Stick on table for alignment

[7stud]

When doing 2 rail kicks, I will first use the stick to find the midpoint between the object and cue ball (BCA Legal). If they are within 3 or 4 feet apart, I'll eyeball it.

Then point stick down the midpoint to the pocket between the rails I'm kicking off of. Occasionally laying the stick on the table.

Then do a parallel shift with the stick over the cue ball.

I can do it in a out 10 or 15 seconds. Works for me.

Is that system explained somewhere on video?

I was watching a video today, and Corey Deuel used his stick to measure "the mirror" for a kick shot in a match against James Aranas during the 2018 West Coast Challenge 10-Ball Tournament:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWjxMF769VY&t=11m46s

 

[Snooker Theory]

Well, you learn something every day.

I doubt he was using the alignment feature much but he has been spotted doing it at tournaments before.

I thought about buying one as a training aid, I putt ambidextrous like Notah Begay, so it's a bullseye putter for me on the course, though if they made a bullseye version I'd likely pull the trigger. So in regards to your question, "do you want to be that guy",
I wouldn't mind being that guy, especially if being that guy is the difference between coming in first or at the bottom of the scoreboard.

If the PGA is ok with it, why not, heck Els was putting dreadfully bad before switching.

I was watching a video today, and Corey Deuel used his stick to measure "the mirror" in a 2018 West Coast Challenge 10-Ball match against James Aranas:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWjxMF769VY&t=11m46s

My god, oh the humanity of it all, LOL

 

[buckshotshoey]

Is that system explained somewhere on video?

I was watching a video today, and Corey Deuel used his stick to measure "the mirror" for a kick shot in a match against James Aranas during the 2018 West Coast Challenge 10-Ball Tournament:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWjxMF769VY&t=11m46s

Sent PM.............

 

[JazzyJeff87]

Question since you're in the fancy chalk business(i like Magic btw): Do you consider chalk "equipment"? If so how is it illegal to use chalk as an aiming aid but ok to use cue as one? IMO NEITHER one should be used as an aiming aid. Touching cloth with one's cue, to me anyway, is no different than placing a cube of chalk to aid in kicking/banking. Again, i don't write the rules and this is simply my $.02 worth.

The difference there is that the chalk stays in that spot throughout the whole process. Your cue has to go back in your hands and you have to remember/visualize where it had been I guess.

I spent a month or so focusing on my stance and getting down on the shot. At first I would hold my cue on the shot line and get down like that and then slowly I started just touching my cue to the table more for gauging distance.. like throwing out a pawing left just before a vicious right.

My hand would be in its grip spot on the cue, set the tip down right before the CB, and step with my right foot directly under where my hand was, then swing the left foot into place and drop down into the stance. That sets me up perfectly. Eventually I stopped doing it every shot and now I use it as an occasional extra step to get my head right or just make sure I’m still doing my thing.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

The difference there is that the chalk stays in that spot throughout the whole process. Your cue has to go back in your hands and you have to remember/visualize where it had been I guess.

I spent a month or so focusing on my stance and getting down on the shot. At first I would hold my cue on the shot line and get down like that and then slowly I started just touching my cue to the table more for gauging distance.. like throwing out a pawing left just before a vicious right.

My hand would be in its grip spot on the cue, set the tip down right before the CB, and step with my right foot directly under where my hand was, then swing the left foot into place and drop down into the stance. That sets me up perfectly. Eventually I stopped doing it every shot and now I use it as an occasional extra step to get my head right or just make sure I’m still doing my thing.

I think this, not aiming, is why most players who do this (or an abbreviated version of it) do it. I wouldn't have a problem if it was for aiming (wouldn't mind chalk on the rail either), but I don't think it is.

pj
chgo

 

[garczar]

I mean it works for Ernie Els, he jumped to fourth in putting after switching. It's really up to the PGA, and they say it's ok.

Els' caddy is actually holding that putter. His name is Harvey.

 

[ShootingArts]

local rule

I don't have any idea what rule set it is based on but around here you can use your stick to help line up banks and kicks but it can't leave your hand. I have never seen anyone fuss about touching a tip to the table, obviously marking the table with a tip is a different matter. I have seen many very good players do this and pro's doing it isn't uncommon at all. No big deal.

The most impressive shot I have ever seen was an eight rail kick on a bar table. It hit every cushion on the table at least once. The object ball would have fell had the cue ball not ran out of steam about the time it got to the fifteen ball. Fellow named Johnny waved his stick over the table for a couple minutes lining up that shot.

Hu

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

I read somewhere that a good shot alignment procedure is to put the stick on the table right on the shot line. My question is do you bend into the shot directly without picking up the stick again or pick the stick up and bend into it again with your eye on the determined line. Does anybody here use this technique?

If it not against spicific rules, and it ork for you why ask. I use my Cue as an aiming aid all the time to find point of extended lines in the diamond system.

 

[straightline]

When you pocket balls you're over-lapping two spheres. Worrying about the exact contact point won't help you much. When you address the ball you can't see cp's anyway. When you line-up a shot you're just choosing correct over-lap. Pointing at the line or cp is not much help imo. I just see the over-lap and shoot down that line.

Most shots sure. By the same token I would not hire a carpenter who eyeballed everything. Determining the reciprocal sections by the contact points is the only absolute reference in ball collisions. I know we been through all this but you know, post fever. lol

Suppose Iphone had an app that plotted any shot in front of the camera. Would you use/allow it?

 

[garczar]

Most shots sure. By the same token I would not hire a carpenter who eyeballed everything. Determining the reciprocal sections by the contact points is the only absolute reference in ball collisions. I know we been through all this but you know, post fever. lol

Suppose Iphone had an app that plotted any shot in front of the camera. Would you use/allow it?

