Sighting (not aiming) thread

[TxSkin]

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

- Sight 90/half, pivot to center

for extreme back-cut, sight 90/reverse90, pivot to center.

Not trying to push the system, just letting you know how to "sight" these, per the thread.

Lose that cue pivot technique... nobody in the universe does that

Another method - which I use - is simply to stand behind the ob in a line to the pocket, see where the ob must be hit to sink it, keep the eyes on that spot until I get back behind the cb, remember it, and shoot at it. It works great for me!, not just on back cuts but any cut shot. It even can be used with the appropriate modifications to find the spot on the ob that will send it to hit the right spot on the cushion for banks, too.


TxSkin, SPFRP (Simple Pool For Real People)

 

[woody_968]

Another method - which I use - is simply to stand behind the ob in a line to the pocket, see where the ob must be hit to sink it, keep the eyes on that spot until I get back behind the cb, remember it, and shoot at it. It works great for me!, not just on back cuts but any cut shot. It even can be used with the appropriate modifications to find the spot on the ob that will send it to hit the right spot on the cushion for banks, too.


TxSkin, SPFRP (Simple Pool For Real People)

Better be careful, if your post wasn't dripping with sarcasm someone may have thought you were actually contributing to the thread

What works for some, doesn't work for others. The shooting routine that seems simple to you may be hard for someone else. Even when it does work for some they continue to learn to see if another process may be better. And a few that like to teach enjoy learning different ways to explain the same process, as not everyone learns by hearing the same message.

One thing I have noticed is that some people are so afraid to admit there may be something they didn't know they are unwilling to learn anything new. And as a rule, when people stop trying to learn they tend to level off or even see a decline in their ability.

 

[pocketspeed]

I'm taking the cue ball to lab.

do yourself a favor and take 'em all with you

brian

 

[dgem]

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

- Sight 90/half, pivot to center

for extreme back-cut, sight 90/reverse90, pivot to center.

Not trying to push the system, just letting you know how to "sight" these, per the thread.

Lose that cue pivot technique... nobody in the universe does that

we almost got the same technique, I just pivot from right to left now for most shots.

 

[TxSkin]

Better be careful, if your post wasn't dripping with sarcasm someone may have thought you were actually contributing to the thread

What works for some, doesn't work for others. The shooting routine that seems simple to you may be hard for someone else. Even when it does work for some they continue to learn to see if another process may be better. And a few that like to teach enjoy learning different ways to explain the same process, as not everyone learns by hearing the same message.

One thing I have noticed is that some people are so afraid to admit there may be something they didn't know they are unwilling to learn anything new. And as a rule, when people stop trying to learn they tend to level off or even see a decline in their ability.

What sarcasm?

I made an honest contribution according to my view of pool, which is that it is basically very simple but hard to do. What I explained consisted of several very simple steps that anybody can do and results in pocketing the ball on a hard cut shot.

Also, I have stated elsewhere that if it works for you, it works. No explanation is necessary. But if you claim it will work for everybody, then a whole lot of explaining is needed. See?

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=1958313&postcount=191

I do not think that pool has to be complicated so much that surveyor's equipment has to be brought to the pool hall - as some of the stuff posted in aiming and sighting threads would require - in order to play the game very well.

I do not mind if someone disagrees with my position. Unlike some others, I do not get hyper defensive about it. That is because a) I know that pool is not a science and can never be and b) I have no dog in the hunt for votaries.

TxSkin

 

[woody_968]

What sarcasm?

Maybe I misread the texture of your post :wink:

I agree that some of the talk in the aiming threads can get too technical, well, a lot of it does. And it has been a while since anything really knew has come out.

But threads like this one and Gene's (even though some don't like his advertising) have brought up some things that I do not remember reading before. Its ALMOST got me wishing for winter so I could start playing again LOL.

 

[dr_dave]

Thanks for the advice. I think I would rather just practice several hundred back-cuts until I can start "seeing" them better.

I don't like using the cue to aim (because it looks a little "minor league") but it does work.

Catch you later,
Dave

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

- Sight 90/half, pivot to center

for extreme back-cut, sight 90/reverse90, pivot to center.

Not trying to push the system, just letting you know how to "sight" these, per the thread.

Lose that cue pivot technique... nobody in the universe does that

 

[woody_968]

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

To keep with the theme of the thread, and since you stated your eyes are never over the center of the cueball. Would your vision center be to the inside or the outside of the angle on this shot? :grin:

I wont ask about the 90, as I know nothing about that method :frown:

 

[woody_968]

I don't like using the cue to aim (because it looks a little "minor league") but it does work.

That surprises me a little Dave, I figured you would be the type that didnt care how something looked if it put the ball in the hole. And Im not saying thats a bad type.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

To keep with the theme of the thread, and since you stated your eyes are never over the center of the cueball. Would your vision center be to the inside or the outside of the angle on this shot? :grin:

I wont ask about the 90, as I know nothing about that method :frown:

Vision center is to the inside of the angle.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Dr Dave:
I also have trouble with back cuts. My visual perception and intuition is sometimes so bad on these, I even resort to the stick-pivot method at times

[snip Spidey's advice to sacrifice chickens]

Dr Dave:
Thanks for the advice. I think I would rather just practice several hundred back-cuts until I can start "seeing" them better.

Good to see your examination of pool religions hasn't made you irrational yet. (But The Force is strong, so keep your shields up.)

