poolpro said:I have had this conversation many times before. In my opinion it comes down to this: People like the idea of a "handmade cue". It feels more "special" because someone took more time to make it. It is a fondness for a traditional item. Like old handmade furniture. People appreciate the "old world" feel of methods coming from a simpler time. I think this leads to many misconceptions.
First off "hand made" is ridiculous. I do not know any cuemkers sitting down with a pocket knife and a couple of carving tools and whittlling down a length of wood into a cue. So no cue is hand made. Cuemaking is an art in my opinion. The art is in the design and execution of that design by whatever means gets a superior product. A CNC cue is still made much like a non CNC cue untill you get to the inlays. Everyone on here knows that inlays do not add ANYTHING to the playability of a cue. So why would it matter how you decorate a quality cue? At what point in its construction does this cue "become" less than a handmade cue?
I have been in various trades for most of my life. I have worked in assembly line factories, I have done custom woodworking and carpentry. I have a knowledge of design and manufacturing. My simple question is why would you fault a craftsman for using the finest tools and techniques available to him? For all of you tradinalists out there, do you think that the people making things the "old world " way did so because they wanted to do things the hard way, or because it was the best method they had available at the time?
I LOVE THIS LINE OF THOUGHT, BECAUSE WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT IS ESSENTIALLY A "TOOL". SO WHILE TALKING ABOUT HOW IMPORTANT HAVING THE BEST AVAILABLE "TOOL" FOR US TO USE, WE SAY THAT USING THE BEST AVAILABLE TOOLS IS NOT IMPORTANT, AND SHOULD BE DISCOURAGED. DOES ANYBODY ELSE SEE THIS AS CRAZY?
It is the same reason why people appreciate classic cars. It brings back all the great memories of a simpler time. Even though we now have fuel injection, anti lock brakes and air bags, these new cars just don't have the same "charm". This is a PERCEPTION. This is not an issue of quality. In this example, it is a mass produced item. Thousands of chevys were made, all identical to each other. We are not appreciting anything hand made at all. There is a perception that they don't make em like they used to.
I have done the same woodworking jobs with and without the best tools available to me. In each case I have done the best job that I was able to do to deliver best quality product to my customer. I used to build custom cabinets and countertops. At one time I pretty much had a handfull of hand tools and a router table, and a bench saw. I got the job done, no complaints. Later on I had a shop full of tools and machines. I was able to do the same things much better and faster than I ever could have before. The end result was a BETTER product in less time. I had gigantic sanders, and shapers. These were MORE precise and faster. The sanders were still using sand paper against the wood, but more consistant and less time. Why would you possibly care if I held that piece of sandpaper in my hand or not?
Let's suppose you hire two carpenters to come to your house and due the trim in two different rooms. One shows up with a hand saw, a miter box, hammer and nails, the other shows up with a power compound miter saw, a nail gun, and a compressor. Who are you going to hire? Now, the first guy will be done in a day, the other guy will take much longer.
I just think it is weird that when it comes to cues, precision is what most people are looking for, but when there is a way to increase precision, people say "why would I want that?".
Do you want a cuemaker who uses a micrometer or a "that looks pretty close to me" attitude? Pool has been around a long time. Longer than vulcanized rubber. I think we should all boycott rubber cushions. I think knowing a predictable rebound angle is for the young kids. Just a passing fad. Lets play my game: ivory balls, no rubber cushions, no leather cue tips, no woven cloth. Let's really get traditional.
I FEAR CHANGE!
I love tradition. I appreciate it for what it is. I drool over classic cars, antique cues, and vintage guitars. Just don't knock a craftsman for trying to give his customers the best quality product that he knows how to in the most practical way he can. Most of the people in any industry who are remebered are the pioneers. Why? Because they were always searching to find a new, better way to do something. They develop new methods and strive to make a btter product. What kills me is the most well known cuemaker BOUGHT his blanks from other makers ( talk about saving time!).
Again, no disrespect to anyone. If you "feel" that the more primitive the better than go ahead. I have a pocket knife, and some time to kill, anyone want a cue?
I agree with you 100%. There are two types of cues. Tools to be used for moving balls around and collectors, to sit in cabinets and look pretty. I build tools, the others can build the collectors. I've got nothing against the use of CNCs. I've got nothing against the use of Pantomills. I've got nothing against the use of exacto-knives and chisels. Through the use of these different tools you will get different results however. With the exacto knives and chisels you can have sharp pointed, clean inlays but some times not perfect glue lines. With the proper use of a CNC you can have slightly rounded points in inlays but they can be sharpened with the hand method of the exacto knife. With a Pantomill you get larger rounded corners on inlays as they have great difficulty using the finer cutters that can be used in a CNC which has controlled movement but these corners, just like the CNC corners, can be cleaned up and made sharp with the use of the hand held exacto knife.
The only thing that upsets me is when someone claims that the use of a Pantomill is manual while a CNC is machined. To me, this is a sign of someone who hasn't the knowledge to operate one or can't afford the use of one. It really takes a lot of skill to push a handle around. Ranks right up there with sweeping the floor or taking out the garbage. I also say CNC is machined but I also say Pantomill is machined. They use the same cutters and in fact if some one wanted to they could have a Pantomill one day , mount some motors and the next day have it CNC. They both do exactly the same thing, the only difference is the pattern that they follow. As far as I'm concerned, the only hand work is with chisels and knives.
I use to have a Pantomill but I have sold it and now use CNC. My cues look nice and play well but the time consuming factors have been eliminated. I seldom sharpen my inlays with an exacto but I charge accordingly. If you are looking for those kind of details then I'm not your man but then again I sell my cues for half of the prices of cues with these details. Could I do them? of coarse but that is not my market. People who want good playing instruments at a very affordable price is who my customers are and they are usually happy
Dick
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CNC cue worth 5000 bucks and a simple hoppe style """hand crafted""" cue... if i wasnt alowed to resale it i`d always take the """hand crafted""" one!
