Radius of the cut of a leather wrap

cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Does anyone know the exact radius that needs to be cut at the top and bottom of a leather wrap. I am trying to design something in a 3d program and i need the exact radius for both the top and bottom of the leather wrap . I think i remember it being in my cue man book but I don't have it here right now. If anyone could help me I'd appreciate it. For some reason i am thinking one of them was like 3 degrees but i cant remember. Anyway any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
It's a relatively simple math calculation, one that you should probably learn
since not all cues are the same diameter. Need more clues ?

KJ
 

cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's a relatively simple math calculation, one that you should probably learn
since not all cues are the same diameter. Need more clues ?

KJ
True however most cues are relatively close to the same size and since the little differences between the various cues does not change the outcome of the results very much and leather stretches, I don't need to learn the math. Think about it, 99 percent of the people that install wraps, use wrap templates and cut them the same size every time. As a matter of fact I'd be willing to bet money that if complex math was involved, 90 percent of the people I have seen install wraps wouldn't be able to do it.

However since you mentioned it I wouldn't mind knowing the math and since your willing to help and obviously know the math already I'll take that as well. Honestly if I was on my home computer I have a flattening plugin that would do it for me but instead, I have to rely on the kindness of others and google to do it now.

Thank you in advance though...
 

JoeyInCali

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Would 1" at the top and 1.170" at the bottom ( diameters ) help.
A little less than half a degree in angle.
 

KJ Cues

Pro Cue Builder & Repair
Silver Member
Does anyone know the exact radius that needs to be cut at the top and bottom of a leather wrap. I am trying to design something in a 3d program and i need the exact radius for both the top and bottom of the leather wrap . I think i remember it being in my cue man book but I don't have it here right now. If anyone could help me I'd appreciate it. For some reason i am thinking one of them was like 3 degrees but i cant remember. Anyway any help would be greatly appreciated.

You did state "exact radius". Now exact doesn't matter.....OK.
You'll be home before you know it.
If the suspense is too great, Google it.
I left my spoon in the kitchen.
 
You did state "exact radius". Now exact doesn't matter.....OK.
You'll be home before you know it.
If the suspense is too great, Google it.
I left my spoon in the kitchen.

He did say 'radius', but I don't think he knows what that word means.

There are two things at play, first the shape of the wrap (a truncated triangle) and second, the angle of the edge of the wrap to evenly miter the edges.

Both are easily calculated using very basic maths when the diameter of the ends and the thickness of the wrap are all known.
 

FLYINGSNAIL

Koo Cues
Silver Member
You did state "exact radius". Now exact doesn't matter.....OK.
You'll be home before you know it.
If the suspense is too great, Google it.
I left my spoon in the kitchen.

Is that silver or gold spoon ? Maybe just any spoon? :shrug::shrug::shrug:

would this help???:thumbup:

Radius and I.d..jpg

Radius calculation.jpg
 
Last edited:

cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Obviously I asked too complicated of a question for you people. Why is it every time someone asks me a question I try to help them out as much as possible but when I ask something I have ten f*cking idiots chiming in with useless shit and being f*cking morons? If it was so easy to f*cking google it I would have had it already but instead I spent most of the day looking it up and still am no further along.

ElCorazonFrio
Yes I know what a radius is and I used the word radius because every wrap template I have ever seen advertised says "cut the radius" at the ends of the wrap blank.

https://www.cuesmith.com/a-leather-wrap-fixture-449.html
"Leather Wrap Template for cutting the proper radius on the ends of the leather wrap when cutting it to length."

http://www.uniqueinc.com/inc/sdetail/1933/5253
"Leather Cutting Template for cutting the ends of the leather. Radius is a median for cues, which allows the leather wrap to tuck into the channel very nice."

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=353014&highlight=wrap+template
"Is there any interest in a leather wrap radius template and measuring guide?"

So obviously some very smart people that make the templates also call it a radius so I'm not alone. And since it is "the specific distance from the center in all directions" (webster dictionary not me) I would say it is definitely a radius because it is a specific distance from center. I am sorry; however, that everyone that sells these things calls it that. I will get right on notifying everyone that you said they were incorrect and that they should change their wording immediately.

KJ
If it is a relatively easy calculation then why instead of telling me how relatively easy it is, Didn't you just put the equation there. Probably took more time to write out a smart ass comment then it did to just write out the math. That is unless it isn't a n easy calculation. This is the closest thing I could find, and nowhere in there is anything resembling simple math.

http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Wrapping_a_cone_with_laminate.html

Oh and I'm not home before I knew it just in case you where wondering, and am still no closer to finding the answer . But thanks for all the great help you gave.

I am so f*cking tired of seeing some one say every two seconds google it. Every time I see it i just want to tell the person to go f*ck themselves. I mean seriously.

