Strange to me that no one has mentioned Predator Arcadia Reserve pool cloth in this thread?
Simonis 860HR Shortage?
- Thread starter perdigao
- Start date
Hi Chris,
I think I mentioned it in my initial post. But since no one even considers it, I am leaning towards the Championship 30/30.
Nyquil
Well-known member
I have Simonis 860HR on my table and it's ok cloth. It's super thick so it should last a really long time. With that said a friend of mine has Andy's 988 and it plays a bit faster which I prefer. Next time I recloth I will either do Andy's or try out Gorina. I think the 860 HR is a bit overrated imho.
JoeEdmisten
New member
I've heard great things about the Predator Arcadia cloth. But in an effort to be more competitive in your weekly tournament, I went with the same cloth you have on your tables. If you switch to Predator, I switch to Predator...simple as that
This has been an issue for at least a year. Where have you been? Lol!
GentlemanJames
Well-known member
It was my pleasure, Brother PERDIGAO; as I wrote, I learned A LOT from doing the research; but, I only became interested in doing the research because your dilemma in trying to identify what your preferred alternative cloth might be, as this will eventually become everyone's dilemma - at least until Simonis get's their production back up to full stream again.
So we - being long-time Simonis Cult Members, like myself - are either going to be forced to embrace an alternative cloth; or, as we become exposed to acceptable alternative cloths from various cloth suppliers as we play on other people's tables, who have already answered that question for themselves (Such as it was with me being exposed to Andy Cloth, which I never would have been, had I not gone into that pool hall which had to answer the Simonis-shortage question for their tables.)
Before you posted your problem to solve, and for many decades before that, I only knew how to religiously chant: "Simonis... Simonis... Simonis..." while bowing from the ankles; and yet, because of their flood (a real shame) and being inspired by your post, my eyes have been opened, my view widened, and, although I am not in need of a recover at this time (I'm a Simonis 760 man, myself), I will eventually know the alternative cloth I will be going to, IF I need to; as an alternative to that weight, blend, and weave pattern specs (once I can add the weave information the cloth profile).
Remember, that weave pattern is absolutely critical to the feel, durability, and performance of a cloth - and yet, it is the hardest information to learn. Why these billiard cloth manufacturers don't automatically include the weave pattern spec in their sales specifications - it's no secret, and any other textile description includes it's weave pattern along with it's name, weight blend, etc. - escapes me completely.
Here's two other thing your post helped me become aware of with the research:
1. There are companies out there who offer an 90% Wool, 10% Nylon, 23oz (Simonis 860 profile) cloth, BUT, if you investigate further, you discover it is NOT Worsted (long staple) but rather, Woolen (short staple), and therefore, while sharing the basic blend and weight profile of Simonis 860, this 'non-worsted' wool, is going to be 'nappy' and play heavier and slower - think typical coin-op bar box in an arcade - and hence, the lower price.
and,
2. There are companies like Champion, and, Andy who offer perfectly acceptable alternatives to Simonis - something I never would have even allowed in my mind, before reading your post and doing the research.
When I eventually end-up in need of recover, will I stick with Simonis 760?
Maybe; however, I now know how to select a truly accurate alternate cloth based on more than just Wool/Nylon blend ratio, weight, and the personal preference of friends (which I may or may not share in); and, avoid buying an unworkable choice which simply shares the same numbers.
So, again, thanks to you, I learned a lot because of your post. - GJ
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I am a retailer and have no preferences but I have been able to get some of the Simonis product from Nick Varner
GentlemanJames
Well-known member
CHRISinNC - See edit/updated specs to post #16. I looked-up and threw in the specs for both Predator Arcadia Reserve and Predator Arcadia Select for you. - GJ
As a general statement, the higher the nylon content, the more intense burn marks show up. Has this been the the case for the Arcadia cloth with 35%nylon?
The new Champ 30/30 cloth on my table is 30% nylon and so far shows no marks at all. The 860 showed all kinds of wear by the rack after a few weeks, but YMMV-
-dj
Nyquil
Well-known member
The 860 HR is supposed to be more burn-resistant. I have found this not to be the case even with duramith ball sets. It's very consistent playing cloth, but when I change it out I will looking for something more burn resistant.
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
I like my Gorina tournament cloth, but it has a ton of marks after 6 weeks.
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My son and I got new cloth put on at the same tome not quite a year ago. I went with Andy 988 and he with Simonis 860 HR.
The 860 is covered with burn marks, while the Andy still looks very good. There are burn marks on my table but few and they don't show as strong.
The 860 is covered with burn marks, while the Andy still looks very good. There are burn marks on my table but few and they don't show as strong.
GentlemanJames
Well-known member
Do you know which version of Gornia's GT-2000 cloth you purchased?
One is the GT-2000 (3100 Series) with 80/20 at 16.5oz,
And,
GT-2000 (9400 Series) with 80/20 at 23.5oz
There would be a big difference in how theses two "GT-2000" cloths wear and their cost.
Difficulty with comparing Gorina cloth on an 'Apples to Apples' basis to that of other cloths, is that Gorina offers so many different weight/price cloths in just their 'Pool' line alone - versus their Snooker and their Carom cloth lines - but, only use 4 tier/line names: Granito Tournament, Basalt, Billar Tour, and, Wentworth Fast PBA; and, in additional to the two standard versions of GT-2000 (16.5oz and 23.5oz), there are two optional weight/price points available for the GT-2000 tier - bringing the total to 4 weight/cost versions of GT-2000 - and the Basalt tier offers 2 standard weights, plus, one optional weight - bringing the total to 3 weight/cost versions of Basalt.
With so many versions of Gornia cloth offered to Pool players - 9 total "pool" cloths in all with the standard and special order weights Gorina has available - my brain felt like it was going to explode, so I just left Gorina off the data list on post #16. - GJ
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
It's 80/20 at 21oz.
GentlemanJames
Well-known member
21oz. ?!
According to the Gorina website spec-sheets, their GT-2000 line of pool cloth is available in 16.5oz (3100 sereis), 23.5oz (9400 series), and can be special ordered in two different weights over 28oz.
Perhaps Gorina needs to update their website and product spec-sheets.
Glad I chose to leave Gorina off the comparison data list on post #`16 - too many 'Gorina' cloths for my brain to sort out. - GJ
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
I think there is a bit of confusion. The Granito site lists it as 670g per running meter. Convert that, it is 23.6oz per meter, so 21oz per yard.
I basically picked what they recommend for nine ball.
GentlemanJames
Well-known member
I think you are correct, nice job is clearing up that anomaly, DeeDee.
So if the GT-2000 (9400-Series) cloth is properly converting to 21oz per yard; then, what is the accurate ounce per yard weight for the GT-2000 (3100-Series) at 470 gr/m ?
That would be good to correct. - GJ
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
About 15oz, by my calculation.