Pool -- a very male dominated sport (in the wake of Cubc and OMGWTF's matchup)

phoebe choy said:
This pretty much sums up this whole thread.

I'm a girl, I know how it works - it's a pool hall - there is only so much you can expect. I loved the game, thats why I stuck around to play. You think the guys really took interest that I was getting good? Of course not...maybe some...but most complimented my shots while looking at my ass...it's the way it goes.....deal with it if you're a girl. If not, then don't play or stay home and play. I don't have a table at home and had no choice....I wanted to compete so I had to play at the hall.

It's tough for girls...they gotta deal with all kinds of bs - for the one's who really love the game and mentally can block the bs out - they will survive. You almost have to be like on of the guys in the pool halls....you have to have the balls to gamble, the skill to back it up, and skin that is rock hard cause you will get all kinds of daggers and cheap shot thrown at you. Not all guys are like this...but in every pool hall there will be a few if not more.

I felt the best way to prove myself to all the guys was to get good....not ok good...real good - play even with the guys, gamble whatever stakes....I got my wins AND took my lickings....thats how you learn.....thats how you remain. The most rewarding part is when they all know you are constantly getting better.....in my hall, after a while (like 5 years, lol) nobody gave me cheesy lines (unless when joking around), nobody tried hitting on me, nobody treated me like I was some groupie, in fact they used to tell everyone "don't let her looks fool you, she got balls!"

But one thing still remained....friends, foes and strangers alike would still watch me play.......and I can guarantee they still were looking at my ass. Either on purpose or as a reaction it didn't matter.....they are guys and it's a pool hall....you should know what to expect.
My complaints are towards the ballbangers. The male pool players know know better. We can practise, shoot together, compete, et cetera and they don't make comments about me bending over the table or anything else in that sense. We can hang out and I'm one of the guys. Even if my male friends look at my bum when I'm bent over the table, they don't make it obvious, whereas the ballbangers do, not to mention their often obnoxious comments.
 
Sweet Marissa said:
My complaints are towards the ballbangers. The male pool players know know better. We can practise, shoot together, compete, et cetera and they don't make comments about me bending over the table or anything else in that sense. We can hang out and I'm one of the guys. Even if my male friends look at my bum when I'm bent over the table, they don't make it obvious, whereas the ballbangers do, not to mention their often obnoxious comments.

Part of the problem is that many bangers don't realize that people actually practice to become good at pool. So, when you tell them that you are practicing they assume you are just blowing them off and lying to them.
 
Peer said:
Actually, domestic violence in Norway is among the lowest in the world, even lower than in the United States. However, since Norway has a long history of women's rights, the women there are also more outspoken about this issue and would naturally try to make sure that this unacceptable behavior will soon be part of the past. Besides, almost 60% of the domestic violence in Norway happen in families of ethnic minorities (predominantly muslim Pakistanis). And if you look at the most misogynic cultures (e.g., the Muslim nations) there are no reports of domestic violence, which certainly doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. A similar thing goes for Sweden and their very high suicide rate. If you look at those numbers and are not familiar with how compulsive the Swedes are when it comes to statistics, you might think there are more suicides in Sweden than elsewhere. However, in Sweden they investigate, for instance, every traffic fatality as a potential suicide. Such thorough data collection brings their numbers to a different level than, for example, Ireland where there's a certain stigma associated with suicide, and hence, is quite under reported. Under reporting domestic violence here in the States is a known problem -- the American culture is very private compared to Norway, and hence makes it more difficult to collect factual numbers of how widespread this problem is.


You know very little about me. I'm so far from being on a "Norwegian high horse". I can give you a hint though; from all the articles I've written about Norway, criticizing the Norwegian mindset, about fundamental west-coast Christians beating up their wives, about their inadequate immigration policies, etc., I bet there were quite a few Norwegians who were happy to see me leave ;^)



-- peer

Reasonable people can disagree on the relative extent of the problems and the causes of what women face in differing countries. I'm not agreeing with you on your statistics, I'm simply agreeing to disagree in part because of the way you parced out the "immigrants" (Who are somehow not a part of Norway?) and in part because there is no acceptable level for these kinds of problems for any country. Less crappy is not best.

You took an issue that is a worlwide problem and blurred the issue by singling out the United States. This was a completely arrogant and unnecessary detour in what was otherwise a very valid point.

