SJM at the 2023 Derby City Catastrophe

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
Would it break anyone's heart if they did away with the Big Foot?

My recollction is that Greg started it to popularize 10' tables. I don't think that went too well.

Lou Figueroa
My sense of things is that they view the Bigfoot as being a core event with a small field. It's the only event with an announcer on the mike for the length of every match. It has something I've never heard before in my many years around the game, and that's sponsorship announcements on the mike mid-match. Between racks is a most unusual time for sponsorship announcements.
 

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
Hard to blame the Derby for Filler and Alex drawing each other. SVB and Shaw both lost on the hill.

I am not saying the Derby hangover was not relevant to their play I just wouldn't blame their complete performance on it.

Cheers,
Disagree. SVB lost to a player whose Fargo was 50 points lower and Shaw lost to a player whose Fargo was 35 points lower. Double hill or not, these are very big upsets.

Yes, Filler drawing Pagulayan over and over was unusual.
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not 14.1 unless it's on a Chinese table. Full rack rotation on the 10 footer. No dumb points, last ball on the table is the only object per rack. Real pool, evolving strategy, shorten the sets.
i'd rather have a root-canal with a butter knife than watch that shit.
 

decent dennis

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I feel that the logical postscript to these incidents is to consider how those who pulled the all nighter on the Derby’s final day fared at the World Championships.

Four of the Fargo Top 20 pulled the Derby City all-nighter and they all had a disappointing result.

SVB , defending World Champion, bowed out in the round of 16.

Josf Filler, former Worl Champion, was eliminated in the Round of 64.

Jayson Shaw, defending International Open Champion, lost in the Round of 32.

Alex Pagulayan, former World Champion, bowed out in the Round of 32.

None of this is surprising, given the abuse the suffered at the Derby.
Abuse? That’s rich
 

fishless

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Disagree. SVB lost to a player whose Fargo was 50 points lower and Shaw lost to a player whose Fargo was 35 points lower. Double hill or not, these are very big upsets.

Yes, Filler drawing Pagulayan over and over was unusual.
I agree both upsets based on Fargo for sure. I just give more credit to the 2 players playing very well and above their current Fargo which I believed happened here. I didn't see the SVB match but read all the praise after the match and it wasn't for SVB, so I could be off, way off actually.

Cheers,
 

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
Staff member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Disagree. SVB lost to a player whose Fargo was 50 points lower and Shaw lost to a player whose Fargo was 35 points lower. Double hill or not, these are very big upsets. ...
At 50 apart the weaker player has only a 20% chance to win in a race to 11. Not hopeless, but a huge underdog.

Duong has moved up to an FR of 805.
 

skogstokig

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I agree both upsets based on Fargo for sure. I just give more credit to the 2 players playing very well and above their current Fargo which I believed happened here. I didn't see the SVB match but read all the praise after the match and it wasn't for SVB, so I could be off, way off actually.

Cheers,

sometimes changes to a player's life, approach or training regimen can make them play better than their fargo. regarding duong, i'm certain his match against shane was no one-off. the match before he beat the world 10-ball champion wojciech szewczyk 11-1. that was the best performance of the tournament. he performed like a 820 fargo player, almost complete in all aspects.
 

1pocket

Steve Booth
Gold Member
Silver Member
In New Albany 13 minutes/9 miles from the Horseshoe by the entrance to the bridge to Louisville. That's the bridge approach in the background.

View attachment 686305

But that's going to be more or less an hour wasted if you go there for a meal as opposed to "dining" in the Casino. 13 minutes assumes you don't run into a coal train.
There is a back way around the train crossing!
 

1pocket

Steve Booth
Gold Member
Silver Member
In what other sport do they change the specs like that?

Smaller holes for the final round of golf? Smaller hoops, nets, goal posts? Maybe change the lines for center court at Wimbledon?

