One pocket pickle
- Thread starter Onepocket73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrhendy
Shoot the five into the 7 and move them both out, sticking the cue ball where the 5 is below the 13.
It will get you out of this one, but it could get worse later on. I do not see an agressive shot to get a ball on your side. John
Sometimes the wise old mouse doesn't look for the cheese, but to get out of the trap. Ilike your shot.
^^^^^^after thinking about this longer, I agree with the above shot and opinion of it.
Originally Posted by jrhendy
Shoot the five into the 7 and move them both out, sticking the cue ball where the 5 is below the 13.
It will get you out of this one, but it could get worse later on. I do not see an agressive shot to get a ball on your side. John
Sometimes the wise old mouse doesn't look for the cheese, but to get out of the trap. Ilike your shot.
^^^^^^after thinking about this longer, I agree with the above shot and opinion of it.
Patrick Johnson said:
That shot plays extremely difficult if the cueball is on the rail. You would have to jack up a bit, and aside from that, the balls arent laying right to stick to the 5. You would have to hit it dead perfect, and if you dont, you sell out the entire rack. These are some incredibly difficult shots you are putting up, Patrick. Are you Efren?
Quality equipment like the Wei table allows us all to play our best.
pj
chgo
deanoc said:
By "daring your opponent to shoot the combo", you mean "daring your opponent to either bank at the 14 or 2-rail it off the back of the pack to his pocket", thereby leaving you with 0 balls on your side, and quite possibly MUCH worse off than you are now, right?
The very BEST you can hope for with this shot is that he can "only" knock the 14 away from your pocket, and leave you behind the stack. Again, that's the BEST that can happen. Things can get much, much worse than they are right now. And probably WILL, if you let him see the 14.
Russ
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Patrick Johnson said:
yeah, but i wouldnt scratch. protecting 3 balls on my side of the table in the process. my opponent may overlook my dead ball as well.
jrhendy said:
Damn you John. I just saw this thread and thought the same thing. I didn't think anyone would see that move, and the very first post I read is yours.
1 Pocket Ghost said:
Not an easy shot sir. Must be hit perfect and with perfect speed.
There is one other option, but it is for the strongest players only (not me). Ronnie might have shot it this way many years ago.
You hit the 14 three rails firmly toward your hole, playing it a little long if possible to contact the 8. You must put the cue ball up table, ideally on the middle diamond of the end rail. You have a chance to get lucky here and make a ball, and you have played an offensive shot. If you control whitey you won't give up anything either.
Notice where the 8 goes if hit solidly by the 14. If it hits the side of the 1,6 it goes toward the pocket. Notice also the direction the 1,6 is lined up in, Toward your hole also. And the 14 is going that way as well. Definitely a Ronnie Allen special.
I know this option looks extremely difficult, but if you ever saw Ronnie play in his prime, it wouldn't surprise you to see him shoot it, make a ball and run out. No one ever did things like this better than RA. Mr. Henderson can chime in here if he likes.
Ronnie could make miraculous shots seem routine. After you saw him run ten and out from nowhere for the hundredth time, you got used to it.
You all might think I'm crazy, but I'm not joking. Ronnie ran out from spots like this all the time!
You hit the 14 three rails firmly toward your hole, playing it a little long if possible to contact the 8. You must put the cue ball up table, ideally on the middle diamond of the end rail. You have a chance to get lucky here and make a ball, and you have played an offensive shot. If you control whitey you won't give up anything either.
Notice where the 8 goes if hit solidly by the 14. If it hits the side of the 1,6 it goes toward the pocket. Notice also the direction the 1,6 is lined up in, Toward your hole also. And the 14 is going that way as well. Definitely a Ronnie Allen special.
I know this option looks extremely difficult, but if you ever saw Ronnie play in his prime, it wouldn't surprise you to see him shoot it, make a ball and run out. No one ever did things like this better than RA. Mr. Henderson can chime in here if he likes.
Ronnie could make miraculous shots seem routine. After you saw him run ten and out from nowhere for the hundredth time, you got used to it.
You all might think I'm crazy, but I'm not joking. Ronnie ran out from spots like this all the time!
