straightline: "Can you provide the logic behind this?"

I knew a guy for several years. He asked me once why I didn't put salt and pepper on my eggs.
I told him curtly, "Eggs don't have any taste so why should I want to taste just plain old salt and pepper."
He just looked at me sort of stunned. He remarked how I just put his shxt in the street.

A couple of your replies to my post are rather good.
Eggs don’t have any taste?
 
World class pocket billiards performers still know what they know but realize there is no use explaining it.
The questions would never stop.
There are so many people who want to know.
They would never be left alone.

Gorst knows. And he could explain it.
But what for?

What were you before you were human?
Gorst: Different.
Different how?
Gorst: It would only frighten you.
-the day the earth stood still 2008

A.I. Gorst stopped communicating because humans could no longer understand it.
-Automata 2014

Gorst is not an alien
Gorst is not A.I.
But some people believe he is someone they need to exalt.
And believe others should do so as well.
Go figure.

What do any of you think he knows about aligning a cue stick to make
a shot that you don't know or wouldn't understand?
Or probably couldn't do if he explained it to you?
Get real.

He still knows what he's doing and has decided not to take the time to explain
because it is simply too much of a burden and not worth it.

But I'm sure at some level he thinks you are all very amusing.

I'm happy for him.
I just think you shouldn't sell yourself short.

What do they know?
Efficiency.
Years of practice has taught them efficiency.
In a nutshell, this is what they could teach you.
And save you an immense amount of time as a result.
Sorry, no.

They're just really good. The rest of us suck by comparison.
 
It could matter in a lot of things. Doing some electrical repairs on your home but you're not an electrician.
Well I did consult and got the permit and passed inspection. 🤷‍♂️ I live on the edge. 😉
you said:
Fixing your car but you're not a tech.
I did rebuild my Chevy small block and 350 auto transmission. I had Chiltons and did it by the book. Both worked fine. 🤷‍♂️
you said:
First flight in your experimental aircraft but you're not a pilot
I did get to fly a B-52 for half an hour. Not exactly experiment though. One of the longest lived aircraft in the fleet.
I do play pretty good pool too. 🤷‍♂️
My survival skills keep me in line.
I pay for lessons and of course charge for same.
My price negotiation starts with "What's comfortable for you?^ 🤷‍♂️
 
My pool secret… real practice sucks. It is exhausting and hurts your brain, it isn’t fun and it makes you want to do something else. Pros suffer through it because of pure passion, while it is a brick wall to leisure/lore mentality.
 
The pros want your money by offering instructional and training sessions for pay. Many of them earn their living by doing that as we all know that there isn’t much money in pro pool.
So this is why you’ll get vague answers from them.
You might think that it’s all there in the open but there are secrets to this game as some things just hide in plain sight, well it used to be… but today the knowledge is out there and you need to search for it.
So....you think good players want to make a living from instruction by being bad at instruction?
 
I have done a handful of things well enough that people came to me for lessons or advice. Never kept a count, dozens maybe, not hundreds. I'm still waiting to see the one that followed my advice for any length of time despite the fact that I won far more than my share.

I have spent time with world champions, world class performers. Been friends with quite a few. One reason is I never asked them a question how to do something. If they told me something I listened. However, I didn't ask for advice I ultimately might not follow. A multi-time world champion told me a technique he used. Later, I tried his advice. Didn't work for me. He was one of the top dozen, maybe top half-dozen in the world so about six months later I tried it again. Nope, didn't work. Two years later, another try. Nope. It nagged at me a bit though so about three or four months later I tried it again. It worked like a bandit!

There are a lot of reasons the best don't usually try to help. The main reason is that it is usually a waste of time trying. Most people are looking for a magic bullet, one thing to learn or one thing to fix. Often when advice doesn't work for somebody that isn't ready for it, they go around telling everyone that the expert that tried to help them just blew smoke up their asses.

The best in the world could spend a week with over 95% of the people on AZB answering any questions asked and six month afterward there would be no significant improvement in the person's game. The top pro's have learned long ago that trying to help most people is beating their heads against a brick wall. Why do something with almost no upside and often a real downside?

Hu
 
So....you think good players want to make a living from instruction by being bad at instruction?
Being a good player won't make one automatically a good teacher. I've seen great players being really bad at teaching pool.
But even a good teacher won't give free advice if he makes a living of it.
 
Being a good player won't make one automatically a good teacher. I've seen great players being really bad at teaching pool.
But even a good teacher won't give free advice if he makes a living of it.
Different sides of the tracks mostly.
Teachers have care to enough about people to at least attempt nurturing their interests.

Pool players have to care enough about people to be able to empty their pockets.

Show unto
Do unto

See how that works?

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
Different sides of the tracks mostly.
Teachers have care to enough about people to at least attempt nurturing their interests.

Pool players have to care enough about people to be able to empty their pockets.

Show unto
Do unto

See how that works?

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

While I have seen competitors become teachers when their careers are basically over it is rare for a top competitor at anything to be a good teacher too. Different personalities and few can turn off the competitor side or be both. Oddly enough looking at all forms of competition it is rarely the superstar that makes a good coach or instructor, it is usually a good solid player that was never a superstar.

Hu
 
Different sides of the tracks mostly.
Teachers have care to enough about people to at least attempt nurturing their interests.