I might get thrown out of church for this, but here's some more rationality about back cuts:

When we shoot back cuts we're looking away from some important visual cues, namely the pocket and the rails that point to it. We learned to use these cues to help us see the OB-to-pocket line and find the contact point/cut angle without all the walking around (the usual reason for innovation). But we learned them subliminally, so we don't notice that we're using them and don't know what's wrong when they're gone.

Once we do know what's wrong, the simple solution is obvious: revert to walking around and sighting the OB-to-pocket line as we did before learning to use the visual cues (or resort to the stick-pivot method or any other "mechanical" method to get a fix on the contact point/cut angle).

Alternatively, there are several evangelical aiming religions that are always recruiting. To get in you have to go to the mountain and see the Head Hermit (don't forget a gift!), which is an expense, but you also get the added advantage of a built-in support society.

pj
chgo

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Good to see your examination of pool religions hasn't made you irrational yet. (But The Force is strong, so keep your shields up.)

I might get thrown out of church for this, but here's some more rationality about back cuts:

When we shoot back cuts we're looking away from some important visual cues, namely the pocket and the rails that point to it. We learned to use these cues to help us see the OB-to-pocket line and find the contact point/cut angle without all the walking around (the usual reason for innovation). But we learned them subliminally, so we don't notice that we're using them and don't know what's wrong when they're gone.

Once we do know what's wrong, the simple solution is obvious: revert to walking around and sighting the OB-to-pocket line as we did before learning to use the visual cues (or resort to the stick-pivot method or any other "mechanical" method to get a fix on the contact point/cut angle).

Alternatively, there are several evangelical aiming religions that are always recruiting. To get in you have to go to the mountain and see the Head Hermit (don't forget a gift!), which is an expense, but you also get the added advantage of a built-in support society.

pj
chgo

I'm a little confused about what you mean. It'd be great if you posted a video of you shooting about 20 back cuts in a row. That way, I can see what you're referring to.

Thanks,
SpiderHermit

 

[cookie man]

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

- Sight 90/half, pivot to center

for extreme back-cut, sight 90/reverse90, pivot to center.

Not trying to push the system, just letting you know how to "sight" these, per the thread.

Lose that cue pivot technique... nobody in the universe does that

I need a video and diagrams, my sons sixth grade geometry teacher says this is not possible.

 

[AZE]

I don't really have anything to contribute to this thread I just wanted to let it be known that after reading this thread I'm positive I'm the stupidest (most stupid??? ) person on AZB.

 

[Dead Crab]

***************************
I don't like using the cue to aim (because it looks a little "minor league") but it does work.

Catch you later,
Dave
******************************
Perhaps you should call Tiger Woods and tell him that all that putter sighting he does is "minor league".

 

[Patrick Johnson]

It'd be great if you posted a video of you shooting about 20 back cuts in a row.

You must be able to find something more entertaining than that, even in York. Don't you have a neighbor with cable?

pj
chgo

 

[Patrick Johnson]

I need a video and diagrams, my sons sixth grade geometry teacher says this is not possible.

You're going to have to repeat your son's sixth grade.

pj
chgo

 

[dr_dave]

That surprises me a little Dave, I figured you would be the type that didnt care how something looked if it put the ball in the hole. And Im not saying thats a bad type.

Good point. I should not be shy about using the cue. I certainly pull out my trusty 30-degree peace sign every chance I get ... and display it with pride!

Regards,
Dave

 

[dr_dave]

Good to see your examination of pool religions hasn't made you irrational yet. (But The Force is strong, so keep your shields up.)

It is sometimes difficult to resist the allure of all of the fancy words and phrases (e.g., "Crash the Vertical Planes!"); but when I get weak, I just pull out my trusty tin-foil cap, and the evangelical forces are easily deflected. :grin-square:

Sorry Spidey, I couldn't resist. I'll let you take another shot at me now (without reply). :sorry:

I might get thrown out of church for this, but here's some more rationality about back cuts:

When we shoot back cuts we're looking away from some important visual cues, namely the pocket and the rails that point to it. We learned to use these cues to help us see the OB-to-pocket line and find the contact point/cut angle without all the walking around (the usual reason for innovation). But we learned them subliminally, so we don't notice that we're using them and don't know what's wrong when they're gone.

Once we do know what's wrong, the simple solution is obvious: revert to walking around and sighting the OB-to-pocket line as we did before learning to use the visual cues (or resort to the stick-pivot method or any other "mechanical" method to get a fix on the contact point/cut angle).

Blasphemy!!! How dare you try to pollute this sacred thread with useful information and insight? You should be ashamed!

Alternatively, there are several evangelical aiming religions that are always recruiting. To get in you have to go to the mountain and see the Head Hermit (don't forget a gift!), which is an expense, but you also get the added advantage of a built-in support society.

Maybe I should try to market my tin cap - along with some kind of ghost-ball training gizmo - to the "pool atheists" out there. What do you think?

Regards,
Dave

 

[dr_dave]

Depending on how steep, you can either:

- Sight CTE, offset a 1/2 ball (on the inside of the CTEL) and then pivot beyond center to impart outside english

- Sight 90/half, pivot to center

for extreme back-cut, sight 90/reverse90, pivot to center.

Not trying to push the system, just letting you know how to "sight" these, per the thread.

Lose that cue pivot technique... nobody in the universe does that

I need a video and diagrams, my sons sixth grade geometry teacher says this is not possible.

You are wrong! All of these methods work perfectly for shots at every distance, every angle, and every bridge length, provided you adjust your effective pivot point just right (with body and/or bridge shift) and/or you change your sighting just the right amount during the pivot. Your son's geometry teacher apparently doesn't understand how the systems work!

Regards,
Dave