OPINION ALERT!!! Great Players Are Great Players Because…

B

BasementDweller

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There’s a common thought on AZ, often times expressed by people who have opinions that I respect. That thought is that great players are great because they have a superior mental attitude, or focus, or even desire. While I agree that those traits are very important in being a great player I think the main characteristic that great players have that the lesser players do not is - are you ready for this – FAR SUPERIOR CUEING ACTION. By this I mean the ability to do things with the cue ball that inferior players are not able to do -- table length draw, force follow, just an overall level of comfort in shooting difficult shots, just to name a few.

I believe the reason this is so often overlooked is because of two things. First, they play on very fast cloth. Playing on the faster cloth makes one think that both players are much closer to equal in their cueing ability than they actually are. If you watch a great player like Efren Reyes play and he is faced with a long difficult draw shot and you see him pull it off without breaking a sweat and then you see a lesser player shoot the same shot, he may either make and miss position or miss the shot altogether (or they may make it occasionally). What’s the difference between the two? In my estimation the great players are shooting shots that are well within their abilities. A long straight in draw shot may only take a great player to within 70% of their total capacity. While a good player faced with that same shot is tittering right at 95-100% of their total capacity or ability. This sort of thing is very evident when you compare the women’s and men’s games. However, it is hidden beneath the surface of the Simonis cloth that they are playing on.

The other reason this superior cueing action is overlooked is because of the short races. These sorts of differences are harder to quantify because two players can appear to be equal while in reality, one player is playing much closer to their top potential than is the other. This is just one of the reasons I love the TAR matchups.

It’s really hard to identify this superior cueing action that I’m talking about. The time you can really see it is when the players are warming up and they don’t mind showing what they are really capable of. I’ve searched Youtube trying to find some of these videos to defend my point, but I wasn’t successful. I know that I’ve seen it up close and personal a time or two and it made me realize the chasm that exists between the truly great players and us mere mortal bangers. So, bottom line – it’s not their mental attitude, or focus, or desire. All of us mere mortals can attain those things. It is their STROKE!

***If you can find some clips of pros just warming up I would appreciate it. I’ve seen Earl warming up and it can make you want to quit playing pool.
 
BasementDweller said:
There’s a common thought on AZ, often times expressed by people who have opinions that I respect. ....
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Then you are in the wrong place! hahaha

IMO, the flashy super-shot is not what sets a top-level pro apart from the hack. I would say it is the lack of it, actually.

Not that they can't do it, but the top pros play better shape, thus they don't need too much flash. Nevel notwithstanding:wink:

AKA:
1- that guy can't play- I never see him take a tough shot.
or
2- Dam, BB. That was another tuff out you got before you dogged the 9.
 
Good topic. IMO the one thing that allows us to perform at the level we perform at is that we allow our subconscious do the work for us and we just let it happen.

Now.... there are lots of levels of that. These are very subtle differences that make great players.

I'm no world beater, and I'm 60 now, but as a 14.1 lover who gets to play maybe 3 or 4 times a month, I'm a legitimate threat to run a 50 or 60 now and then with a whole ton of 30s and 40s. So you get an idea of how good, or bad, I play. To do that, you'd think I knew what I was doing, and I do, but......

Now, I have a buddy of mine who has such amazing "table presence" (that's what I call it) The angles are so natural for him to see, the kisses, caroms, interfering balls, etc etc ...

When he goes into clusters, he's automatically aware and accurate with what part of the contacting OB he is hitting, and where all the opening balls will go.

Yes, yes, we can all do this, but ... not with complete subconscious ability. You see, we have to devote some conscious though to these things and that, is when you start biting into the normal flow of the shot, the zone of dead stroke you are experiencing.

It's hard to keep pace with someone who doesn't have the same load of conscious concerns when they play.

The fact that you are an "A" player doesn't mean that you automatically have these qualities in your arsenal. Or at least not all of them and not as refined as some players.

Now, desire, focus, mental attitude, do play a huge part in this equation, but, maybe not the way you are considering them.

The more free space your conscious has, the less it is burdened with calculating things, (even on a very small scale) then not only does your game flow better but you are freed up to play rather than exhaust yourself shot after shot. And that translates into what others see as better focus, mental attitude, and desire.

I had two German Shepherds. The first one, I'd walk with and if she got ahead of me, I'd tug her leash and say heel. Maybe 2 or 3 times, and she got it. The GS I have now ... well I'm probably gonna go through a few leashes before she gets it.

Point is, we all learn at different paces, we all see things differently and apply them with other parts of the game differently. This is why no aiming or stroking technique is a perfect fit all solution for everyone.

Some of us may practice 10 times as long as someone else who picks these type things up automatically.

It's a pretty complicated game. In fact I think that's one of the reasons it self destructs and isn't popular with the masses. On the other hand, it's what makes us so interested in it. :)
 
I do not believe that their greatness is solely or even mainly the result of their stroke. They have a born with ability to stay calm under pressure, they actually like it. Most of us wilt under the most intense pressure whether we have a great stroke or not.
 
BasementDweller said:
There’s a common thought on AZ, often times expressed by people who have opinions that I respect. That thought is that great players are great because they have a superior mental attitude, or focus, or even desire. While I agree that those traits are very important in being a great player I think the main characteristic that great players have that the lesser players do not is - are you ready for this – FAR SUPERIOR CUEING ACTION. By this I mean the ability to do things with the cue ball that inferior players are not able to do -- table length draw, force follow, just an overall level of comfort in shooting difficult shots, just to name a few.
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They are just better players than us. I like your idea about watching pros warming up - I see pros up close and personal from time to time and holy crap they're in a different league to any of us who thinks they can play a bit when they really cut loose.

