Should the TAR table stay as is or go to standard pockets? You choose.

[Put_upor_shutup]

As far as playing I would prefer the tighter pockets..One pocket for sure.Worn cloth on the 4.25 would not be totally terrible.I would say for the viewer who just wants to see ppl run out all the time 4.25 would probably be alright.With the level of players u have playing on tar it wont be a huge difference.Obviously tighter is better for playing but for rotation games and fans as a whole.Bigger..A ton of ppl watch women's pool on ESPN..But who would watch em miss over and over on 4.18 inch pockets..

So your poll is for 4.5 inch or 4.18 inch..In order to see your business succeed I'm gonna say 4.5(rotation games)..If a person tells their friend to watch and nobody ever runs out I doubt they watch again..I have seen ppl who know nothing about pool walk thru and stop and watch.If u miss the first ball they walk off.If u continue to run out over and over again they stay and watch..Its true.Don't let new fans lose interest before they gain it.Now this is also because y'all put up the money.If players are risking/staked I think it should be their choice.But this is ur show and u have to make it last.
David Parker.

 

[koolkatt58]

Justin:

I think the pro cut Diamond pockets are the way to go. They are tough but fair and I think the audience wants to see good play, racks being run, and good patterns. I think making it too difficult is not good. It's not that a pro-cut is easy either you still have to have a lot of skill to be able to play good and win. Also from a viewing standpoint people tend to look at misses and say he dogged it, when in reality the pockets are so tight everyone would have trouble. When players like Darren and Shane miss you know it's too tough they are the best in the world.

 

[BeiberLvr]

Another thing is how many payment options you offer. The more ways you can take money in, the more you can make too, not everyone has Paypal so what about taking credit cards or perhaps you do already. If you were to ever do a big one pocket match this year I would try and do it fairly soon after the US Open One Pocket so it could be promoted on that stream. I enjoy the US Open One Pocket, it really is a good tournament, I actually enjoyed watching it in person more than Derby. These are all just my opinions when it comes to one pocket and you might be right and it does not even reach 100 buys.

You can use Paypal for TAR matches, but there is another option (although it was difficult for me to notice the first time) to use your debit or credit card.

 

[imissedthe9]

This poll should have had the option for 4.25 either way I think the poll is too close to change anything.

 

[donny mills]

In a perfect world- New cloth I like 4 1/8 and old cloth I like 4 1/2

 

[donny mills]

If I had to pick a size that's there no matter if the cloth is new or old I would choose 4.25.

 

[ENGLISH!]

I've not read the thread so please excuse me if I'm repeating anything.

How about a 10' table set up the same as the Earl / SVB match, but with no side pockets like Earl has talked about more than once.

If not that, then I vote for the same 10' type table as that match.

 

[Joe T]

Not sure if this was talked about but I'm not gonna go back through 18 pages to see so please forgive it was.
As Shane mentioned the conditions do change when the studio gets more people in there, everything gets a little stickier. Yes the cloth and the rails a lil but I think when the balls get a lil sticky is when it gets tough. They grab each other a lil more, grab the rails and the facings a lil more so a player wants to think its gonna stick a little so I better play it a lil thinner but then it doesn't stick as much. Next time you hit where you think you should and it clings and pulls the ball off line, this can make the players as tentitive as the tight pockets do. So I think it might help to switch out a clean set of balls every 10 racks when they take the break and it might help the situation a bit.

Either that or everybody learns a TOI and accelerates on every shot
Joke but no joke.

 

[theoneandonly]

I have to agree with put up..

As much as I love tight pockets, and seeing the pros hang some balls, I also like offensive pool. I think if players were running more packages for the $$, it would help sell the overall product. Ether way I'm still a big fan of TAR. They have been doing things right since day 1. Can't say enough good things about the streams and podcasts.

 

[markgw]

I'll play. I think 4.25" pockets on a Diamond table is the best of both worlds; challenging table, but loose enough for top players to play rotation games, without going into "tough table stroke".

In the absence of the 4.25" choice, I went with 4.5".


Eric

I wish 4 1/4 was an available choice, that is what I would vote for...