This is how my day started. I got up and and had this really great idea. But I needed an exact number to feed into my 3d rendering software so I could have the part built. So the first thing I did was spend an hour onl AZBilliards looking through old posts trying to find if it had ever been answered before. I know it had been asked before because I asked it and all I got was a bunch of *ssholes saying google it.

So then I went to google and spent another two hours just searching for anything even remotely close to what I am looking for. I found bits and pieces here and there but nothing definitive. So after two hours of searching google I figured well maybe I can ask a simple f*cking question and get a simple f*cking answer on AZBilliards. (I know your thinking, yeah right, that will work.)

Then the first reply I get is someone saying how superior they are to me because its "a relatively simple math calculation" And they ask if I need more clues? Really if I was there I would choke the f*ck out of them with my bare hands, but I'm not. Do I need more clues? Yes obviously I do. I google "simple f*cking math" and it came up way short of anything useful just like the reply I got from him!

Then he tells me to google it. F*ck you. I did google it. At this point I have been on google more today than I have been getting stuff done because of the stellar f*cking help I got from here saying google it.

Then I get someone saying "I don't think he knows what a radius is" Again F*ck you. Seriously? You're going to f*ck with me because I used a word that everyone in the industry uses. Go f*ck yourself. Then someone attaches pictures. I know how to find the radius of the f*cking circle it s the radius of the cut I cant figure out. Again if it's so f*cking easy why not just say how to do it instead of acting like a superior *sshole.

So now its 10 pm I have worked off an on all day trying to figure it out and have spent about 7 or 8 hours collectively researching it. I still have no Idea what the answer is.

At this point I have just given up hope that anyone at AZBilliards knows the answer and there is just a bunch of trolls with nothing better to do than f*ck with someone who needed a little bit of help. Why don't you guys just go to the hospital or old folks home and start pushing people down the stairs too. Self righteous pr*cks.

All you do by saying google it is show that either A you don't know the answer and should have kept your mouth shut in the first place, or B you know the answer and want to act like a self righteous *sshole and should have kept your mouth shut.

Dont give me the bullsh*t sob story that you spent a hundred years learning your craft. You didn't invent the f*cking wheel, you. And since 90 percent of the cues on the market today are made in mostly the same way, You got help from someone else, because you cant tell me every single person who ever built a cue came up with the exact same ideas on their own. Give me a break!!! All saying that does is prove your and idiot or an *sshole.

I realise that there are people out there way smarter than I am. I also realise that there are people that have spent many years, and a lot of money, perfecting the trade. However if you are so worried about giving out the radius of a f*cking cut on a wrap you will never touch and has no bearing on your business in any way, Then I feel sorry for you.

Now if there is anyone who actually either knows the answer, Knows how to get the answer and is willing to help, or Has a wrap fixture and wouldn't mind taking a couple seconds to take a few measurements. I would greatly appreciate it.

If all you are going to do is troll and act like an asshole then move along.
 
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jazznpool

Superior Cues--Unchalked!
Gold Member
Silver Member
Assuming you already have the necessary skills, if you keep your lines top and bottom parallel a radius is not necessary to install superb quality leather wraps. Don't let me stand in your way of making it more complicated though.
 
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cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Assuming you already have the necessary skills, if you keep your lines top and bottom parallel a radius is not necessary to install superb quality leather wraps. Don't let me stand in your way of making it more complicated though.

Although I have the skills and have done it with straight cuts, I prefer doing it with a template. And since the question wasn't how to do a wrap, but what the radius is you have effectively answered nothing at all, but don't let me get in your way of sounding indignant while accomplishing nothing at all.
 

JoeyInCali

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
How about I trace one and send you the drawing?
That way you can have the side measurement.
You can trim the big circle on top and bottom when drawing on CAD or CAM.
 

cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
How about I trace one and send you the drawing?
That way you can have the side measurement.
You can trim the big circle on top and bottom when drawing on CAD or CAM.

That would actually work. That or if you want to just take a few measurements that would work too. Whatever is easiest for you.
 

JoeyInCali

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That would actually work. That or if you want to just take a few measurements that would work too. Whatever is easiest for you.

Ok.
PM me your number.
I have 3 templates. One stretchable one.
I'll send you pics tomorrow. I have MM ruler too to measure them.
 
Obviously I asked too complicated of a question for you people. Why is it every time someone asks me a question I try to help them out as much as possible but when I ask something I have ten f*cking idiots chiming in with useless shit and being f*cking morons? If it was so easy to f*cking google it I would have had it already but instead I spent most of the day looking it up and still am no further along.

ElCorazonFrio


KJ


I am so f*cking tired of seeing some one say every two seconds google it. Every time I see it i just want to tell the person to go f*ck themselves. I mean seriously.

This is how my day started. I got up and and had this really great idea. But I needed an exact number to feed into my 3d rendering software so I could have the part built. So the first thing I did was spend an hour onl AZBilliards looking through old posts trying to find if it had ever been answered before. I know it had been asked before because I asked it and all I got was a bunch of *ssholes saying google it.