Pool players have to care enough about people to be able to empty their pockets.

Show unto
Do unto

See how that works?

:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
My experience is that people don’t appreciate free advice and don’t take the advisor that seriously when it’s free. They appreciate the advice and the advisor much more when they pay for it.
 
My experience is that people don’t appreciate free advice and don’t take the advisor that seriously when it’s free. They appreciate the advice and the advisor much more when they pay for it.
Maybe buying the advice indicates inclination and unsolicited advice hit or miss.
 
Which is sad because it is all pretty simple if you go at it the right way.

As for throw... There was a guy from England who played in our 14.1 league. He had a 143 or so at snooker. He was by far the top shooter at 14.1 with a 113 on a table about like a 4.5" Diamond. He didn't know about throw. If there was a dead ball in the rack but you had to throw it, you could safely leave him up-table, because he would never shoot it. To some very good players, throw is a "secret".

Object ball/object ball throw is described in Mosconi's booklet.
Interesting point Bob. For me many of the so called secrets in Pool are in the myriad of intricacies and complexities available in the safety and kicking aspects of the game. These come up in all the Rotation games and especially in One Pocket. I've often seen very good players overlook a simple option and shoot a more difficult shot when they fail to see the easier way to execute the shot. I realize they are not even aware this option exists. They simply don't see it. Often times a little "bunt" shot will work quite well, rather than trying to shoot two or three rails at a far more difficult shot to execute.

I will only add that I've shown shots to some world class players (that they were previously unaware of), mostly little One Pocket moves, but other shots that they might not know. Did you know that if the object ball is on the point of the side pocket, positioned in such a way it won't go in, there is actually a way to make that ball? Along those same lines there is a way to shoot the cue ball directly into the side pocket with an object ball partially blocking the pocket and not moving or touching the object ball. And it's not a jump shot. I won many proposition bets on that shot.

I can't tell you how many One Pocket players did not know about banking balls cross corner and aiming up at the rack and not at their pocket. They just didn't know. And then there's the two rail bank into the bottom of the rack! Better yet is the two rail kick shot into the rack. Just a little taste for you to think about. Some of you know this stuff (I can guess who) but many of you don't.

Only one name - Carlo Biado. When he first arrived here maybe 12-13 years ago he couldn't spell One Pocket, but he knew that was where the money was. I spent about a week with him teaching him the intricacies of One Pocket on my home table and he quickly became a very competent player. Not nearly one of the best but able to hold his own against anyone.
 
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You asked for it.
So here's some logic.

When I as about 12 years old, I had a friend, Robert.
His father worked for Ampex. He was some sort of engineer or researcher.
I think Ampex was later bought out by Fairchild, etc.
His father, at least on two occasions, emphasized that he was a brain-picker.
I'll admit that at the time I felt a bit ill at ease when told this.
He emphatically said that he literally picked peoples brains.
And he would reach out with a hand as if plucking something from the air.
Sounded like cannibalism to this kid.
He meant that he gained knowledge and experience from other people's
knowledge and experiences by "picking their brains."
I'm sure you understand.

So I've noticed that the current crop of world class pool champions don't
spend much if any time at all here on AZBilliards forums.
If anyone was seeking knowledge and wisdom about pool, they'd seek it from these champions.
But from what I've seen and heard none of them are or have come forward offering any free precious golden tidbits.
Gorst was asked once and he said, "I just see the shots."
That was it.

Does anyone buy that?
All of these greats know exactly what they are doing in detail that has made them champions.
Each and every one could divulge their secrets if they wanted to.
But they don't.
So there must be a reason.
You figure it out.
I'm not even going to try.

But I have decided to follow their lead.
Seems like the wise thing to do.
So don't expect the Holy Grail from me in this regard.
The best one can hope for is to serendipitously run across previously revealed information that is still rather obscure
and held closely by the keepers of privileged knowledge. While not secret, still lesser known and rare.

So get off my case.

Pool actually is what-you-see-is-what-you-get. There really are no secrets. These "secrets" are all a psychological scam meant to dumb us down. Nothing is hidden. It's all right there on the cloth covered tabletop with its rails, pockets, balls, the cue, the chalk, and of course, the Action. Sharp focus, acute observation, critical thinking, and perhaps a creative bent is all you need. Figure it out for yourself. Then keep quiet.
:).... lol.... mornin'....
Been teaching since the 90's.
Even when I was working for the BCA I would get calls from so called instructors that would ask me questions (and they played) on how to do this and that, overseeing the instructor program gave all a phone number to get me.
One beginning writer wrote a book using some of my help.
He's still writing and well known.... persons name is not important.
Not all great players understand teaching.
Not all great teachers are Great players.
And this writer/league skilled player/teacher/book writer.... I think was smart, he had no clue and he knew I could help.
bm
 
The side pocket opening’s normally wider than two balls…?

pj
chgo
Correct. What I'm saying is to place an object ball in such a way that it partially blocks the avenue for the cue ball to get through cleanly. If a pool ball is 2 1/4" in diameter, then place it 2 1/8" from the point in the middle of the pocket. I can shoot the cue ball in past the object ball without touching it, and not from the other side of the pocket. Trust me it can be done.
 
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