Should Cuemaker offer free repair on their own cue when the forearm broke in half?

[TheDragon]

I have a 2 years old custom cue that was broken in half at the forearm while I was playing a normal shot on a league night.
It broke right below the black collar close to the joint, you can see the pin and thread from the broken piece.
Please give your honest opinion, should the Cuemaker offer a free repair? What would most Cuemaker do?
Thanks.

 

[cueaddicts]

Certainly, if that was not the result of abuse. If it was an established maker that knows what he's doing, then I would venture an educated guess that at least 95% of the time something like this happens with a cue, it's abuse. If the cue was abused, then no...

 

[dr9ball]

I have a 2 years old custom cue that was broken in half at the forearm while I was playing a normal shot on a league night.
It broke right below the black collar close to the joint, you can see the pin and thread from the broken piece.
Please give your honest opinion, should the Cuemaker offer a free repair? What would most Cuemaker do?
Thanks.

I believe more information may be needed in this case. From the cuemaker's perspective it may appear that the cue was abused. From the player's perspective the cue just exploded. Somewhere in the middle is where the truth probably lies. Was the cue used to break with? If so, did the breaker place an undue amount of pressure on the joint by bending the shaft like Mike Sigel does?

I"m going to say there just isn't enough information to determine what the cuemaker should do. Has the cuemaker had a chance to inspect the cue?

 

[schitzngigglz]

I can't see a cue breaking at the forearm under normal use unless it had some trauma before hand.

Pictures of the break would help.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

I would say that most would repair if it not abuse. In certain circumstances, how you can tell the difference in normal play as opposed to abuse, I don't know.

But, it does bring up one question. How long do you think a cue maker should be responsible for one of his cues? One year, two, the life of the cue?
What if the cue has changed hands once or twice, is he still responsible or does that responsibility cease when the original owner sells?

Are you the original owner, Dragon?

 

[SeanC]

Yes, they should. I don't see this being result of a "user error" but a manufacturing defect (bad choice of wood, etc.)...

 

[TheDragon]

Due to the privacy of the Cuemaker, I can't post the picture, but I can tell you that it happened during normal playing and it was not abused. I had many league players who witnessed it and it was kind of embarrassed that I've already told them how well does this custom cue play.

 

[Cdryden]

First off, sorry to hear about your cue, that sucks.

I didnt vote on your poll because the question is too subjective. But in your case if I was the cue maker I would wonder if in the 2 years you had it did you drop it, smack it on the table, or abuse it in any way. If you did i would say it's your fault and no free repair.

If you didn't do any of those things and the break is due to a flaw in its design/construction then I say the cue maker should do a free repair or possibly pro-rate the repair.

In any case, good luck to you and I hope it works out.

 

[Black-Balled]

PRob not what a victim wants to hear, but I don't think so, given case as presented.

Without clear proof that the break is the result of the maker's error, one can't expect him to assume responsibility for the break.

What I think is fairest for all parties is a no-fault replacement policy where the maker will replace the cue at a cost less than retail, but slightly over his cost. This relieves either party of the burden of proof.

I might argue that the no-fault replacement option should only be available to the original owner, btw...

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Are you the original owner?

When a pin is inserted in a forearm, the hole will be drilled a bit deeper to allow a small void to accommodate some of the epoxy that will be pushed down. Some pins have a glue relief to allow the epoxy to bleed upward. Some cue makers might drill a small hole in the fore arm to allow the glue to bleed out that way, some what like a relief hole in a ferrule.

When inserting a pin, what you will have is a build up of hydraulic pressure. This can blow out the side of a fore arm or may cause a small hairline crack in the wood. The hairline crack may be all the way thru to the surface but so small that it might be missed. Finishing over the crack would probably make it invisible to the naked eye. The crack may not have gone all the way to the surface but still there and cause a weak spot or an accident waiting to happen.

This is one way that your blow out may have happened. I would think that most repair men and cue makers would be able to tell if this is what happened by looking at the damage and how it cracked.

If a person breaks with their cue and bends the shaft into the table, this can create an undo amount of pressure on a pin also.

 

[LPCUSTOMCUES]

The cue in question is mine.
I have attached the pictures of the break.

In my opinion, its missuse/abuse. Too much pressure applied to the joint in some way.
The current owner bought this cue used from a person who bought it used
from the original owner.
In other words he is the third owner.

If I thought for a second it was broken due to how I built the cue I would have replaced the forearm and made the cue like new again. This isnt the case.

I offered to repair the cue (epoxy it back together) for $125. I think thats a reasonable price.

It broke my heart to see one of my cues like this.

 

[poolhalljnkie]

Would a cue sliding down the table (like you prop it there when racking) or it getting accidently bumped out of the tiger's paw on the table and hitting flat on a carpeted floor be considered abuse??

I am not in any way saying that this is what happened in this case but in my case I had this happen to 2 high end ($1000+) cues within a 3 month period from a Custom/Production Cuemaker & both of them snapped the forearm right below the joint in a diagonal manner so similiar you could switch the broken pieces & they would fit each cue almost identical. So I contacted the cuemaker and he claimed that I abused the cues & basically told me sorry about your bad luck. I just found it really odd that both cues snapped in exactly the same place with almost identical breaks....Ive got an old sneaky that has slid down a table and landed on carpeted, as well as concrete a cpl of times an it has sustained no damage.

