Pros shooting the last ball....please explain....

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
I've noticed that I attract more skids with a rolling ball, than with the cb struck with more velocity
the cb "climbing" definitely seems to be the thing..you don't think speed could mitigate that tho?
Note: moving forward I will only refer to a kick/skid/whatever as a kick.

Nope... You still can endure the joy of a kick with a greater shot speed. However, on the vertical (top spin) axis the detrimental effects are generally just a loss of energy transfer. (I'm speaking in absolutes for sake of description.) ...so on a high pace shot, the bad is lost within the excessive force. When you roll the CB, the pace is low, and the effect is more apparent.

Now on a horizontal kick (skid), the climbing effect will still throw the OB off typical path regardless of power.

Now it could be argued that the encreased force behind the CB / OB contact will lessen the 'climbing' effect. I wouldn't argue against that train of thought, but I wouldn't begin to know how to validate the opinion.
 

poolandpokerman

AzB Gold Member
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This thread has helped me a lot, I am the guy that runs the table and misses my out ball, whether is be 9 ball or one pocket. Now I know why, I don't shoot the out ball the way I shot all the other balls, try not to use english and center ball hit. I will try and just shoot the ball the way I play all of the other shots and see what happens. Thanks for the help.
Tom
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
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I was taught that very thing in the late 60' By Baltimore 'Buddy' Dennis and his road partner "Gus The Greek'. I traveled with them at times. We would talk a lot about pool. He was the one that told me to practice using 10 balls for 9 ball. Play position on the 10 ball when shooting the 9 . I didn't miss many 9 balls after that !


My Man Buddy D.! What a sweetheart he was. Thanks for mentioning him. Put a smile on my face for a second.
 

gregcantrall

Center Ball
Silver Member
I had noticed it before but really was made more aware of it while watching Billiard Network YouTube matches that recently have Earl Strickland doing the solo commentary.

What I'm seeing (and hearing from Earl) is that when the pros are shooting a money ball (most commonly in rotation and 8-ball) is that although the last ball can easily be pocketed by using center cue ball with zero chance of scratching, they usually impart some sort of low, side, or a combination of both to make the shot.

Why do they do that???

I'm going to take a wild guess, but please enlighten me with the truth. Is to negate the chances of skid?

Maniac (has always hit center cue ball on these types of shots)
Here is Barry Stark on, “Angled Pots - Why Use Side?”
 

evergruven

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Now it could be argued that the encreased force behind the CB / OB contact will lessen the 'climbing' effect. I wouldn't argue against that train of thought, but I wouldn't begin to know how to validate the opinion.
that's what'm sayin..less time in between revs for the cb to grip the ob=less climb chance?
 

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
that's what'm sayin..less time in between revs for the cb to grip the ob=less climb chance?
Ya... or maybe it compacts the garbage between the balls so instead of climbing it just does more so what's normally expected...?

I really don't know the theory... Just experience telling me that kicks at high force tend not to be so detrimental
 

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Here is Barry Stark on, “Angled Pots - Why Use Side?”
Very good video. I’m no expert, but is he not missing something here? Barry absolutely fails to mention any adjustments in aim that need to be accounted for when applying outside (helping) spin on a shot, to account for deflection.
 

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
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Note: moving forward I will only refer to a kick/skid/whatever as a kick.
...
If you really want to avoid misunderstanding, I recommend "bad contact" which actually describes what's happening. A lot of European players seem to use that.

A kick is, of course, something else to most Americans and it involves a cushion.
 

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
If you really want to avoid misunderstanding, I recommend "bad contact" which actually describes what's happening. A lot of European players seem to use that.

A kick is, of course, something else to most Americans and it involves a cushion.
Ya... but I'll continue to use metric ;)
 

sparkle84

AzB Silver Member
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Very good video. I’m no expert, but is he not missing something here? Barry absolutely fails to mention any adjustments in aim that need to be accounted for when applying outside (helping) spin on a shot, to account for deflection.
Go to 6:40 where he states that allowances have to be made. I'll just expand on that a little by saying that allowances (adjustments) don't necessarily have to be made in all cases.
You've been playing a long time so I'd think you'd know that there are a certain type and range of shots where due to speed and distance no adjustment is necessary. I call them self adjusting when throw and deflection tend to cancel each other out.
 

ChrisinNC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You've been playing a long time so I'd think you'd know that there are a certain type and range of shots where due to speed and distance no adjustment is necessary. I call them self adjusting when throw and deflection tend to cancel each other out.
Yes, I do agree with that. I found it surprising that Barry stated virtually no player would ever choose to use inside spin if they don’t have to. I guess I’m one of those few exceptions who often prefers it.
 

gregcantrall

Center Ball
Silver Member
Yes, I do agree with that. I found it surprising that Barry stated virtually no player would ever choose to use inside spin if they don’t have to. I guess I’m one of those few exceptions who often prefers it.
I assume Barry’s clarification would be, “no professional player.”
 
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