Bill...Yeah, but it doesn't look ANYTHING like I did almost 35 yrs ago! Like a lot of poolplayers, I was skinny then! LOL
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Island Drive said:
Skill Level of BCA instructors.
- Thread starter JMS
- Start date
Scott Lee said:
I'm sure the same is true on this end. Was in Ann Arbor MI this last Sunday, watched my nephew Trent #1 Meacham UI play and lose to MI, but still had fun, we beat the other MI team the prior week at Champaign.
So where is your pic?
Mine can be found in the confines of some of Bill Porters Houston Reds pics.
I also feel like you should really be able to play with relatively 'good results' if you want to represent the 'standard' ability in pool. The PGA of America dictates that in order to become a member you must first pass your PAT test which means you must first shoot a 154 or better or 36 holes playing from the post in the same day under USGA guidelines. This is a test that must be passed before even starting 3 levels of training to become a member or club pro.
Pardon me if this was touched on an earlier post, but if I wanted to become a BCA Instructor, how would I do that? Is there training available in my area? I have been playing for 20+ years and can play at a level of an 8.
Pardon me if this was touched on an earlier post, but if I wanted to become a BCA Instructor, how would I do that? Is there training available in my area? I have been playing for 20+ years and can play at a level of an 8.
deadgearplyr said:
The top rated school in the Country is in Dallas, Tx.
goettlicher@verizon.net
1 800 707-0158
Thanks
randyg
Ahhhh...Ida Mae. The lady being referenced in the OP is a very special type of person. She has a passion for the game that very few of us will ever understand. The amazing thing was she also understood what she didn't understand so we were all trying to come up with new ways to impart the information to her...that's what instructors do...they work with you to understand what frame of reference they can use to impart and help you understand and assimilate information. Ida Mae has an energy and drive that is rare and her web-site is nothing but blunt and correct on her skills.
Now...as far as the BCA Instructor Program...that's a different question. You can become a Recognized Instructor with a sign-off and a check from an appropriately accredited program. It's in the best interests of those programs to insure the knowledge is transferred and can be effectively regurgitated, so most require some sort of test. And as long as you keep your dues paid to the BCA (VERY, VERY IMPORTANT) and submit the prescribed number of Student Evaluation Forms per year (we're talking like 12), you keep your status. There is no "qualification" for the type and duration of students...heck, there's not even a requirement the students pay...therefore some Recognized Instructors may start out at youth clubs or retirement homes to help them learn how to teach. And, BCA doesn't check up on them, so yeah, being a Recognized is pretty easy if you're willing to go through the program at the academy of your choosing.
Beyond that, it does get a bit fussier, but not much. The BCA does not have standardized tests...basically, approval from accredited school(s), specific number of feedback forms, time at a specific level (2 years of being Certified before being eligible to be an Advanced, for example), and you get to pay higher membership dues.
The down side is the BCA web-site does nothing to rank or identify the merits of the various instructors or programs...so when a student is looking at the BCA web-site, they can't tell the difference in potential instruction between RandyG and Ida Mae.
..j!dub
Now...as far as the BCA Instructor Program...that's a different question. You can become a Recognized Instructor with a sign-off and a check from an appropriately accredited program. It's in the best interests of those programs to insure the knowledge is transferred and can be effectively regurgitated, so most require some sort of test. And as long as you keep your dues paid to the BCA (VERY, VERY IMPORTANT) and submit the prescribed number of Student Evaluation Forms per year (we're talking like 12), you keep your status. There is no "qualification" for the type and duration of students...heck, there's not even a requirement the students pay...therefore some Recognized Instructors may start out at youth clubs or retirement homes to help them learn how to teach. And, BCA doesn't check up on them, so yeah, being a Recognized is pretty easy if you're willing to go through the program at the academy of your choosing.
Beyond that, it does get a bit fussier, but not much. The BCA does not have standardized tests...basically, approval from accredited school(s), specific number of feedback forms, time at a specific level (2 years of being Certified before being eligible to be an Advanced, for example), and you get to pay higher membership dues.
The down side is the BCA web-site does nothing to rank or identify the merits of the various instructors or programs...so when a student is looking at the BCA web-site, they can't tell the difference in potential instruction between RandyG and Ida Mae.
..j!dub
most bca pool instructors cant draw the ball.deadgearplyr said:
i mean they cant play.
My Two Cents
I've followed this whole thread (Gee, I wish had more to do at work)
I think that a person should be able to demonstrate with some degree of regularity a technique or skill they are trying to demonstrate.
Having said that, I have attended one of Randyg's schools and I don't think he took a shot the whole 3 days I was there. He didn't need to.
As a master BCA instructor, I already knew he had the ability to teach the knowledge required to get better. Using what he taught me....did I get better? Absolutely
I've seen him play for years, and although he no longer has the playing abilities he had 15-20 years ago...what he does have is an ability to impart the knowledge needed to attain higher skill levels.
There are world class players that loads of people would love to have lessons from, does that mean they can teach? There are lots of world class players that have some really bad habits. In most cases I would say they were able to be great in spite of a bad habit. Does that mean I want to take a lesson from them and learn a bad habit....no.
I've followed this whole thread (Gee, I wish had more to do at work)
I think that a person should be able to demonstrate with some degree of regularity a technique or skill they are trying to demonstrate.
