No one can effectively argue against that point, only FOR it.
Anyone who tries, is basically going to get butchered.
Should there be a new aiming sub forum?
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No one can effectively argue against that point, only FOR it.
Anyone who tries, is basically going to get butchered.
For the record, Hal Houle was a patron for Ralph Greenleaf for about two years and took care of Ralph when Ralph was "down on his luck". I believe Hal once mentioned to me that he learned some things from Ralph, something about the "golden angle". :wink:
Dave, you can show a [P]rintable version of a thread, you can [E]mail a thread, or you canubscribe to a thread. Those are the only features in the "Thread Tools" menu -- at least in the "Tech Two" style/motif front-end I'm using. Once you subscribe to a thread, yes, you can then remove it from your subscription, but it is not ignored. There is no "Ignore" feature that I've found, for a THREAD. Yes, you can add a MEMBER to your Ignore list, but not a thread.
So unless you're using a custom style/motif front-end to read AZB with, you can't do this with the stock styles published here on AZB.
I think, based on your knowledge of the "Ignore a member" feature, you assumed it also exists for threads, but you're wrong. That is, unless, I'm about to eat a huge mound of crow, in which case, I accept my fate.
Prove me wrong.
A spirited and confident opponent -- I LIKE THAT! I hope to high-five you before we begin -- as friends -- and then high-five you again after you get out of your seat when I've slammed the last money ball home -- again, as friends.
WTF?!? Where'd that come from? No, Dave, you're actually wrong about me here, and also, way off base. So this is the tactic you resort to when you're backed into a corner from a carefully placed debate volley?
Correct. But this is an "all or nothing" thing. What if I like what you have to say, on, oh, CTE, but I don't like what you have to say on tournament rules? So I place you on Ignore and lose *everything* you have to say?
Incorrect. The only way to make a thread "disappear" (in Tech Two, that I've found anyway) is to voluntarily ignore it, or to have the moderators honor your request to have it moved/removed (assuming you yourself are that thread's originator).
Prove me wrong.
Where did I say that was "unreasonable," other than if you had your way of folding AZB down to at most two forums -- "Pool-related" and "Non-Pool-related"? Other than the lackluster Search feature, I use the current AZB tools with really no complaint, Dave. AZB is what is, and I'd accepted that (that's why I signed up to begin with). No, where I see issues, are if AZB were folded down into a dual free-for-all cauldron.
I gotta tell ya, man, you got brass! Does that CTE have alcohol content? Because it certainly is speaking! You can boast all you want, because that's not my style. I don't woof; I let my cue do all the talkin'. Let's make that meeting happen, and we'll see who pays that Morton's tab.
-Sean
P.S.: oh, and by the way, you've *yet* to address the content consolidation/archival question I posed in my earlier post -- something a subforum offers as a feature. That was a HUGE snip (or brush-aside). Why not address it?
I'll have to read it again - I didn't mean to brush it by. Believe me, when we play it'll be something gaffed up so you can't run 100
Maybe bank every other ball or something. haha
JoeyA said:
Joey, these things are embarrassing but that's what always seems to happen with aiming threads. I don't agree that the most intemperate people are the non-believers, as you seem to. Dr. Dave, unfailingly polite and objective, has had to put up with a lot of provocation but never (that I have seen) responds in kind. He's kind of a saint in that regard.
But no matter who throws the first punch, it happens. I'm reasonably sure the discussions would be more civilized in a separate forum.
Taking the long view, however, we're probably all overreacting to the recent spate of aiming threads. They come and go and our agitation over them will die down, until the next time.
Rich,
I've left out the names of the people who have done the embarassing things on purpose. NO ONE on the forum is a Saint. I am as close to a Saint as you can get, being a Saint's fan.
I don't believe the believers are without sin. However it sure seems the non-believers are the one who almost always seem to pizz in the believers' cheerios.
I don't see what the big deal is. Live and let live.
JoeyA
I say create another forum for all Aiming Methods.
This particular topic seems to bring with it, a lot of debate.
These debates turn into the opponents and proponents of it, fighting with each other EVERY TIME.
The ones that believe in it, tout it to everyone, the people that don't believe in it, badmouth it to everyone.
