Hi guys, for the first time in 20+ years I was stumped. With the match in full progress, Player A has a break shot with a new rack. He shoots at the break ball and continues to clear the table of the remaining balls. Six balls into the run, a spectator asks what game are they playing because the break ball was never made and neither player noticed it. What's the call?
Straight Pool Senario
- Thread starter raravena
- Start date
Snooze ya lose.........
heads or tails
heads: set it up as close to the original break shot as possible and start the rack over
tails: keep playing as is
heads: set it up as close to the original break shot as possible and start the rack over
tails: keep playing as is
Here is the rule for when a similar thing happens at eight ball. I think for 14.1 it would be reasonable to take the score back to what it was at the start of the rack and then lag to see who shoots an opening break shot.
10. 8-Ball Addendum
If the groups have been determined and the player mistakenly shoots at and pockets a ball of the opponent’s group, the foul must be called before he takes his next shot. Upon recognition by either player or the referee that the groups have been reversed, the rack will be halted and will be replayed with the original player executing the break shot.
If the groups have been determined and the player mistakenly shoots at and pockets a ball of the opponent’s group, the foul must be called before he takes his next shot. Upon recognition by either player or the referee that the groups have been reversed, the rack will be halted and will be replayed with the original player executing the break shot.
With all due respect I don't really think that 8 ball scenario can even remotely be compared to this situation. Perhaps in the 8 ball game if the player shot at his ball and thought it were pocketed when it wasn't and then continued shooting, that would be more of a comparison.
Here are my thoughts on it ....
You said you were in a "match". Was this a private game? A tournament? That of course offers the foundation of the answer.
A tournament, you ask the tournament director.
Private, it would seem to me that you agree to reset (as close as possible) the rack prior to the error and then continue with the original shooter re attempting to break open the rack.
Or ... if it is determined that this would constitute an unfair second attempt at an already missed shot, or if a money game and an agreement can't be reached. It is common practice that even in cue ball foul only situations, when more than one object ball is disturbed, it is a foul.
Balls pocketed on a foul don't count, so at this point, you either set the pocketed balls on the string line, deduct one point and play from this position, or if it were too far along in the rack, deduct a point for the foul and have the offending player re-break.
Then, call the bar maid and order a couple of mugs of Geritol and hope it doesn't happen again.
Here are my thoughts on it ....
You said you were in a "match". Was this a private game? A tournament? That of course offers the foundation of the answer.
A tournament, you ask the tournament director.
Private, it would seem to me that you agree to reset (as close as possible) the rack prior to the error and then continue with the original shooter re attempting to break open the rack.
Or ... if it is determined that this would constitute an unfair second attempt at an already missed shot, or if a money game and an agreement can't be reached. It is common practice that even in cue ball foul only situations, when more than one object ball is disturbed, it is a foul.
Balls pocketed on a foul don't count, so at this point, you either set the pocketed balls on the string line, deduct one point and play from this position, or if it were too far along in the rack, deduct a point for the foul and have the offending player re-break.
Then, call the bar maid and order a couple of mugs of Geritol and hope it doesn't happen again.
Haven't looked it up, but last time I remember a like situation under WPA rules, the referee (not a table but area ref, not his fault for not noticing) said something to the extent of "too late now", i.e. player continued and opponent failed to get a referee right when it happened…
Makes me wonder, where's Mikko when we need him…?!
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
Makes me wonder, where's Mikko when we need him…?!
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
I would think the following rules apply (WPA):
6.13 Playing out of Turn
It is a standard foul to unintentionally play out of turn. Normally, the balls will be played from the position left by the mistaken play.
6. Fouls
...If a foul is not called before the next shot begins, the foul is assumed not to have happened. [emphasis added]
So, play continues as it was, with the same player shooting.
6.13 Playing out of Turn
It is a standard foul to unintentionally play out of turn. Normally, the balls will be played from the position left by the mistaken play.
6. Fouls
...If a foul is not called before the next shot begins, the foul is assumed not to have happened. [emphasis added]
So, play continues as it was, with the same player shooting.
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I think that's probably the best solution, but how many balls is he credited with if he runs out the rack? 14? 15?
I think the rules are not clear that the "turn to play" has not been taken away from the breaker who missed the shot, so you could say that each following shot was a foul.
There is a similar situation in carom billiards where each player has his own cue ball. If a player is noticed to have been shooting with the wrong ball, that shot is a foul but previous points are scored.
How can the second shot be out of turn, when the first wasn't (that foul never having happened)?
Thank You Kindly.