On a side note, as far as American culture being more private than Norway's, when you show me Norway's version of the Jerry Springer show, I might start to believe this. :D
 
Russ Chewning said:
Oh baby Oh baby..... :)

Russ

LOL! Some people may have not liked the topic of this thread or who originated it, but it's turned into a lot of fun:D
 
GG11 said:
You are a sweetheart, even with the drinks .... and you are a major badass, even without the drinks.


Please. Stop. You ladies hang out in person, no? Stroke egos THEN!

:)
 
Peer since you have come here and made remarks about my country, America, let me ask you about yours. From my limited experience why is it the players from your region like Mika, Marcus, Niels, et al. seem so cold and not open sociable. Now this is just my own prejudiced observations but I have met pros from all over the world and find the players from the Nordic countries just plain unfriendly. Maybe its me. Ill accept that. Now maybe its the weather or the isolation but Britain is a cold country but you wont find warmer nicer guys than Karl Boyes, Darren Applelton, Marc Selby, Jimmy White, etc.

I can understand the players from the tropics like the Phillipines and Hawaii. We like to touch people and engage them in song, dance, and feast. And the players from Latin and Central America the same.
Maybe you can illuminate on the subject for me. Mysogony and racism and sexism lives in everyones soul on this planet. If we say that it exist in our society and deny it being in ourselves we become cold and unfeeling.
Mysogony, racism, sexism, and chauvinism exists in everyone and we have to come to terms with it and deal with it out in the open. Listen to any blues or rock song. A lot of it is about someones fine ass or capturing somebodys heart and possesing it. If we had to worry about statistics and peer pressure to abstain how could we enjoy life itself?
I dont think your culture is more progressive than mine. Maybe mine is more out in the open?
 
Sweet Marissa said:
Not offensive, but when they don't take a polite declination and want to stick around and bother me, they're breaking my concentration and wasting my table time. It is obvious when I, or any other female here I'm sure, is there to practise and not bang balls around.

Valid point. My only point is that I don't understand when it became offensive for men to find women attractive and state so.

But yes, there are proper times for such behavior, and after someone says "not interested" is usually not one of them.
 
D-Sub said:
Please. Stop. You ladies hang out in person, no? Stroke egos THEN!

:)
Sorry our "ego stroking" is bothering you... but we don't even live in the same state, so we hang out more on AZ than we do in person! :p
 
yobagua said:
Peer since you have come here and made remarks about my country, America, let me ask you about yours. From my limited experience why is it the players from your region like Mika, Marcus, Niels, et al. seem so cold and not open sociable. Now this is just my own prejudiced observations but I have met pros from all over the world and find the players from the Nordic countries just plain unfriendly. Maybe its me. Ill accept that. Now maybe its the weather or the isolation but Britain is a cold country but you wont find warmer nicer guys than Karl Boyes, Darren Applelton, Marc Selby, Jimmy White, etc.

I can understand the players from the tropics like the Phillipines and Hawaii. We like to touch people and engage them in song, dance, and feast. And the players from Latin and Central America the same.
Maybe you can illuminate on the subject for me. Mysogony and racism and sexism lives in everyones soul on this planet. If we say that it exist in our society and deny it being in ourselves we become cold and unfeeling.
Mysogony, racism, sexism, and chauvinism exists in everyone and we have to come to terms with it and deal with it out in the open. Listen to any blues or rock song. A lot of it is about someones fine ass or capturing somebodys heart and possesing it. If we had to worry about statistics and peer pressure to abstain how could we enjoy life itself?
I dont think your culture is more progressive than mine. Maybe mine is more out in the open?

Marcus Chamat not sociable, and unfriendly too???

Anyway, Norwegians are the friendliest people on earth. (After 12 beers)
 
yobagua said:
Peer since you have come here and made remarks about my country, America, let me ask you about yours. From my limited experience why is it the players from your region like Mika, Marcus, Niels, et al. seem so cold and not open sociable. Now this is just my own prejudiced observations but I have met pros from all over the world and find the players from the Nordic countries just plain unfriendly. Maybe its me. Ill accept that. Now maybe its the weather or the isolation but Britain is a cold country but you wont find warmer nicer guys than Karl Boyes, Darren Applelton, Marc Selby, Jimmy White, etc.
Actually, I've found Marcus to be a sweetheart. Niels is very nice, also, as is his girlfriend, Katrine. I don't talk to Mika much any more, but he is a funny guy. None of them are unfriendly or cold at all!
 
DaveK said:
And they're broke after 12 beer too :eek:

Dave

Yeah, if we buy it in Norway we will blow our salary in few hours... You will not believe the prices on beer here in Norway, so I will not tell you.