Having said that, I have attended one of Randyg's schools and I don't think he took a shot the whole 3 days I was there. He didn't need to.
As a master BCA instructor, I already knew he had the ability to teach the knowledge required to get better. Using what he taught me....did I get better? Absolutely
I've seen him play for years, and although he no longer has the playing abilities he had 15-20 years ago...what he does have is an ability to impart the knowledge needed to attain higher skill levels.
There are world class players that loads of people would love to have lessons from, does that mean they can teach? There are lots of world class players that have some really bad habits. In most cases I would say they were able to be great in spite of a bad habit. Does that mean I want to take a lesson from them and learn a bad habit....no.
That a beginner or a low level player can become recognized as an instructor is, IMHO, a flaw in the system. You need to know how to perform the activity you are attempting to teach. A guitar school would NEVER hire someone who can't smoothly transition between chords or play basic rythms and leads.
Of course theory and strategy do not need to come from someone who is an accomplished player, hence the gentlemen who taught Nick Varner. However when it comes to teaching beginners and developing players, you need to have the ability to demonstrate IMO. As I have mentioned before, people learn in different ways and a good teacher should be able to adapt.
Outside of demonstrative ability, a more accomplished player will have experience which can benefit the student. A beginner instructor is like the history teacher in High School who taught directly from the text book, because they were still learning the subject too. On the flip side there are the teachers that have studied history and can provide all sorts of anecdotes and useful information that compliment the text book.
If this person has a passion for the game, then I admire that. But I think that passion should turned to learning how to play, THEN to teaching. When I was a C player I thought I knew a lot about the game, as I had read quite a few books and knew all the basic information about the fundamentals. Years later I realize I was very wrong.
Of course theory and strategy do not need to come from someone who is an accomplished player, hence the gentlemen who taught Nick Varner. However when it comes to teaching beginners and developing players, you need to have the ability to demonstrate IMO. As I have mentioned before, people learn in different ways and a good teacher should be able to adapt.
Outside of demonstrative ability, a more accomplished player will have experience which can benefit the student. A beginner instructor is like the history teacher in High School who taught directly from the text book, because they were still learning the subject too. On the flip side there are the teachers that have studied history and can provide all sorts of anecdotes and useful information that compliment the text book.
If this person has a passion for the game, then I admire that. But I think that passion should turned to learning how to play, THEN to teaching. When I was a C player I thought I knew a lot about the game, as I had read quite a few books and knew all the basic information about the fundamentals. Years later I realize I was very wrong.
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Cameron Smith said:
Recognized is the entry level. What would you suggest happens?????? Maybe we can only take in great player as Instructors. In all unions you have to start some place.
Just because an Instructor is Recognize dosen't mean you have to take top scale lessons from them. I know a dozen Recognized Instructors who teach very well....SPF=randyg
randyg said:
If someone is recognized as a BCA instructor, they can advertise as such. This can be very misleading for someone who isn't involved in the pool community. I'm sure many do teach very well.
I didn't say anything about being top player, but I do believe you need to demonstrate some ability in the activity that you are teaching. As posted earlier you have pass a playing test to become PGA instructor (or whatever it's called). If you want to teach musical instrument most establishments require that you are up to a certain level of playing ability.
Yes you need to start somewhere, but there are better ways to do it.
http://www.pga.com/instruction/pgainstructor/
i was under the impression that as a recognized instructor you had to have a certain amount of sheets filled out by students that attended at least a 2 hr session from you. at least 12 a year. what could that lady possibly teach someone in 24 hours worth of time if she is a 3.
on another note. I was told that you had to take a class and then go through the instructor program OR train under a advanced or master instructor to become a recognzed instructor. If so what kind of training would need to be done under them. I am a fairly stong player and i think the class would be a waste of my and the instructors time. I wouldnt mind spending the dough if i could bypass that and actually learn something for the money i would be spending. i think it is along the lines of 400. then another 3 day couse that is 700.
Basically if you play well is there another way to become recognized? I have already taught some people and pointed out flaws in average players games. i just dont wanna spend a grand and a week shooting stop, follow, and draw shots. i did that on my carpet when i got my first walmart cue.
on another note. I was told that you had to take a class and then go through the instructor program OR train under a advanced or master instructor to become a recognzed instructor. If so what kind of training would need to be done under them. I am a fairly stong player and i think the class would be a waste of my and the instructors time. I wouldnt mind spending the dough if i could bypass that and actually learn something for the money i would be spending. i think it is along the lines of 400. then another 3 day couse that is 700.
Basically if you play well is there another way to become recognized? I have already taught some people and pointed out flaws in average players games. i just dont wanna spend a grand and a week shooting stop, follow, and draw shots. i did that on my carpet when i got my first walmart cue.
chazdillon said:
Yes, you have to take a specific three day teaching course, and pass, to become a Recognized BCA Instructor. The cost is around $1000. Those whom attend our Academy also have to pass some written material.
Our Academy has graduated a couple of hundred BCA Instructors of all playing skill levels, including a dozen of the top ranked pros. They never once mentioned that this was a waste of their time/money, on the contrary. There is no short cut to anyplace that's good.
I'm sure there are other Organizations out there that will "certify" you as an Instructor under your conditions, but not one of ours. It's a shame, we sit right in your own back yard!
Have a great day......SPF=randyg