Straight Pool Suggestions

Pidge said:
I wouldn't know where to start looking for help and advice on how to stay mentally fresh when you're playing pool for hours at a time.
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Well, if you wouldn't consider it "cheating" you could always take a break?
Just 15 minutes or so?

I always feel like the biggest enemy to my stamina is boredom. But I'd also think that as you get
closer and closer to your high run, there must be some excitment and boredom won't be a problem.
So, maybe play fast and casual until you reach a number that's getting pretty high.

I know JS recommends that several times... play at a quick, fluid pace... he says he doesn't even
really start paying attention until he's over 100, and then he really bears down past 200.
Maybe you can just sort of have fun for the first 8 racks and conserve your mental gas.
 
Pidge said:
Thanks for the replies guys. Some of the posts I've read or seen but some I haven't so thanks. :)

My record stands at 303 and its always the break into the pack that let's me down so any material covering breaking into the pack in particular would be greatly appreciated.
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If you have run 303 balls then there is no book or DVD that's going to help you much.
303 puts you in some pretty elite ranks of all time.
 
CreeDo said:
Well, if you wouldn't consider it "cheating" you could always take a break?
Just 15 minutes or so?

I always feel like the biggest enemy to my stamina is boredom. But I'd also think that as you get
closer and closer to your high run, there must be some excitment and boredom won't be a problem.
So, maybe play fast and casual until you reach a number that's getting pretty high.

I know JS recommends that several times... play at a quick, fluid pace... he says he doesn't even
really start paying attention until he's over 100, and then he really bears down past 200.
Maybe you can just sort of have fun for the first 8 racks and conserve your mental gas.
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Nerves play a huge part when you start getting close. I feel my self trying to concentrate much more. I slow down and there is no rhythm to my game. I'm a "slow" player anyway, and I remember once I got to about 250ish and each shot started taking me 1-2 minutes. That's far too slow IMO, even for me. Maybe the trick is to not over think?

I don't have it in me to play on my own for more than a couple hours a day. That limits me to really going for 1, maybe 2 attempts at a big run. Maybe a 15 - 30 minute break would do the trick.
 
measureman said:
If you have run 303 balls then there is no book or DVD that's going to help you much.
303 puts you in some pretty elite ranks of all time.
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303 on your home table does not put you in any elite rank.

If I could do this in competition, I'd move to the States and start making money from it. I take my hat off to anyone that can make 250+ in matchplay.
 
Pidge said:
303 on your home table does not put you in any elite rank.

If I could do this in competition, I'd move to the States and start making money from it. I take my hat off to anyone that can make 250+ in matchplay.
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You may not think so, but the VAST majority would certainly disagree with you on that point! Home table or not, do you realize how few EVER get to that number??
 
Neil said:
Pidge said:
303 on your home table does not put you in any elite rank.

If I could do this in competition, I'd move to the States and start making money from it. I take my hat off to anyone that can make 250+ in matchplay.
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You may not think so, but the VAST majority would certainly disagree with you on that point! Home table or not, do you realize how few EVER get to that number??
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I agree with Neil. Unless you have an EXTREMELY soft/forgiving 9-footer, or else, by the term "home table" you are implying that you're doing these caliber of runs on a barbox (7- or 8-footer with "recreationally-cut" pockets), any run over 200/250 and higher puts you in very thin air -- not many people breathing that air.

The problem is not so much knowing the patterns, as it is losing your focus over that stretch of time. Mistakes happen, even to champions, and if you've ever watched a player the caliber of the aforementioned John Schmidt, Corey Deuel, et al., it's not like they crack 100 (forget 200+) "every single time" they're at the table. It just doesn't happen.

Along with several others, I helped man the 14.1 Challenge booth each year at the Super Billiards Expo, and I can't tell you how many times that a [world-class] player doesn't deliver on the "expectation" (from the spectators' eyes, anyway) of a 100-ball run. I've seen some not even get out of the first rack. Again, it happens, and matchplay has little to do with it (or none, in this case, since it's a 14.1 "challenge" where the only opponent is yourself, and not an actual match).

-Sean
 
Neil said:
You may not think so, but the VAST majority would certainly disagree with you on that point! Home table or not, do you realize how few EVER get to that number??
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Clearly not. No body plays it here. The American pool scene is played by a few hundred people here and that's mostly split into 8, 9 and 10 ball. So I have no one to talk to about the game, and even less of a chance to play with someone that's going to run into the hundreds.

