Everyone breaking from the head spot is a simple solution and needs no other modifications. The breaker has a few shots he or she can select: soft, medium or hard break. Some sort of cut break could be developed where the player chooses to try and make a ball which is unlikely as someone said, or move the one ball and cb to opposite ends and not leave a shot.
Solution for racking issues!!!
- Thread starter Kid Dynomite
- Start date
The thing is though, Unknownpro is probably right... now that I think about it, I've never had any luck breaking from the head spot. So what will happen if we force pros to break from there? They aren't going to do what you're trying to force them to do, which is to hit the 1-ball square with all their might.
They will come up with some outside-the-box solution to improve their odds rather than just bust them open for their opponent every time. Then we're going to be back on here trying to figure out how to stop them from using the new weird break that they came up with for breaking from the spot. JMO.
They will come up with some outside-the-box solution to improve their odds rather than just bust them open for their opponent every time. Then we're going to be back on here trying to figure out how to stop them from using the new weird break that they came up with for breaking from the spot. JMO.
i also really don't get the fuss about the break...should the soft break be banned b/c a guy like corey is making the same ball consistently off the break? i don't think so, he put in the time to experiment w/ the break and find out what works, so he should be rewarded for it. I'd bet the majority of the people who complain about it are the ones who can't/don't make the 1 in the side or the wingball in the corner b/c they haven't put in the time to figure it out. The ones who do probably win, and nobody complains about winning...
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Kid Dynomite said:
Have you ever broke repeatedly from the head spot with an actual perfectly frozen rack where the nine ball never moves? I haven't tried it repeatedly but there are no dead balls. You might be suprised how few actually go in no matter how hard you hit it. I'd be interested to know the real percentages but it may be lower than you are thinking if you are hitting them hard and straight.
I agree that the racking issue has to be dealt with. IMO it has always been the worst part of pro tournaments. The time wasted for the spectators alone calls for some kind of perfect rack device, and maybe nuetral rackers. Players shouldn't have to worry about racking or the racks they get.
After I used a perfect rack for a while it was hard to go to a tournament and have to deal with bad racks. But if you make people break from a spot in 9 ball you will be encouraging them to shit rack themselves if it's rack your own because they'll make more balls that way, and then more 9s will go toward the pocket. Maybe loser racks would work better in that situation because the best way to stop the breaker is to give him a perfect rack.
Personally I don't believe 9-ball or 10-ball has a great future. Though I prefer 10 ball for racking reasons.
The main problem with both games is that for pros, 90% of the games are decided within the first 2 balls potted after the break. Would you watch football if you knew the result was a 90% certainty 5 minutes into each game?
So the finish of frames has little tension.
Not to mention that people want to see great players making great shots, but most shots in these games are comprised of relatively easy stun, dribble and roll through shots. Maybe once per frame we see a player play a relatively difficult and risky shot if we're lucky.
We need a game where players have to go for tougher shots and use more complex positional shots more often.
10-ball ring game provides a clue, but it is possible to create game formats for 1 on 1 where we really get to see what players are capable of more often.
Colin
The main problem with both games is that for pros, 90% of the games are decided within the first 2 balls potted after the break. Would you watch football if you knew the result was a 90% certainty 5 minutes into each game?
So the finish of frames has little tension.
Not to mention that people want to see great players making great shots, but most shots in these games are comprised of relatively easy stun, dribble and roll through shots. Maybe once per frame we see a player play a relatively difficult and risky shot if we're lucky.
We need a game where players have to go for tougher shots and use more complex positional shots more often.
10-ball ring game provides a clue, but it is possible to create game formats for 1 on 1 where we really get to see what players are capable of more often.
Colin
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The other problem is that not everyone can break solid from the dead center and thats not fairKid Dynomite said:
I would like to see
a tournament where they played Rotation, race to 3-5, and see how some of these pros would fare? It would be the most challenging, and would be as hard as 1 pocket to play well.
It would be like playing the 15 ball ghost, and most pros can only get to the 11 to 13 ball ghost.
a tournament where they played Rotation, race to 3-5, and see how some of these pros would fare? It would be the most challenging, and would be as hard as 1 pocket to play well.
It would be like playing the 15 ball ghost, and most pros can only get to the 11 to 13 ball ghost.
Colin Colenso said:
My Dear Colin,
We must be watching different Ten ball games. I keep seeing difficult run outs, amazing shots, and terrific safety play throughout the rack. Maybe I'm watching the wrong players. Where do you live? :wink:
Colin Colenso said:
uhhh....ok. what the hee haw are you talking about? do pro's not miss? every pro match i've seen, there have been at least one missed shot, whether it be easy or hard.
playing pool is about controlling the cue ball so that you dont have tough shots. if you want to see more tough shots, go watch a beginners tournament.
