in fact he kept the SAME add up for sale and continued to take bids AFTER Wendy had already bought the table in the add for sale. So, he continued to offer the SAME table for sale in a new add...and delivered a pool table that was NOT the table she thought she was getting based on the pictures posted in the add selling the GC3.
I've been following this and I'm sorry that Wendy and her husband have to go through all this; but glad to see there are others here that have stepped up to help. I have sued in small claims court in Arizona over damages from a car accident. I'm sure this may vary by state, but there is a limit you can sue for and I don't think you can sue across state lines. However, going to the court like I did, at the start, I was provided with all sorts of info on how to do it. It was several years ago and things have probably changed. Good luck to you all.
You are cheating that lady out of hundreds of dollars for work you invented in order to make money off of her. That table is a gold crown 3 and if it has aprons from a gc2 I was never aware it it. All gold crown parts are virtually interchangeable with a little improvising and you apparently are not capable of that. The stabilizer is on the way but the correct term for it is 'stretcher'. Served almost no worthwhile purpose as you imagine but simply is for looks. You have to get two bolts with nuts to fasten the stretcher to the pedestals. Think you are capable if that?
Sent from my iPhone
No, Jerry...I'm not capable of mounting the WRONG stretcher to Wendy's GC, so I guess in your eyes I'm not a very good table mechanic...when compared to you that's pretty clear.
But Jerry, I AM capable of building the right parts for Wendy's table...after you clearly sent her the wrong stretcher which don't fit the legs to the GC, so you'll have to excuse me if I don't take your advice and just try and bolt the wrong strecher to the legs with 2 bolts....as YOU would clearly do. I'd rather do things right....so, please don't hold it against me...if you can HELP yourself Jerry
Sent from my iPhone
No, Jerry...I'm not capable of mounting the WRONG stretcher to Wendy's GC, so I guess in your eyes I'm not a very good table mechanic...when compared to you that's pretty clear.
But Jerry, I AM capable of building the right parts for Wendy's table...after you clearly sent her the wrong stretcher which don't fit the legs to the GC, so you'll have to excuse me if I don't take your advice and just try and bolt the wrong strecher to the legs with 2 bolts....as YOU would clearly do. I'd rather do things right....so, please don't hold it against me...if you can HELP yourself Jerry
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I love that part.....If he was delivering what was promised, nothing should even have to be 'improvised'.
Now, if ANY one looks at the bolt hole pattern...and has ANY kind of brains, AND is not just plain ass STUPID....they could CLEARLY see that the two different stretchers DON'T match up to bolt up to the legs on a GC
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