 

[AtLarge]

... How about a 10' table set up the same as the Earl / SVB match, but with no side pockets like Earl has talked about more than once.

If not that, then I vote fot the same 10' type table as that match.

The 10' table used for the Earl/Shane match in March, 2011 was a converted snooker table with weird pocket angles. realkingcobra called it a "circus table." I hope we never again see it used for a big match.

However, the Diamond 10' ProAm tables introduced at the Southern Classic in Tunica in July, 2012 played great. One of those would be good for any big match, although I probably would not favor using a 10' table for all TAR matches.

 

[PETROBOY]

Are you talking about that circus gaffed up 10ft converted snooker table...that someone tried to turn into a pocket pool table...what a joke that was, not to mention an insult to the real pool tables out here

I didn't know there was a table for pocket pool, I learned something today lol

 

[CJ Wiley]

The 10' table used for the Earl/Shane match in March, 2011 was a converted snooker table with weird pocket angles. realkingcobra called it a "circus table." I hope we never again see it used for a big match.

However, the Diamond 10' ProAm tables introduced at the Southern Classic in Tunica in July, 2012 played great. One of those would be good for any big match, although I probably would not favor using a 10' table for all TAR matches.

What made it a "circus table?"

 

[JCIN]

After looking at the majority of responses here (havent read the last few pages of the thread of yet as I was running errands yesterday), talking to players, Mark Griffin and Greg Sullivan....I came to a decision about what we are going to do on the TAR table pockets.

First I want to thank everyone who took the time to post their opinions and thoughts on the issue. I feel this community is what TAR is really all about so what people say here carries a great deal of weight. With that said I am now going to piss off half of you.

Going forward we will be switching back to the standard Diamond factory rails that give us 4.5" pockets. The reasons why:

- Personally I feel the table has become too much a factor in the matches. I noticed doing commentary on Friday that almost every rack we were mentioning something about the table and how a shot was tough on it or explaining how that ball wont go here etc etc. This is no good IMO. The focus should be on the players not the equipment.

- The quality of the end product. A few matches on the tight pockets have frankly been not much fun to watch. Guys start getting the pockets in their head and they change the way they play. This is not just my opinion this has been stated to me by players. Personally I feel that the tighter pockets take away much of the ability for players to get up and bridge a five or six game gap by catching a gear. It seriously limits the possibility that a guy could make a mistake at 20-20 and never shoot again or that a guy leading 22-19 could make a mistake and lose the set. I think big swings are exciting and that factor of a guy never really being out of it is very important.

- I have always wanted TAR to showcase the elite. Not anyone can just come play. In order to showcase that talent I feel the conditions should mirror as much as possible the conditions in which players have risen to that level. After much thought I decided it is kind of unfair to say to a guy "You have proven you play at the highest level. Now come play on this table that is tighter than any tournament table you have ever played on with people putting you under a microscope." We want to showcase the best in the world and give them a stage to show their skills. Standard pockets allow them to do what got them there so to speak.

- 4.5" pockets are not buckets. People miss balls all the time on them. We wont be seeing five and six packs left and right. They allow the possibility much more than the current pockets but they are a fair test for the players.

- It has been mentioned that standards are needed in pool. I agree for the most part. One thing I like about using standard Diamond pockets is a guy can watch a player make an out (or not) and then go set up the balls on any standard Diamond and see how hard or easy it is. With the current set up this is not possible.

The above are the reasons that pushed me to make the decision to switch. I am glad we tried the tight pockets. Its part of what TAR is about. We can try things and see how they really work in the real world. That is possible because of all the people who posted in this thread and more like you along with the sponsors and players who are a part of TAR. Thank you all for taking the time to contribute to this thread. The response has been amazing. I thank you.

2013 is shaping up to be a great year for TAR. I hope everyone sticks with us to see what we put together.


Please send any complaints for the decision to mark@alaskaisthegreatestohlooksquirrel.com

 

[JCIN]

What made it a "circus table?"

For starters no two pockets were the same. The top left one looked like it had a lazy eye.

 

[Jaden]

Justin....