So then I went to google and spent another two hours just searching for anything even remotely close to what I am looking for. I found bits and pieces here and there but nothing definitive. So after two hours of searching google I figured well maybe I can ask a simple f*cking question and get a simple f*cking answer on AZBilliards. (I know your thinking, yeah right, that will work.)

Then the first reply I get is someone saying how superior they are to me because its "a relatively simple math calculation" And they ask if I need more clues? Really if I was there I would choke the f*ck out of them with my bare hands, but I'm not. Do I need more clues? Yes obviously I do. I google "simple f*cking math" and it came up way short of anything useful just like the reply I got from him!

Then he tells me to google it. F*ck you. I did google it. At this point I have been on google more today than I have been getting stuff done because of the stellar f*cking help I got from here saying google it.

Then I get someone saying "I don't think he knows what a radius is" Again F*ck you. Seriously? You're going to f*ck with me because I used a word that everyone in the industry uses. Go f*ck yourself. Then someone attaches pictures. I know how to find the radius of the f*cking circle it s the radius of the cut I cant figure out. Again if it's so f*cking easy why not just say how to do it instead of acting like a superior *sshole.

So now its 10 pm I have worked off an on all day trying to figure it out and have spent about 7 or 8 hours collectively researching it. I still have no Idea what the answer is.

At this point I have just given up hope that anyone at AZBilliards knows the answer and there is just a bunch of trolls with nothing better to do than f*ck with someone who needed a little bit of help. Why don't you guys just go to the hospital or old folks home and start pushing people down the stairs too. Self righteous pr*cks.

All you do by saying google it is show that either A you don't know the answer and should have kept your mouth shut in the first place, or B you know the answer and want to act like a self righteous *sshole and should have kept your mouth shut.

Dont give me the bullsh*t sob story that you spent a hundred years learning your craft. You didn't invent the f*cking wheel, you. And since 90 percent of the cues on the market today are made in mostly the same way, You got help from someone else, because you cant tell me every single person who ever built a cue came up with the exact same ideas on their own. Give me a break!!! All saying that does is prove your and idiot or an *sshole.

I realise that there are people out there way smarter than I am. I also realise that there are people that have spent many years, and a lot of money, perfecting the trade. However if you are so worried about giving out the radius of a f*cking cut on a wrap you will never touch and has no bearing on your business in any way, Then I feel sorry for you.

Now if there is anyone who actually either knows the answer, Knows how to get the answer and is willing to help, or Has a wrap fixture and wouldn't mind taking a couple seconds to take a few measurements. I would greatly appreciate it.

If all you are going to do is troll and act like an asshole then move along.

I have to apologize. I didn't realize what you were looking for and I now realize that there is a radius on the two ends of the wrap, that the wrap is not a truncated triangle.

If you give me the measurements for the two diameters of the ends of your wraps, I will happily do the math. I will also send you a solidworks or .dwg or .igs file of a wrap in the dimensions you need. Please send the wrap thickness, also.

Again, I am sorry--I thought you were asking a different question.
 

cammel8

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have to apologize. I didn't realize what you were looking for and I now realize that there is a radius on the two ends of the wrap, that the wrap is not a truncated triangle.

If you give me the measurements for the two diameters of the ends of your wraps, I will happily do the math. I will also send you a solidworks or .dwg or .igs file of a wrap in the dimensions you need. Please send the wrap thickness, also.

Again, I am sorry--I thought you were asking a different question.

No problem.
 

LGSM3

Jake<built cues for fun
Silver Member
Depends on taper

At the risk of sounding like a fool, I'll say that the neighborhood of 22" should give u a good starting point. I'm not aware of the formula and wouldn't think it would used often enough to google with good results. 22" ish is just a wild ass guess I came up with in my head
 

pdcue

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
No problem.

Well girls, since I am a self declared Math Genius - I must brag about I knew
straight away he was asking about the arc radius of the frustum required to wrap
a truncated cone also known as a cue<stick>.

Why you may ask,

I calculated it my own self several moons ago.

To the OP - Best as I can recall it was something like 74 inches for the top and 79
for the bottom.

Frito, are you listening?

Dale(who needed his friend with the Masters Degree in Electrical Engineering to
tell him the name of the shape. In the interest of full and candid disclosure.)
 

Scratchy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think the formula you are looking for is:

h = length of the wrap
r1 = radius at the top of the wrap (cue diameter/2)
r2 = radius at the bottom of the wrap (cue diameter/2)
L = radius point for bottom wrap

L = (h x r2)/(r2 - r1)
L - h = radius point for top wrap

Typical numbers using .840" at joint with a .014"/" straight taper:

h = 12
r1 = 1.008/2 = .504
r2 = 1.176/2 = .588

L = (12 x .588)/(.588 - .504) = 84 inch radius for the bottom
L - h = 84 -12 = 72 inch radius for the top

Happy New Year to everyone -

best regards,

mac
 
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