Still another group, are the ones that are looking for knowledge, but have to sift thru hundreds of people arguing back and forth about it.
You will also notice the same people jump into every thread that is started on it, and proceed to inform everyone about how they feel about it ALL OVER AGAIN! If you believe in it and it's helped your game, can't you just say it in one thread? If you think it's a bunch of hogwash, can't you just say it once and be done with it?
Anyways.... it should have it's own forum... You can get some sticky FAQS on each aiming method and other informational posts and then lock the thread down so the naysayers can't invade it.
You can let people argue about it all they want.. this is America, but you could have the Stickies there, as to help the people that would like to try different methods or would like more info on it, without sifting thru the war zone.
I think it would thin out the Main forum a bit. We don't really need CTE threads started EVERY DAY, do we? It's not enough for people to argue in one thread... People feel the need to start their own thread, for whatever reason, to state their opinion. It's not enough their opinion is stated in 48 other threads.... You know, in case someone missed it
This particular topic seems to bring with it, a lot of debate.
These debates turn into the opponents and proponents of it, fighting with each other EVERY TIME.
The ones that believe in it, tout it to everyone, the people that don't believe in it, badmouth it to everyone.
Still another group, are the ones that are looking for knowledge, but have to sift thru hundreds of people arguing back and forth about it.
You will also notice the same people jump into every thread that is started on it, and proceed to inform everyone about how they feel about it ALL OVER AGAIN! If you believe in it and it's helped your game, can't you just say it in one thread? If you think it's a bunch of hogwash, can't you just say it once and be done with it?
Anyways.... it should have it's own forum... You can get some sticky FAQS on each aiming method and other informational posts and then lock the thread down so the naysayers can't invade it.
You can let people argue about it all they want.. this is America, but you could have the Stickies there, as to help the people that would like to try different methods or would like more info on it, without sifting thru the war zone.
I think it would thin out the Main forum a bit. We don't really need CTE threads started EVERY DAY, do we? It's not enough for people to argue in one thread... People feel the need to start their own thread, for whatever reason, to state their opinion. It's not enough their opinion is stated in 48 other threads.... You know, in case someone missed it
I say create another forum for all Aiming Methods.
This particular topic seems to bring with it, a lot of debate.
These debates turn into the opponents and proponents of it, fighting with each other EVERY TIME.
The ones that believe in it, tout it to everyone, the people that don't believe in it, badmouth it to everyone.
Still another group, are the ones that are looking for knowledge, but have to sift thru hundreds of people arguing back and forth about it.
You will also notice the same people jump into every thread that is started on it, and proceed to inform everyone about how they feel about it ALL OVER AGAIN! If you believe in it and it's helped your game, can't you just say it in one thread? If you think it's a bunch of hogwash, can't you just say it once and be done with it?
Anyways.... it should have it's own forum... You can get some sticky FAQS on each aiming method and other informational posts and then lock the thread down so the naysayers can't invade it.
You can let people argue about it all they want.. this is America, but you could have the Stickies there, as to help the people that would like to try different methods or would like more info on it, without sifting thru the war zone.
I think it would thin out the Main forum a bit. We don't really need CTE threads started EVERY DAY, do we? It's not enough for people to argue in one thread... People feel the need to start their own thread, for whatever reason, to state their opinion. It's not enough their opinion is stated in 48 other threads.... You know, in case someone missed it
If the people who havn't tried it wouldn't have such strong oppinions against it there would be no arguements. Live and let live. PRO-ONE FOREVER!!!
Wouldn't you like to see all the info for aiming theory in one convenient spot?
It already is.
I don't think it has as much to do with people who are for or against it. I think it's more about people who simply aren't interested in it, and are just sick of seeing a half dozen new threads started every week about the exact same thing.
I'm not for or against it. I'm truly indifferent. But to be honest, it gets old seeing it flood the main forum day in and day out, when it could all be together in one spot. Technically, yes, it is all together in one spot right now, but it's also getting lost among all the other posts in the Main Forum. An aiming sub-forum would serve, to allow those interested in it, as a one stop shop for all their questions and thoughts about it. No more fishing through pages, no more using the horrendous search function.