After looking at the majority of responses here (havent read the last few pages of the thread of yet as I was running errands yesterday), talking to players, Mark Griffin and Greg Sullivan....I came to a decision about what we are going to do on the TAR table pockets.

First I want to thank everyone who took the time to post their opinions and thoughts on the issue. I feel this community is what TAR is really all about so what people say here carries a great deal of weight. With that said I am now going to piss off half of you.

Going forward we will be switching back to the standard Diamond factory rails that give us 4.5" pockets. The reasons why:

- Personally I feel the table has become too much a factor in the matches. I noticed doing commentary on Friday that almost every rack we were mentioning something about the table and how a shot was tough on it or explaining how that ball wont go here etc etc. This is no good IMO. The focus should be on the players not the equipment.

- The quality of the end product. A few matches on the tight pockets have frankly been not much fun to watch. Guys start getting the pockets in their head and they change the way they play. This is not just my opinion this has been stated to me by players. Personally I feel that the tighter pockets take away much of the ability for players to get up and bridge a five or six game gap by catching a gear. It seriously limits the possibility that a guy could make a mistake at 20-20 and never shoot again or that a guy leading 22-19 could make a mistake and lose the set. I think big swings are exciting and that factor of a guy never really being out of it is very important.

- I have always wanted TAR to showcase the elite. Not anyone can just come play. In order to showcase that talent I feel the conditions should mirror as much as possible the conditions in which players have risen to that level. After much thought I decided it is kind of unfair to say to a guy "You have proven you play at the highest level. Now come play on this table that is tighter than any tournament table you have ever played on with people putting you under a microscope." We want to showcase the best in the world and give them a stage to show their skills. Standard pockets allow them to do what got them there so to speak.

- 4.5" pockets are not buckets. People miss balls all the time on them. We wont be seeing five and six packs left and right. They allow the possibility much more than the current pockets but they are a fair test for the players.

- It has been mentioned that standards are needed in pool. I agree for the most part. One thing I like about using standard Diamond pockets is a guy can watch a player make an out (or not) and then go set up the balls on any standard Diamond and see how hard or easy it is. With the current set up this is not possible.

The above are the reasons that pushed me to make the decision to switch. I am glad we tried the tight pockets. Its part of what TAR is about. We can try things and see how they really work in the real world. That is possible because of all the people who posted in this thread and more like you along with the sponsors and players who are a part of TAR. Thank you all for taking the time to contribute to this thread. The response has been amazing. I thank you.

2013 is shaping up to be a great year for TAR. I hope everyone sticks with us to see what we put together.


Please send any complaints for the decision to mark@alaskaisthegreatestohlooksquirrel.com

I respect your decision and understand why you're making it even though I don't necessarily like it personally.

I am hoping to one day be considered good enough to play a TAR match and I would prefer to have the tighter pockets...I think that my preference for these pockets has to do with the way I aim. I see the pocket and the ball going into the pocket and I just aim for the center of the pocket. On the standard cut diamond pros you can't do that, you have to aim for certain sides of the pocket depending on the shot or there is a greater tendency to rattle the ball in the pocket...I have spent a lot of time on a standard diamond pro trying to adjust to that. I actually have played better on the 4" diamond at MBC in Georgia than the 4.5" diamond pro next to it because of this. I've BNR many 10 ball racks on the 4" pockets and have sometimes struggled on the standard.

Having said that, after you switch back to the standard rails I think you should consider having the current rails converted to 4.25" and try a match with them to see how that works...

Jaden

 

[JCIN]

Here's a question for Justin. What has been the most overall successful TAR match to date? Or the top 5?

Thats an easy equation:

SVB + Filipino = We Going Sizzler

(for anyone who doesnt get the reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o5NweFWjAw)

 

[Luxury]

Great decision Boss Man! Anxious to see the next match with a pro really juicing the rock when he needs to.

 

[AtLarge]

What made it a "circus table?"

Pocket angles: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2966122&postcount=34

 

[pt109]

Justin Collet for president.
I want to watch POOL....
...not some trap table game where the safties are easier.

Pool, imo, is a game where 'if you miss, you lose'.

On tight pockets, you can afford to miss.