Anyway, Norwegians (Scandinavians) are weird people. Most of us seems to be afraid of talking to other people, but as soon as we have got a little alcohol, we can't talk enough to them. And we never knows when to stop drinking. (I think it is because we don't want to remember that we were talking to strangers the day before).

So if you meet a Scandinavian make sure to only talk to him when he has had 1 beer, and make sure to leave before he has finished the third beer. Then you will have a good time ;) Just a friendly advice :D
 
Roy Steffensen said:
Yeah, if we buy it in Norway we will blow our salary in few hours... You will not believe the prices on beer here in Norway, so I will not tell you.

I nearly fell out of my chair the first time I ordered a beer in Oslo .... and then understood why everyone on my flight had full duty-free bags clinking away as they walked onto the airplane.

Dave
 
Sweet Marissa said:
My complaints are towards the ballbangers. The male pool players know know better. We can practise, shoot together, compete, et cetera and they don't make comments about me bending over the table or anything else in that sense. We can hang out and I'm one of the guys. Even if my male friends look at my bum when I'm bent over the table, they don't make it obvious, whereas the ballbangers do, not to mention their often obnoxious comments.


You are right Marissa...agreed....it's the ones who can't keep what they are really thinking, to themselves - the obnoxious ones that are the douche bags...lol!

It's one thing for a girl to be playing/shooting and have guys ogling/staring and thinking stuff, than guys ogling/staring and saying what they are thinking and maybe even trying to get physical.

We are not stupid...you don't have to say it...we already kinda know it guys.

My thoughts: I just hope that in time, after seeing me play, it will be obvious what I'm there for - and that I could care less about what you guys are thinking.

P.S. Just so there is no arguement - not all guys, just the ones who can't control themselves.
 
lodini said:
No one is saying that all guys are pigs. I am glad to hear that there are some guys out there that don't think a girl walking into a pool hall means that they are automatically going to get lucky tonight! LOL. But I can tell you from experience, your kind in a pool hall is the minority.;)
I played at the first Predator stop in Long Island and there was maybe 15-20 women/girl players at the event. From what I could see everybody was treated equally and with the greatest respect and most of the girls there played great. I grew up playing snooker in Ireland and this would never happen over there so for me it was a great experience as nobody was being judged by the way they looked. I only knew who Caroline Pao and Liz Ford were but I watched one match where a girl in a white top(no idea who it was) played with a ton of heart and attacked the table playing 9-ball the way it should be played. If it was like this everywhere it would be great.
 
I knew it would get a rise in people if I said people from Nordic countries were cold. Thats why I prefaced it by saying I was PREJUDICED. That I found it to be that way from my experience. That a lot of it is perception. Now could it be that Mika, Marcus, Niels, et al are nice to you because you are a female. And that you do respond to them in a different fashion than you would a "ball banger". And maybe they respond to male "ball bangers" in a different way as well.
I think the problem is that "ball bangers" of both sexes, yes Male and Females have a hard time digesting this contradiction. As Phoebe Choy alludes to in her post. Yes there is sexism but you have to live with it if you want to excel in pool. Oh you dont have to love it but it exist. And the pros seem to have a better grip on this issue. Look at Jeannete "Black Widow" Lee and Ewa "The Striking Viking" Lawrence. They are not afraid to sell sex as part of their game. Im sure for them the more people looking at their "bum" the better, and the more buying their products because of it the better.
Like Phoebe says its the obnoxious behaviour that is unacceptable. And the pros have a better grip on reacting to obnoxious behaviour. Because their priority is to excel in their game. Everything is secondary.

So I wonder how many times you would accept obnoxious behaviour if it was a pro. Yeah Marcus, Mika, etc are warm and funny. But dont tell me they are not looking at your "bum" or is their humanity different from any other male ball banger. Because if you have a moment I could tell you some stories. There are all kinds of pool groupies that do all kinds of wierd things. We've all seen it. I guess woman ball bangers dont like getting hit upon by male ball bangers. And Male ball bangers think they have a right to bang any female ball banger. I think it is ego. From both sides not getting the recognition they think they deserve. Well the pros have the answer. Just be good at what you do and nobody will mess with you.