JamieMcWhorter
Banned
Why must we change all the rules to the games because some people have a weak break..Seems ridiculous..Corey Deuel was a genius and found out a way to hit the balls weaker than any human and beat the best breakers in the world then they changed the rules..Why do people complain about the break when they can do the same exact thing..its all a mystery to me..break them anyway u want and lets see who wins...They don't tell tiger woods you can't hit this stinger 2 iron anymore just isn't fair to other guys u hitting a 2 iron as far as they hit their driver...
If not just play rotation if you want to see tough outs and the best shooter win...The best player has to win playing rotation I think.. Brings every aspect into the game..Safes, banks, billiards,Great Position and long tough outs...Lets just use all the balls and get it on...
If not just play rotation if you want to see tough outs and the best shooter win...The best player has to win playing rotation I think.. Brings every aspect into the game..Safes, banks, billiards,Great Position and long tough outs...Lets just use all the balls and get it on...
This might be the most intelligent post that you have ever made. It is ABSOLUTELY ridiculous that they tell players how they can and can't break the balls. Larry Nevel can crush them harder than any human on the planet, and proceed to run out effortlessly. However, when Corey figures out how to hit em "like a girl," and run out even easier, they adapt a rule change becasue the rest of the players are not smart enough to duplicate his efforts. SIMPY AMAZING if you ask me. Your analogy is to Tiger Woods is way above your head, you must have heard that from me at some point in your life, but it is absolutely true. I think Ill call Tim Finchem, the PGA Tour commissioner and express my dissatisfaction with the Tour. Its not fair that Tiget figured out a way to hit his 3 wood down the middle every time, and be at the same distance as people hitting their drivers. I am sure NIKE won't mind the rule change.JamieMcWhorter said:
billychips said:
Copied and pasted from an old post of mine;
"Remember back in 2000-2002 when Corey started using the soft break and was winning pretty much every tournament he went to, much the same as SVB is doing right now? The thing that was so impressive about his run then was that when arriving at almost every tournament he went to he found out that the tournament officials (who were prompted by a few top pros) had changed to rules regarding the rack and/or break. Eg: 3 balls had to get to the rail, 4 balls had to get to the rail, rack with the 9 on the spot (instead of the 1), the list does on.... Corey is such a creative genius that he figured out on a day or two notice how to adapt his soft break to accomodate the "new" rules and win most of those tournaments... Kind of reminds of course designers "Tiger-proofing" golf courses. "
Almost every tour out there or major tournament has changed their rules about the break over the years and after time they always go back to break from the rail, box, wherever you want. Instead of *****ing about we should do this or do that why don't the players commit a big portion of the practice to racking and breaking from different speeds and spots AND LEARN HOW TO make balls. Freakin Iggys'
Saw
Has anyone ever considered that most pool players are simply big babies??? I can't wait for this response, but most of them I see do nothing but complain about all the bad rolls they got in a pool match, or in life. Woe is me!!! I dont blame Corey for not giving a shit about pool anymore and playing golf.
\Da Poet said:Just so I understand, you're complaining about people who complain.
Not really.
break
It seems to me that the same ball should not go straight in the same pocket on the break. Ten ball eliminates much of the new cloth
breaking problems (corner ball).
It seems to me that the same ball should not go straight in the same pocket on the break. Ten ball eliminates much of the new cloth
breaking problems (corner ball).
Jay,jay helfert said:
10 ball pretty much turns into 9-ball after a ball or two is potted. I don't know the exact stats, but I'd estimate that the guy who pots the 3-ball (or equivalent after the break) is a very high probability of winning the game. Close to 90%. These guys shoot 80-90% against the 9-ball ghost so I'd imagine it is a similar figure.
When I organized the Ralf Souquet v Pan Xiao Ting exhibition match in Shanghai, a lot of people commented that the game wasn't as exciting as they imagined because whoever made the first ball of each game almost assuredly ran out with few tense moments or big shots along the way. They all thought, heck, I can make all those shots.
These are the people the game needs to attract as new fans and the current format, the way it is played by the pros doesn't excite them. They get more excited watching a couple of bangers trading misses on the 9-ball with the accompanying oohs aahs and groans and the excited roar of victory when one of the players finally flukes the 9 off 3 rails. Silly I know, but that is what entertains the average occasional player.
I'm not sure where you are watching pool. It seems to me most these outs don't require great shots too often. Often great / perfect position that we can appreciate, but not too many big pots or big cue ball action shots that might get the masses salivating.
As another poster said, if you want to see a lot of big shots, watch the beginners play. When big shots are required for 9-ball pros, they most often play a safety or a conservative shot to nothing.
Colin