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I don't think it would have. Seems like Shane caught gear early and really never gave Jonathan a chance. The issue might have gotten to Jonathan but when you are in your chair, you don't have much of a chance.
Referee controversy during SBE men's pro final match?
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I don't think it would have. Seems like Shane caught gear early and really never gave Jonathan a chance. The issue might have gotten to Jonathan but when you are in your chair, you don't have much of a chance.
BINGO! You just verified what someone told me.
Well, i didn't see the match, so i don't know who caught what.
BUT, i must say, it is much easier to catch a gear and freewheel if my opponent is in the tank for whatever reason.
It's just that much easier when you know someone is off their game.
Frank was also the master of ceremonies at the Challenge of Champions, which I attended in October at Mohegan Sun and, in my view, did a pretty good job there.
As a referee, he's not the best, but he also serves as both tournament director and master of ceremonies, and in these capacities, he's quite capable, even though he does have this strange habit of saying "are we having a good time?" to the crowd way too often.
I see potential in Frank, but agree with most that he needs to be reined in a little.
Finally, I think any suggestion that the result might have been different had the referee conducted himself differently is inappropriate. Given how many break and runs Shane completed in the match, he was virtually unbeatable, playing near-perfect ten ball.
As a referee, he's not the best, but he also serves as both tournament director and master of ceremonies, and in these capacities, he's quite capable, even though he does have this strange habit of saying "are we having a good time?" to the crowd way too often.
I see potential in Frank, but agree with most that he needs to be reined in a little.
Finally, I think any suggestion that the result might have been different had the referee conducted himself differently is inappropriate. Given how many break and runs Shane completed in the match, he was virtually unbeatable, playing near-perfect ten ball.
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Care to be more specific? I used to see Scott on all the accustats stuff.
Scott used to be the TD for the bulk of the pro events. I've seen him sleeping in a chair in the corner of more than one event. I did not witness what happened in VF nor do I remember exactly what was relayed to me but I seem to recall he was caught sleeping on the job.
In the last few yrs most promoters have either stopped using Scott altogether or have moved him to the asst. TD for various reasons.
sbe final
i was there and watched most of the match,pinegar was upset mostly because he knew he was going to have to have a liver transplant after that match
i was there and watched most of the match,pinegar was upset mostly because he knew he was going to have to have a liver transplant after that match
Heres my 2 cents on Frank. I have seen him in action before and I was also at the SBE. I did not attend the finals. Frank seems to want to be the center of attention. At one point he was holding a conversation with a player who was playing his match. Hey if you are friends with someone and you are ok to say a couple things then thats up to whoever. He was holding the conversation with the mic in his hand though so as to make sure that the crowd could her his every word. He is not funny in my opinion and I really don't have anything positive to say about him. I don't know him I am just going by what I have seen of him.
Frank is awful - my 2 cents
I have also been there to witness Frank in action at the Challenge of Champions as well as this past SBE pro tournament (though i was unable to watch the finals). At the Challenge of Champions he was clearly playing favorites. What I mean by that is he would snap his fingers when a player he favored did something well and he wouldn't let the player he didn't like to check the rack (I've seen him give these players loose racks and or put the 2 & 3 ball behind the 9). At VF, he was again playing favorites. An example was when he put Caroline Pao and Morgan Steinman on the shot clock, perfectly fine since matches were running late. The problem was Frank would say "Good shot" and do the snaps for Morgan after alot of her shots and wasn't really keeping the shot clock on her (i say this b/c i was running my own clock to see from my phone on both players). Frank was even carrying on a conversation with Morgan while Caroline was shooting. To me that isn't a very professional way to carry yourself. As a ref, you should be impartial and I've seen on more than one occasion actions to prove the contrary. I agree with the other posters here that he definitely has a mightier than thou attitude. If possible, i say replace this hack comedian/tourney director with someone who was more appropriate.