I just assumed there would be probably 20%ish of people on here that could run 250+
 
Pidge said:
Clearly not. No body plays it here. The American pool scene is played by a few hundred people here and that's mostly split into 8, 9 and 10 ball. So I have no one to talk to about the game, and even less of a chance to play with someone that's going to run into the hundreds.

I just assumed there would be probably 20%ish of people on here that could run 250+
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http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=258664 Check out that thread. In the last 6 years, 6 people on here have hit over 250.
 
Pidge said:
Wow! Seeing some of the names on that list makes me feel like a dumbass about getting so annoyed with my self.
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Most people aren't as good as they think they are....always nice to find out you are way better than you thought you were! :D

edit: Just a note to that though, if you ever decide to compete, you will have to learn to pick up the pace a little. 1-2 minutes per shot won't cut it in competition.

edit: another thought, are you sure you are having 1-2 min. between shots? Have you filmed yourself? I know that sometimes I feel like I am taking forever on a shot, but on film I see that it is less than 30 sec. When even partially in the zone, time gets scewed and we lose track of it.
 
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Neil said:
Most people aren't as good as they think they are....always nice to find out you are way better than you thought you were! :D
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Agreed. It amazes me the abundance of predominantly short-rack rotation players who think -- without having ever tried it -- that straight pool "is easy, for you can shoot at any ball, and always adjust your patterns accordingly if you miss shape." They'll give you the impression they can run racks and racks without ever missing.

But once you play this wonderful game, you realize just how tough it is. Position play isn't played in "zones" like it is in short-rack rotation; it's mere inches or fractions of an inch in some cases. Countless examples, but the obvious one -- that even short-rack rotation players understand -- if you miss shape on your break ball, you're going to be playing a safety rather than going into the rack and continuing the run.

One of the funny things that the staff would do at the 14.1 Challenge, is when we get one of these types that pony up the fee to have a crack at it, is friendly-elbow each other and watch what we call "9-ball straight pool" -- where the cue ball runs around the table and the player struggles to play shape using large swaths of the table. Most often, the run unceremoniously ends with either a miss on a "white flag" shot, or getting in trouble with the cue ball being snookered behind a cluster or what-have-you, or a wing-and-a-prayer shot on the last ball on the table, with little hope to hit the rack.

Lesson? Those that think this game "is easy" have a rude awakening coming when they actually play this game.

Neil said:
edit: Just a note to that though, if you ever decide to compete, you will have to learn to pick up the pace a little. 1-2 minutes per shot won't cut it in competition.

edit: another thought, are you sure you are having 1-2 min. between shots? Have you filmed yourself? I know that sometimes I feel like I am taking forever on a shot, but on film I see that it is less than 30 sec. When even partially in the zone, time gets scewed and we lose track of it.
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I agree, a slow pace is actually an albatross around the player's neck. First, it will get you in trouble with your opponent, and the ref that's called over. Second, it prevents you from getting in the natural rhythm of running balls -- the natural rhythm of "solve the problem, execute the solution" with minimal fuss.

There are few things more enjoyable than to watch a clockwork-like player sinking balls on a cadence. Anyone who's ever watched Dave Daya play straight pool (his best game, IMHO) knows what I'm talking about. Blink, and you missed two or three shots. You actually watch the pattern-solving happen in REAL TIME, not an excruciatingly slow pace that puts you to sleep.

-Sean
 
sfleinen said:
Agreed. It amazes me the abundance of predominantly short-rack rotation players who think -- without having ever tried it -- that straight pool "is easy, for you can shoot at any ball, and always adjust your patterns accordingly if you miss shape." They'll give you the impression they can run racks and racks without ever missing.

But once you play this wonderful game, you realize just how tough it is. Position play isn't played in "zones" like it is in short-rack rotation; it's mere inches or fractions of an inch in some cases. Countless examples, but the obvious one -- that even short-rack rotation players understand -- if you miss shape on your break ball, you're going to be playing a safety rather than going into the rack and continuing the run.

One of the funny things that the staff would do at the 14.1 Challenge, is when we get one of these types that pony up the fee to have a crack at it, is friendly-elbow each other and watch what we call "9-ball straight pool" -- where the cue ball runs around the table and the player struggles to play shape using large swaths of the table. Most often, the run unceremoniously ends with either a miss on a "white flag" shot, or getting in trouble with the cue ball being snookered behind a cluster or what-have-you, or a wing-and-a-prayer shot on the last ball on the table, with little hope to hit the rack.