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Tried
I have studied this layout and tried to find an aggressive shot to move anything towards my hole and not sell out. With the exception of the shot that Jay mentions, three railing the 14, I am not sure there is one. And since I don't trust the control of whitey there, for me anyway, I would try to shoot one rail shot mentioned before with good speed, and hope that I get lucky and skim the 4 ball, leaving the cue on the rail, and if I miss the 4, then I take the hickey. Even if I hit the 2, on that angle, it should fall to the end rail. Taking the foul is only one ball,which can be overcome fairly easily, where selling out 5 or 6 or more can not. I also agree with the shot clearing out with the 5/7, but I would have to see the shot on the table in front of me to have a better idea of where/how this would turn out. Looking at the shot on the screen doesn't give you all the information you would need to make that decision IMO.
Mark
I have studied this layout and tried to find an aggressive shot to move anything towards my hole and not sell out. With the exception of the shot that Jay mentions, three railing the 14, I am not sure there is one. And since I don't trust the control of whitey there, for me anyway, I would try to shoot one rail shot mentioned before with good speed, and hope that I get lucky and skim the 4 ball, leaving the cue on the rail, and if I miss the 4, then I take the hickey. Even if I hit the 2, on that angle, it should fall to the end rail. Taking the foul is only one ball,which can be overcome fairly easily, where selling out 5 or 6 or more can not. I also agree with the shot clearing out with the 5/7, but I would have to see the shot on the table in front of me to have a better idea of where/how this would turn out. Looking at the shot on the screen doesn't give you all the information you would need to make that decision IMO.
Mark
Bluesteel said:
I like the two-railer a little better. You're aiming at the same ball(s), but without the risk of scratching in the corner off the 2 or 10 (although if you hit it real bad you could get on the wrong side of the 4/7):
[How'd I do, Sensei?]
pj
chgo
jay helfert said:
I know it's not - Believe me, I don't want to shoot this shot, and I'm not enjoying it, but I believe it's my best shot, so I'm shooting it.
And as it says in my previous post....Your speed doesn't have to be perfect - You have approx. 6 inches 'speed leeway' - 3" passing the 10 ball on the way in, and 3" rebounding off the cushion, before you would sell out a cut shot on the 10.
jay helfert said:
Considered this shot, and dismissed it, because.....With the angle that you have on the 14, to make the 3-railer or have it run long, you have to cut the 14 on the left side - this inhibits your getting the cue ball up-table, even with loading it up with maximum top right english.....Also, even if you could get the cueball there, it's no good, cuz the 3-10 combination is just too easy to make.
Nothing like a little virtual one pocket match
After that, here would be my response, estimating of course where the 2,12,15,8,1,and 6 balls end upafter your shot.
Your Turn
AZE said:
After that, here would be my response, estimating of course where the 2,12,15,8,1,and 6 balls end upafter your shot.
Your Turn
1 Pocket Ghost said:
I appreciate the fact that you considered it. I wouldn't shoot it either. I still like John's first option. The "chaos theory" has worked for me many times.
I just wanted to put this option up there for people to see, and know that once upon a time, there was a guy who executed shots like this to perfection. And beat everyone doing it!
I just reread all the posts and have narrowed down to what I think are the best two solutions. My choices are Jrhendys 5 to the 7 and the two rail kick toward the seven by 1 pocket ghost. My first choice would be the 5 to the 7 but only if I would be certain that the seven could be gotten out of there without touching the 10 ball and if I could lay the cue ball very close to the 13 ball. To guard against the cut on the 4 ball and to protect the 14 ball.
The two rail kick toward the 7 ball is more effective and I may consider it my first choice but only if I had confidence on the table speed.
The two rail kick toward the 7 ball is more effective and I may consider it my first choice but only if I had confidence on the table speed.
jay helfert said:Damn you John. I just saw this thread and thought the same thing. I didn't think anyone would see that move, and the very first post I read is yours.
Another way Ronnie may have hit this shot, is to shoot it firmly and let the cue ball roll forward to the first diamond by his opponent's hole. He would try to get as many balls as possible moving toward his hole. Moving a few balls into the bottom of the main pack is a good move here. Everything funnels toward your pocket.
If something goes in the game is over! That was the greatness of Ronnie Allen. Once again he could and did win games from spots like this. I'd like to hear comments from John H., Billy and San Jose Dick. They saw it too.
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