I have also been there to witness Frank in action at the Challenge of Champions as well as this past SBE pro tournament (though i was unable to watch the finals). At the Challenge of Champions he was clearly playing favorites. What I mean by that is he would snap his fingers when a player he favored did something well and he wouldn't let the player he didn't like to check the rack (I've seen him give these players loose racks and or put the 2 & 3 ball behind the 9). At VF, he was again playing favorites. An example was when he put Caroline Pao and Morgan Steinman on the shot clock, perfectly fine since matches were running late. The problem was Frank would say "Good shot" and do the snaps for Morgan after alot of her shots and wasn't really keeping the shot clock on her (i say this b/c i was running my own clock to see from my phone on both players). Frank was even carrying on a conversation with Morgan while Caroline was shooting. To me that isn't a very professional way to carry yourself. As a ref, you should be impartial and I've seen on more than one occasion actions to prove the contrary. I agree with the other posters here that he definitely has a mightier than thou attitude. If possible, i say replace this hack comedian/tourney director with someone who was more appropriate.
Since I was not at the SBE, I don't feel qualified to make a judgment one way or the other about this ref. He did do a couple of things that really surprised me, however. First was a call he missed in the Deuel vs. Hatch match. If you go to 1:29:00 in this ustream video, you will see the shot I am referring to:
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/5588663
I know that a ref is occasionally going to flub a call, but this one was, as Corey said, "not even close".
The other thing that surprised me is that when he decided to admonish Pinegar in the final match, regardless of whether it was deserved or not, he did so with the microphone on at least one occasion. Maybe this is common practice, but I think it would have been more professional if he had approached Jon and spoken to him in a more private manner.
Aaron
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/5588663
I know that a ref is occasionally going to flub a call, but this one was, as Corey said, "not even close".
The other thing that surprised me is that when he decided to admonish Pinegar in the final match, regardless of whether it was deserved or not, he did so with the microphone on at least one occasion. Maybe this is common practice, but I think it would have been more professional if he had approached Jon and spoken to him in a more private manner.
Aaron
I have played J.Pinegar or Hennessy which is another name he goes by and can tell you the guy wants to win. He has a very fast style and likes to move around the table quickly. Given Shane's style I could see him wanting to jump out of his chair, but not to do anything disrespectful given Shane's respectability. I was disappointed I missed the match and thought it would be a good one. Hats off to J.P for making the finals.
A few years ago at VF I was in the pro arena when it was an 8ball tournament. Archer vs Deuel in one of the early matches. Match runs a little long. Frank actually goes over to the players and asks them to speed it up.
These 2 are playing for there livelyhoods and he is telling them to get on with it.
These 2 are playing for there livelyhoods and he is telling them to get on with it.
WOW!
Talk about a bad call. WOW!
And how can you keep on shooting after THAT shot.
LOLGotta love pool.
Heath, he does it several times to various tables this year too but the messed up thing is he'll go to them in the middle of the rack!
Agreed...and that the eight banked off the long rail into the side. That can't happen if you hit the one first.
you don't need to be a ref to know that if it's gonna be a close call and high speed then just watch where the balls go and you can instantly tell good or bad
There's no doubt about the hit being bad. The 8 ball was driven directly into the side rail. It's not the first time a ref has failed to make a correct call and won't be the last.
Referees have a difficult job to do and for the most part a thankless one, whether they are impartial or biased. It's will always be all about whose ox is getting gored.
The attaboys and attagirls need to be reserved to before and after the match, especially by the tournament directors and referees, regardless of their personal feelings.
JoeyA
This is not a good report on Frank and now I have read several others like the above. Like I said I don't know the man and have never seen him work in person. But reading all this would make me want to get a closer look at how he operates before hiring him. One thing I've learned that is an absolute! The match is NOT about the referee/TD, it IS about the players! A good referee or TD is rarely seen and barely noticed, especially if you are doing a good job. You should stay in the background as much as possible.
Of course saying this, there are times when you MUST get involved, particularly when there are words between players. I will always step in before it gets serious. My job is to make the matches and the tournament run as smoothly as possible. And to remain as low profile as possible. The fans come to see the players play, not the referee!