Still, I await the self-help groups and denial mob with interest...
 
All fine points, likely equally true.

The top guys are in the 99th percentile of every positive attribute: mental, physical...
 
Fear and pressure is something learned. When we were Neanderthals, most of life was pain and so their wasn't much pressure to alleviate ourselves of things that would really annoy us today. They walked around with ingrown toe nails, flea infested hair, and really dried skin. It was normal thing so they just grunt around clubbing their women and dragging them back to the cave. Now days I gotsta get my hair and nail did every other week or I'm falling behind.
 
Black-Balled said:
All fine points, likely equally true.

The top guys are in the 99th percentile of every positive attribute: mental, physical...
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Okay, so just for fun, the next tier down from the top guys, are they in the 98th percentile in everything, or is there a particular attribute that separates the top from the next, and the next from the lower?
 
sammylane12 said:
I do not believe that their greatness is solely or even mainly the result of their stroke. They have a born with ability to stay calm under pressure, they actually like it. Most of us wilt under the most intense pressure whether we have a great stroke or not.
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I think this is closest to the truth. The ability to focus, block out distraction, reestablish a level of concentration and do it all under intense pressure is what separates the greats from the rest of us. How many guys have you seen sit around casually running rack after rack of 9 ball, hit two and three rail kicks like Efren then get smoked in a race to five in a local tournament by a relative beginner...just fall apart and get worse from there? Happens more often than not. This ability to focus can be taught/learned, but takes a long time and a lot of experience under pressure. Some guys are just born with it. Most of us never really get there.
 
West Point 1987 said:
I think this is closest to the truth. The ability to focus, block out distraction, reestablish a level of concentration and do it all under intense pressure is what separates the greats from the rest of us.
This ability to focus can be taught/learned, but takes a long time and a lot of experience under pressure. Some guys are just born with it. Most of us never really get there.
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I am sorry West Point, i have to disagree with you. All normal humans, without any disability can focus , the only difference is the length of time for individuals to focus. The real issue is to remember to focus during your shot routine; a lot of times we go down looking at big target and we forget to focus to try to find that pin point especially for long hard shots. I do not thing pressure cause you to loose focus, it probably cause you to forget one or two item from the shot routine check list (like Republican Romney forgot his words under pressure); this is the main reason for practice, and not any practice, you have to practice all shots possibilities, and learn why you miss (very critical) so your brain under pressure quickly retrieve information to execute the shot correctly.
 
I agree with the OP on this one. The stroke quality of the tops pros allows them to play difficult shape shots with an easy stroke that makes it look ridiculously easy. They also get plenty of action shooting at slow to medium speeds, whereas us amateurs have to slam them in to get the same action.
It takes a good deal of time and practice to learn to make shots and play the right patterns, but picking up an accurate, powerful and smooth stroke takes a great deal longer imo.
 
No, they are great players because of CTE, being an action player/ gambler, and they know how to rack the balls good for themselves and bad for their opponents.

Oh yeah, and because of Kamui or pre-flag Masters chalk, almost forgot.
 
Vanity

I'll throw one out their. Vanity. I think all great players have a degree of Vanity that drives them to greatness. You don't half to strut like a peacock just an internal drive to be great. I think ALL great athletes have a very high "Vanity Quotient" it drives them to lead the pack. This drive focuses their efforts to succeed and better the next guy.

Football. Tennis. Politics. Pool. It works for all disciplines.
 
The great ones don't miss as often as the wannabees.

Being able to make a ball and control whitey without missing when the pressure is ON or at the beginning, middle or the end of a 6 pack doesn't come easy for those that don't practice and play under pressure.

It's easier to win once you know you can. Beating the 'best of the best' generates TONS of confidence.

IMO Arrogance is not a quality of a Champion.
 
In a word....EXPECTATION!

I have found that all great players fully expect to make every shot they look at. Have you ever seen a Pro after a miss? they look completely surprised....kind of like...how dare that friggin ball not end up in the pocket! :) total shock.

This expectation brings along with it the idea that you have already played the shot out in your head. You already know the shot is made before pulling the trigger. That explains to me the surprise from a miss.....it's like....I just made that shot in my head.....how did it not go in? :)

Have you ever watched Tiger miss? He is amazed that the ball refused his will.

It might be Ego, or will, or vanity, or arrogance....whatever you want to call it, but IMO to play top speed you must impart your will on the cueball with the full expectation that the balls will co-operate with you.

Try it out during your next practice session. Just see the result first, then expect it to happen.....it works!

G.
 
Gerry said:
In a word....EXPECTATION!

I have found that all great players fully expect to make every shot they look at. Have you ever seen a Pro after a miss? they look completely surprised....kind of like...how dare that friggin ball not end up in the pocket! :) total shock.

This expectation brings along with it the idea that you have already played the shot out in your head. You already know the shot is made before pulling the trigger. That explains to me the surprise from a miss.....it's like....I just made that shot in my head.....how did it not go in? :)

Have you ever watched Tiger miss? He is amazed that the ball refused his will.

It might be Ego, or will, or vanity, or arrogance....whatever you want to call it, but IMO to play top speed you must impart your will on the cueball with the full expectation that the balls will co-operate with you.

Try it out during your next practice session. Just see the result first, then expect it to happen.....it works!

G.
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Comments like these make wanabe and B players not want to advance their game and say oh pro got this and that. All humans are a like despite a disability of some sort. It is knowledge a lot of it, and little secrets and lots of practice that makes a pro a pro. Pool is Just like taking a multiple choice exam, the harder you study, practice learn, the better your score will be. In fact, the proof is we have so many pros now, mainly due to the internet and knowledge sharing, and the so many DVDs and trainers out there.
 
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