Lou Figueroa
It's the Derby -- smaller pockets on all tables obviously was a problem. Smaller pockets on the TV table was NOT a problem, and probably made those featured matches more interesting -- and more salable for Pat. I would to guess without asking them, that both Greg Sullivan and Pat Fleming, as well as the majority of Accustats subscribers, and spectators there, liked it that way. Now, did they like that matches went deep into the night/next morning? Not so much. But everyone that matters seems to agree that the smaller pockets throughout the tournament floor, was indeed a problem (along with other issues such as efficiency of table scheduling). I'm not hearing anyone say that the TV table was too tight -- except maybe you indirectly.
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yeah if you got insomnia. No one would sit and watch rotation much less 'til the last ball' version. Think we can file this in the 'ain't happening,ever' folder. ;)
Too bad. It's a good game and besides 9 and 10 ball usually go to the last ball.
But here's the context:
10 footer has too much area for 10 ball. 15 balls would help fill that.
No points and last ball make it an easy to spectate shooting/strategy game.

I don't think last ball has to be any duller than pool schemes currently in play. And it leaves in all the pool.
 

penguin

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Agreed, perhaps an overstatement, but I've never been asked to work a 25 hour day in my life like Shane, who played pool at the Derby from 9:00 AM to 10:00 AM. It seems like abuse.
If he felt it wasn't worth it, Shane could have forfeited out of the tournament like he did at Turning Stone.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's the Derby -- smaller pockets on all tables obviously was a problem. Smaller pockets on the TV table was NOT a problem, and probably made those featured matches more interesting -- and more salable for Pat. I would to guess without asking them, that both Greg Sullivan and Pat Fleming, as well as the majority of Accustats subscribers, and spectators there, liked it that way. Now, did they like that matches went deep into the night/next morning? Not so much. But everyone that matters seems to agree that the smaller pockets throughout the tournament floor, was indeed a problem (along with other issues such as efficiency of table scheduling). I'm not hearing anyone say that the TV table was too tight -- except maybe you indirectly.

You didn’t answer my question:

lfigueroa said:
In what other sport do they change the specs like that?

Smaller holes for the final round of golf? Smaller hoops, nets, goal posts? Maybe change the lines for center court at Wimbledon?

Lou Figueroa
 
Last edited:

FunChamp

Well-known member
You didn’t answer my question:

lfigueroa said:
In what other sport do they change the specs like that?

Smaller holes for the final round of golf? Smaller hoops, nets, goal posts? Maybe change the lines for center court at Wimbledon?

Lou Figueroa
in golf they change the types of grass, the length and width of fairways, greens speed, pin locations. they are always adjusting the speed of the greens by grass length, through watering or mowing
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
in golf they change the types of grass, the length and width of fairways, greens speed, pin locations. they are always adjusting the speed of the greens by grass length, through watering or mowing

We’ll, ya, sure — I think they just made a lot of mods at Augusta.

But do they make the hole smaller the last round of the Masters?

Lou Figueroa
 

jalapus logan

be all. and supports it to
Silver Member
Would it break anyone's heart if they did away with the Big Foot?

My recollction is that Greg started it to popularize 10' tables. I don't think that went too well.

Lou Figueroa
I can only speak for this pool fan, but I am not particularly interested in 10 foot tables one way or another. There are none that I know of within 100 miles of me or anyone I know, so I really could care less. No pool room is gonna devote space to larger tables either...total non starter. Less tables per square foot, no way that sounds profitable. In the end, I'm only interested in a similar playing surface to what is commonly available to 99.9% of people who play pool. I bet I'm not alone in that sentiment.
 

1pocket

Steve Booth
Gold Member
Silver Member
You didn’t answer my question:

lfigueroa said:
In what other sport do they change the specs like that?

Smaller holes for the final round of golf? Smaller hoops, nets, goal posts? Maybe change the lines for center court at Wimbledon?

Lou Figueroa
Most sports have clearly defined specs -- pool not so much. I just looked at WPA and it says 4-1/2" to 4-5/8" corner pockets under their :

"Recommended Equipment Specifications"

I added the quotation marks -- but the word "recommended" is right there in the heading.

It also says, "At its sole discretion, the World Pool-Billiard Association can sanction tournaments on tables not in compliance with these specifications."

 
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