Just Saying!!

KT <-----lays his cue on the table next to him or supported in his case when racking or not shooting now

 

[LPCUSTOMCUES]

Are you the original owner?

When a pin is inserted in a forearm, the hole will be drilled a bit deeper to allow a small void to accommodate some of the epoxy that will be pushed down. Some pins have a glue relief to allow the epoxy to bleed upward. Some cue makers might drill a small hole in the fore arm to allow the glue to bleed out that way, some what like a relief hole in a ferrule.

When inserting a pin, what you will have is a build up of hydraulic pressure. This can blow out the side of a fore arm or may cause a small hairline crack in the wood. The hairline crack may be all the way thru to the surface but so small that it might be missed. Finishing over the crack would probably make it invisible to the naked eye. The crack may not have gone all the way to the surface but still there and cause a weak spot or an accident waiting to happen.

This is one way that your blow out may have happened. I would think that most repair men and cue makers would be able to tell if this is what happened by looking at the damage and how it cracked.

While your statement is 100% true, this isnt what happened in this case.
I dont add glue to the hole, only to the pin. I also use very little as not to cause this to happen. I drill all the holes a 1/4" deeper to allow for any glue remnants to gather. I also screw the pin in very slow to allow any air trapped to escape up the threads.
It would be different if we were all guessing as to the cause but I know how I put the pin in.

 

[supergreenman]

While your statement is 100% true, this isnt what happened in this case.
I dont add glue to the hole, only to the pin. I also use very little as not to cause this to happen. I drill all the holes a 1/4" deeper to allow for any glue remnants to gather. I also screw the pin in very slow to allow any air trapped to escape up the threads.
It would be different if we were all guessing as to the cause but I know how I put the pin in.

Really really really nice cue...... sad situation. I can't see that kind of damage happening with out some sort of impact in the cues history.

 

[bud02]

I'm no expert in cue building but I do have some common sense.
I don't see any defect in the wood.I suspect that the cue was used with the joint not tightened, resulting in the energy being transferred from the shaft to forearm threw the pin alone. Don't think? so just back off your joint a quarter turn and break a rack.

Your a stand up guy Lee.
I have to agree I see only one possible way for that damage to occur. Maybe someone as a prank just popped the joint loose and set it down. Hard to say but it's not a defective build or materials IMHO.

 

[Johnson]

a guy i know bought a brand new meucci that split right @ the forearm when we were out playing 1 night with no foul play and he never even broke with it once, iirc it was right on a knot in the wood and meucci did replace it

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Exactly Lee. That is why I asked him twice if he was the original owner.
Also added the option of snapping the shaft into the table when breaking.
Pretty much why I didn't place a vote.

I also install my pins exactly how you described. You really don't need a lot of glue for a pin install.

Also, I think we have all seen many threads started like this. We all jump on the band wagon and side with the owner.
Bad cue maker Bad. Many times very quickly into the thread, we find out that there is a second side to the story.

Being the third owner, I can't see why a person would expect any repair to be free let alone starting a thread about it.
You just have no idea how the cue was treated during its previous ownership.

And Lee is a good guy. I just got a new one from him. Something happened in transit that was beyond anyones control.
Lee got the cue back and had it repaired within a week and its on its way back to me now.
With that said, I am sure that if he thought for one moment that it was his fault, he would have helped the guy out regardless of being a third owner.

 

[hotrod]

no fix

The cue in question is mine.
I have attached the pictures of the break.

In my opinion, its missuse/abuse. Too much pressure applied to the joint in some way.
The current owner bought this cue used from a person who bought it used
from the original owner.
In other words he is the third owner.

If I thought for a second it was broken due to how I built the cue I would have replaced the forearm and made the cue like new again. This isnt the case.

I offered to repair the cue (epoxy it back together) for $125. I think thats a reasonable price.

It broke my heart to see one of my cues like this.

How can you be expected to repair a 3rd owner cue. How can anyone know what treatment the cue received from the first owner and then again the second owner. There is no way to ever know the history of cue treatment by previous owners. 3rd owner may have done nothing wrong, but what occured from 1st or 2nd owner. We dont know. I think McD warrants its cues to original owner. Not transferable. My 2 cents

 

[cueaddicts]

How can you be expected to repair a 3rd owner cue. How can anyone know what treatment the cue received from the first owner and then again the second owner. There is no way to ever know the history of cue treatment by previous owners. 3rd owner may have done nothing wrong, but what occured from 1st or 2nd owner. We dont know. I think McD warrants its cues to original owner. Not transferable. My 2 cents

Yep....indeed.

 

[SLIM]

Sorry to see that your cue broke

i cannot imagine any cue maker looking at that & thinking that it was his fault.
If there was a manufacturing defect in the cue it would have made itself evident long ago.
In my thirty plus years of playing g pool & repairing cues i have seen this type of break several times.
I would have to say that in my experience; more often than not it is caused by smacking the stick on the table.

SLIM