Lesson? Those that think this game "is easy" have a rude awakening coming when they actually play this game.



I agree, a slow pace is actually an albatross around the player's neck. First, it will get you in trouble with your opponent, and the ref that's called over. Second, it prevents you from getting in the natural rhythm of running balls -- the natural rhythm of "solve the problem, execute the solution" with minimal fuss.

There are few things more enjoyable than to watch a clockwork-like player sinking balls on a cadence. Anyone who's ever watched Dave Daya play straight pool (his best game, IMHO) knows what I'm talking about. Blink, and you missed two or three shots. You actually watch the pattern-solving happen in REAL TIME, not an excruciatingly slow pace that puts you to sleep.

-Sean
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In 14.1 you shoot Allot over balls, you shoot allot of combinations and your bumping and rolling balls out of the way creating break shots. You also learn the importance of playing shape on minimum two balls and often 3 or four at a time JIC you get out of line (safety valves). Things that happen in 14.1 ''all the time'' are very infrequent in other games but when needed are just as important but usually morso.. Another VERY important aspect that dramatically effects All games is making a ball and moving other balls in a controlled manner this happens All the time in 14.1.
 
Anyone who can run 300 isn't going to learn anything from the books out there.

You can watch some videos, but maybe your best bet is to pay world champs to critique some video of you. World Champions at the game charge less than golf instructors who never made a cut in a PGA event over here...video some racks where you went wrong and have them give you some ideas.

Any chance you could take a vacation in the states, enter an event, and pay for some instruction from Thorsten while you're here?
 
bud green said:
Anyone who can run 300 isn't going to learn anything from the books out there.

You can watch some videos, but maybe your best bet is to pay world champs to critique some video of you. World Champions at the game charge less than golf instructors who never made a cut in a PGA event over here...video some racks where you went wrong and have them give you some ideas.

Any chance you could take a vacation in the states, enter an event, and pay for some instruction from Thorsten while you're here?
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My girlfriend has been nagging me to take her to New York for a while now. Perhaps nows my time to give myself...um, her what she wants.

If I do cross the pond I doubt ill compete in any 14.1 events unless they're challenge type formats. I have zero experience playing an opponent in 14.1.
 
Neil said:
Most people aren't as good as they think they are....always nice to find out you are way better than you thought you were! :D

edit: Just a note to that though, if you ever decide to compete, you will have to learn to pick up the pace a little. 1-2 minutes per shot won't cut it in competition.

edit: another thought, are you sure you are having 1-2 min. between shots? Have you filmed yourself? I know that sometimes I feel like I am taking forever on a shot, but on film I see that it is less than 30 sec. When even partially in the zone, time gets scewed and we lose track of it.
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2 good points.
Never filmed my self play really so I wouldn't know.
I've competed on the GB9 and Euro tours playing 9 ball and never had a problem with playing slow, but in 14.1 I do. Always seems to be when I'm on a decent run, and I can see the balls are laying nice that's when I slow down because I know I shouldn't be making any mistakes.
For me, that routine is going to be difficult to got out of.
 
Pidge said:
My girlfriend has been nagging me to take her to New York for a while now. Perhaps nows my time to give myself...um, her what she wants.

If I do cross the pond I doubt ill compete in any 14.1 events unless they're challenge type formats. I have zero experience playing an opponent in 14.1.
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Zero experience, LOL! It's just like playing yourself...you just keep shooting and keep his butt in the chair, and you don't have an opponent!:grin:
 
A video would help

Maybe you can post a video of yourself running 4 or 5 racks so the experts here can analyze what you're doing wrong?

JC
 
OK. I have read through this thread. Is this guy for real?
He states that running 303 balls is not a big deal and he thinks that 20% of the forum can run 200 balls. I'm calling BS until we see a video of him running a few racks at least.
Maybe he is just adding the balls up by the numbers on them? that's how he got to 303 and thinks it's no big deal?
 
Anyone thinks its easy to run 100 is nuts. I got enough trouble getting into the second rack, never mind the third, lol.
I was at the 14.1 challenge the night before and i was watching Max Eberle doing the challenge and he messed up a few times himself before getting out of the 3rd rack.
Then he caught fire and got to 98 and he fell too close to the break ball and missed it. I was sweating the shot more than he was, lol.
The game is TOUGH, anyone who thinks otherwise has never played it for any length of time.
 
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