What is this thing about ass looking by the way. I look at everybodys ass when they bend over a table. I see Buddy Hall and say "man Buddy's ass is big" or Alex P and say "man Alex has a tiny butt". "man Phoebe has a fine okole (bottom)". I go to Cirque de Soleil and see the contortionists and wonder what they look like
naked. Maybe Im sick that way but I dont give one whatever. People are people. Just give some respect to both sides of the fence.
 
raybo147 said:
I played at the first Predator stop in Long Island and there was maybe 15-20 women/girl players at the event. From what I could see everybody was treated equally and with the greatest respect and most of the girls there played great. I grew up playing snooker in Ireland and this would never happen over there so for me it was a great experience as nobody was being judged by the way they looked. I only knew who Caroline Pao and Liz Ford were but I watched one match where a girl in a white top(no idea who it was) played with a ton of heart and attacked the table playing 9-ball the way it should be played. If it was like this everywhere it would be great.


Well of course you are leaving out Norway. No doubt everything would be perfect there.:rolleyes:
 
yobagua said:
I knew it would get a rise in people if I said people from Nordic countries were cold. Thats why I prefaced it by saying I was PREJUDICED. That I found it to be that way from my experience. That a lot of it is perception. Now could it be that Mika, Marcus, Niels, et al are nice to you because you are a female. And that you do respond to them in a different fashion than you would a "ball banger". And maybe they respond to male "ball bangers" in a different way as well.
I think the problem is that "ball bangers" of both sexes, yes Male and Females have a hard time digesting this contradiction. As Phoebe Choy alludes to in her post. Yes there is sexism but you have to live with it if you want to excel in pool. Oh you dont have to love it but it exist. And the pros seem to have a better grip on this issue. Look at Jeannete "Black Widow" Lee and Ewa "The Striking Viking" Lawrence. They are not afraid to sell sex as part of their game. Im sure for them the more people looking at their "bum" the better, and the more buying their products because of it the better.
Like Phoebe says its the obnoxious behaviour that is unacceptable. And the pros have a better grip on reacting to obnoxious behaviour. Because their priority is to excel in their game. Everything is secondary.

So I wonder how many times you would accept obnoxious behaviour if it was a pro. Yeah Marcus, Mika, etc are warm and funny. But dont tell me they are not looking at your "bum" or is their humanity different from any other male ball banger. Because if you have a moment I could tell you some stories. There are all kinds of pool groupies that do all kinds of wierd things. We've all seen it. I guess woman ball bangers dont like getting hit upon by male ball bangers. And Male ball bangers think they have a right to bang any female ball banger. I think it is ego. From both sides not getting the recognition they think they deserve. Well the pros have the answer. Just be good at what you do and nobody will mess with you.

What is this thing about ass looking by the way. I look at everybodys ass when they bend over a table. I see Buddy Hall and say "man Buddy's ass is big" or Alex P and say "man Alex has a tiny butt". "man Phoebe has a fine okole (bottom)". I go to Cirque de Soleil and see the contortionists and wonder what they look like
naked. Maybe Im sick that way but I dont give one whatever. People are people. Just give some respect to both sides of the fence.

You're earning my respect with your candor and humor.

The human race is filled with prejudices. It is what we do with those prejudices that matters. Racism is in every ethnic group on the planet.

I'm going to tell Buddy what you said. :p :D :D :D
JoeyA
 
JoeyA said:
You're earning my respect with your candor and humor.

The human race is filled with prejudices. It is what we do with those prejudices that matters. Racism is in every ethnic group on the planet.

I'm going to tell Buddy what you said. :p :D :D :D
JoeyA

Oh hell! What did I get myself into!!!! Like Cubc I might get call out for being an ASSogynist.

Seriously I work with a lot of Comics (Steve Harvey, Bill Cosby, Rob Schneider, Amy Poehler, etc) and their writers. And they are quick to point out humor in life. They see things different. For example you see a tall beautiful naked woman walking down a stairway in a hurried manner. Thats Drama. But the same scenario and see a tall naked man walking down that same stairway and thats comedy. Kplop, Kplop, Kplop. You catch my drift.
Everything is to interpretation. Now the first thing that OMG said when asked what she was going to do with her prized money she said "get a boob job". It was kind of funny and cute yet demeaning. Now if Harvey Ball banger said "Hey now you can afford a boob job" Many would be coming down on his Misogynistic ass. Me included. But would his response be "Hey Im just lightening things up!". How would we take that.

I dont live in a "politically correct" environment and am glad that I can say what I mean. Thats what happens when you get into the senior segment of society. But I hope someone like Cubc has learned, as Ive learned, that you can get away with being rude and obnoxious only so much. Then it will come back to bite you in your ASS.
 
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