Of course not. Are you f^*@ing kidding?? I hope so. Might as well just never leave the couch and play some app pool on a damn cell phone.

 

[TannerPruess]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vz2Wfn2jpsA

Seems a lot like my routine. Check out the first rack where I end up with ball in hand on the 3.

 

[KRJ]

I agree. Like I said, I wouldn’t call a marking foul just because someone’s tip hit the felt. I would call someone on slow play if they overdo it to the point of actually being slow and I’d definitely call slow play on someone forever stroking like you’re describing.

I’m not worried about what other players do in general. But I think there are some “techniques” people rely on that really just prevent them from developing and trusting their more natural abilities.


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And it's not a marking foul in any sanctioned league in the US... except for that one league that you play in. That's only time I've heard such a thing.

 

[KRJ]

Question since you're in the fancy chalk business(i like Magic btw): Do you consider chalk "equipment"? If so how is it illegal to use chalk as an aiming aid but ok to use cue as one? IMO NEITHER one should be used as an aiming aid. Touching cloth with one's cue, to me anyway, is no different than placing a cube of chalk to aid in kicking/banking. Again, i don't write the rules and this is simply my $.02 worth.

Actually, I play with a guy, a state Master, that uses his chalk when it's a tight squeeze for position and he wants to see the tangent line and wants to be more exact. He puts his cube of chalk next to the cue ball without touching of course, and see's exactly the line he wants to go.

Not a foul. Doesn't bother me. Nobody seems to care. He does in state tourneys as well.

Using the cue to line up a shot is not a foul, plain and simple. I'm still not sure why it would bother anyone. Before I shoot a rifle, I also aim with the rifle, is that bad

 

[Buzzard]

Thank you all for your interesting perspectives on this question! I am going to continue working with it until I have it nailed So far it has helped me to keep everything in line.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Determining the reciprocal sections by the contact points is the only absolute reference in ball collisions.

I'd go even further - the OB contact point is more than a reference; it's the actual physical target you're trying to hit with the CB. Developing an eye for it is worth a lot no matter how you use it.

pj
chgo

 

[ShootingArts]

self taught

Most shots sure. By the same token I would not hire a carpenter who eyeballed everything. Determining the reciprocal sections by the contact points is the only absolute reference in ball collisions. I know we been through all this but you know, post fever. lol

Suppose Iphone had an app that plotted any shot in front of the camera. Would you use/allow it?

I had a hall owner that was a very good shortstop mentor me a bit years later but I had no idea how to try to aim when I started playing pool. The thing to do seemed to be to map the backside of the cue ball that you can't really see. I spent countless hours over maybe six months learning the contact points I couldn't see. Side to side came pretty easy, depth was a bear! Without both I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn from inside it!

After that first six months I dedicated the next six months to getting back all the beer I had bought for other people. Not much advancement in my pool game, I could beat the people I played against. It was awhile before I decided I wanted to kick my game up another notch or three.

Hu

 

[MattPoland]

And it's not a marking foul in any sanctioned league in the US... except for that one league that you play in. That's only time I've heard such a thing.

I only play in BCA. I don’t think it is as marginalized as you’re portraying it. This is the rule...

I’ve seen people place their tip on the table half a ball back from the object ball along the pocket line on a cut shot...then pivot their cue around to the shooting line and use that as a visual reference for where the ghost ball is. I don’t have a problem with people using the technique even though I think it is a crutch. I’ve heard people say, “If he leaves a chalk mark on the table, I’m calling foul.” And I get it. Theoretically the player could aim their stick at that chalk mark on the felt. But I know that’s not what they’re trying to do. The mark is incidental. Even if it helps them make that one ball, I think relying on that technique is a sign of a weakness in their game. I let the rule slip because it feels like a nitty thing to argue when I already feel I probably have a leg up on this player.


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[straightline]

I had a hall owner that was a very good shortstop mentor me a bit years later but I had no idea how to try to aim when I started playing pool. The thing to do seemed to be to map the backside of the cue ball that you can't really see. I spent countless hours over maybe six months learning the contact points I couldn't see. Side to side came pretty easy, depth was a bear! Without both I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn from inside it!

After that first six months I dedicated the next six months to getting back all the beer I had bought for other people. Not much advancement in my pool game, I could beat the people I played against. It was awhile before I decided I wanted to kick my game up another notch or three.

Hu

Yeah not having to miss is The Great Liberator.

I wasn't going to bring this up but since it's stick aiming, if you drop a line from the contact point on the object ball to the cloth and center the tip there, you'll find a corresponding tangent that you can simply match to the reciprocal tangent on the top of the cueball. Parallel over to center ball and there's your basic shot line. This is how I got Jimmy Reid's "equal angle opposites" to work for me.

 

[iusedtoberich]

IDK why everyone is harping on resting your stick on a table possibly being a foul.

This thread is about stance alignment technique, as asked by the OP. You guys took the crux of the thread and turned it into a non-issue of fouling. Has anyone in the history of pool been called on a foul for that? I've watched pro after pro seemingly "mark" the rail on kick shots by swiping their stick on the nose of the cushion, an it has never been called a foul. Now simply laying the tip on the table as part of a PSR is debated as a possible foul? Its not. Look at what Tanner showed, and what I showed. It leaves zero mark on the table, and can't possibly be an advantage even if it did (like marking the rail on a kick shot can).

Also if you look at Tanner's or my video, the resting the stick on the table simply takes the place of the player aiming the shot while standing, before they get down in their stance. Or standing up and doing the two air strokes like Corey does. Etc etc. Its the same thing as far as time taken, just in a different physical space.

Boy, hard crowd

 

[straightline]

It seemed relevant as a caveat is all.