Even better, create stickied, open (ongoing) polls for each aiming system.
To be answered by those who have actually tried the aiming system in question. Therefore based on experience, not merely opinion/bias/hearsay.
"Did using aiming system X lead to a (tangible/noticeable/significant etc.) improvement in your game/ability to make balls"
YES or NO.
Then: "Based on its price, do you consider aiming system X a good investment/value for money"?
YES or NO.
Then consumers could make their own decisions based on the reporting.
Of course, people will still abuse it, but they only get one "spite vote" per poll per AZB account, so the figures will probably still end up being broadly representative after a time.
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Its not our fault.it floods the main forum occasionly. Some are started by non users but they are certainly more exciting than "Did you lie about your apa rating".
So what if I lied about my apa rating and want to tell the whole world in a thread or two?
Don't pick on me....
That wasn't my thread, but nevertheless, that statement is debatable. I would read the aiming threads, but I am usually too busy watching the National Paint Drying Championships instead. Also, the Regional Grass Growing Semifinals was being broadcast on the radio, right after the Round Robin Sock Folding Competition.
Yeah, that is how exciting I find aiming threads. :boring2:
Nevertheless you're particpating. When are the grass growing finals.
Some folks have a natural gift for being able to get multiple points across with a minimum of words -- "concise" by definition. I'm certainly not one of those. Nice post, 9BallMarksman -- good job!
Aiming system threads wouldn't be so bad, if they weren't like mushrooms after a morning rain -- Pop-pop-poppity-pop-poppity-pop! Every day. And the same stuff. Answered the same way. By the same people. And filled with sales pitches galore with unearthly claims. Although some may want the aiming system subforum as sort of a sand wedge to whack the mushrooms off his/her lawn with, I personally think that a subforum is just a win-win for both sides. The central knowledge base consolidation is HUGE! What a huge win! You go to one area, and you are immediately immersed in all things aiming-system-related. I know if *I* were in the market for aiming system information, if there were a subforum for that, oh my gosh -- nirvana! And Searches within that subforum would be lickety-split and *on topic* (meaning, you don't get a bunch of crap you have to wade through to find what you're looking for). AZB's superb categorization is why I chose to be here, and not, say, Jimbo's Army or some other pool site.
Unfortunately, some of the anti-subforum devotees have the following in mind:
A. They *want* all the content to be uncategorized, precisely for the purpose of someone "tripping across" the aiming system information. (And that has been openly stated here.) I can understand the exuberance after learning something that has improved one's game and wanting to spread the news, help others, etc. but this idea -- keeping everything uncategorized precisely for the purpose of "snagging" an unsuspecting new user, even though most don't care to see it -- borders on the tactics of Canter and Siegel. Not nearly that malicious, of course, but the idea at the core, at the root, is still the same.
B. The sales pitches. Let's look at an "Exhibit 'A'" to illustrate. As a recent post says, "If the people who havn't [sic] tried it..." Really? How do you know someone hasn't tried it? Because "it's *sooo* guaranteed to work" and if you're not already a booster, by gosh that automatically means you've never tried it? Then signs-off the post with the sales-ey "PRO-ONE FOREVER!!!"? Not everyone is wired the same, and everyone is different -- what works for some, is not guaranteed to work for others. At the moment, I don't want coconut cookies. That could change later, of course, but for right now, I don't want them. "But how do you know you don't want coconut cookies? You haven't tried em!" Jeez Christmas!
C. They think creating a subforum for aiming systems is a court-sanctioned sentence. It's not. In fact, it creates a haven where the information posted (and most of it is EXCELLENT) is not lost under the avalanche of new threads everyday in the Main forum. One-stop shopping for everything aiming-system related. Like I said, if I were in the market for aiming system information, I'd LOVE to see a subforum for it -- I just click on it, attach my dinner bib, and have a FEAST on the smorgasbord of info there.
Just some things to think about, from a variety of angles,
-Sean
But I don't participate in the aiming threads. I'm too busy, glued to the TV watching the National Cow Milking Quarter Finals.
Sean, you've got a way of saying things that just plain makes sense to me. Nice work on your end as well. I completely agree with the block of your quote I bolded below ...