The Mosconi Cup is Not About ...

iIS JOHNNY ARCHER....

Is johnny at the mosconi cup watching this year? I trust he is there supporting team us.

Everyone thinks he should be on the team and i dont have an opinion either way, but since he is not, i trust he is at least there to support us.
 
Basement dweller uses a task-oriented approach.
For me, a good deduction of things happening
dechaine alignment and delivery are not bullitproof, to many flaws
Did you see where his tip sometimes went on a straight nine?

I like to use A-B-C-game to qualify level of play
So B-game is solid middle game, average
Where i would use C-game where Dweller talks about B-game

What remains of your game when the arm is rigid, the mindset vulnerable?
Is your rock reliable ? Is your shot-selection according your skill-level in the current state?
 
These guys are all very good players or they wouldnt be here. What I see over and over again is who holds up better under pressure. Thats what makes the biggest difference here. Having a lot of "heart" is what defines the champions every time, the ones who come up with the big shots under pressure.
 
The outcome of a game where winning depends on a single ball rather than a points system quantifying excellence is bound to deliver deliver some bizarre results.

The outcome of a match based on very few games gives very limited time to overcome mistakes or bad luck or to get back in stroke.

9 racks of 9-ball means a maximum of 81 balls potted.

Pro snooker tournaments are, at a minimum, best of 7.
To win 4 - 0 means a potential of 144 balls potted.

Having 10 people playing a single rack of 9-ball is a ridiculous exercise.
Having 4 people playing a single rack of 9-ball is only somewhat less so.
And let's toss in a shot clock.

I don't know the average time a Mosconi player takes for each shot.
Snooker has no shot clock, except for gimmick tournaments, and player roll along at between 18 - 25 seconds average, which may include several minutes over a single shot. They keep stats. :grin:

This is the first time I have actually watched the MC, live, and nearly completely. It has twists and turns, but not sustained suspense, and no satisfaction that the outcome necessarily proves anything.
 
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It's really about 'Heart' in everything that we do as human beings when gauging 'success' vs 'failure'.
 
TomInFaribo said:
Many of the UK players Albine O being one have mentors/coaches that travel with them. Constantly tweaking their play.
Justin B has Mark Wilson sort of.
What does that tell ya. SVB I think is at that point where he needs a mentor/coach.
Corey Duel states in the Aiming section here on AZ something to the effect you don't need an aiming system or he doesn't use one. I saw him miss the easiest 9 ball in his match with SVB. This does happen with the best of them,
But
My belief:
You can do the 10,000 ball practice and have nothing to fall back on when you game goes bad. How often do we hear shot lights out last week. Can't hit a thing today.

A good aiming system also gives you a GOOD pre-shot routine.
A good aiming system aligns the body to the natural stance to pocket the ball.
A good aiming system gives you something to fall back on and a go back to and practice the fundamentals with, when you lose your game.
A good aiming system teaches you how important the eyes are and your eye dominance.
A good aiming system allows you the additional needed confidence that you are going to make the ball. There is nothing sweeter than coming down on a hill-hill 9 ball and its already lined up. All I have to do is stroke the cue now. (This is what Corey needed)
Day in and Day out an aiming system gives you the consistencies that are needed to stay at the top.

Often considered the worlds greatest Efren Reyes has an aiming system. SVB, Dax use an aiming system. Even though it is a part of their routine and don't have to think about it, know that they are still using one.
I'm not trying to create any controversies here just stating my opinion.
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Put Corey against any one of those Europeans 9-Ball Rack your own race to 21 on a normal table (not brand new cloth) for the cash and he's going to roast all of them with the potential exception of Daz. He'll pull out a soft break and run rack after rack.

Just because he doesn't use an "aiming system" doesn't mean he misses more than any one of those guys - he can shoot with the best of them. He's run hundreds of balls in straight pool and his mentors were some of the best players of all time (Irving Crane etc). 9/10 Ball is literally the only game these guys could beat Corey at (once again with the exception of Daz) and the race needs to be short.

You don't need an aiming system to play pool. Ask Mika Immonen what his aiming system is - he's one of the best of all time - and he'll tell you he doesn't use one. You can't just name a few names that use systems and "prove" that you MUST use one to play good pool.

Just because some people use one doesn't mean everyone needs to - and furthermore, I'd say many people that did NOT use an aiming system and then tried to start using one went down many speeds because they got into their head too much with how to make balls instead of just letting it be natural.

I can't disagree that Americans have terrible fundamentals, but their games are more focused on gambling matches - where they can eventually get comfortable with the conditions and let their big strokes provide them with outs that most people could not even imagine. The europeans are more focused on tournament style conditions and shorter races where every ball potted counts. Where they play safe instead of going aggressive. Also, gambling matches last many hours and have much less luck involved. The Americans break better and know how to rack better. The conditions of the Mosconi Cup just favor the European style of play greatly.

If you put all these guys in ahead races against each other round robin style on slower cloth and longer matches, I have no doubt the Americans would come out ahead. Once again, the Americans are gamblers who can play many many hours at a high level - even Daz admits he plays poorly in long races (to 50+) it's a totally different way of playing pool - and it's what the Americans excel at. Unfortunately, the Mosconi Cup once again - favors how the Europeans play pool.
 
I say we send 5 players from AZB to the Mosconi next year. After reading most of the posts about the MC, I've targeted about 10-12 people that never miss. Draw 5 names, and you're good to go for next year.
 
randallt6 said:
sky has perfect fundamentals, never any movement from his body and his stroke is straight and smooth. mike d tends to get a big jerky with his stroke which is easier to **** up under the heat.
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Sky has far from perfect fundamentals, but he does not have much body movement.

Daz has the best fundamentals of any of the players playing this year.

Sky has an awkward elbow angle - not something you'd teach, anyway.

Some great players don't have perfect 90 Degree angles on the back arm, but you can't say someone has "perfect fundamentals" unless they do.
 
From what I've seen of the matches, the USA needs to play better defense and take fewer risky shots. For example, that 2 - 9 backcut shot Shane took yesterday against Neils instead of an easy safe was a bad decision in a close match. My observation is the Europeans are more disciplined in this regard. We don't need circus shots, we need wins.
 
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Like i said. At almost 70 i still can get out of the basement.All these players can do is try their best. If you can name one who is not trying name him.Olympians dont all win gold ,but there still Olympians.
 
Interesting. I thought the same thing that under that amount of pressure, for most people it becomes a battle of their B games. And at the moment Europe's team B game is better than USA's. Also agree that fundamentals play a big part. If you have worked on your fundamentals to the point they are second nature, it will show even under great pressure. Else, your mind goes back to the bad habits.

However, I don't agree with Shane's fundamentals being off. His cue does not once move away from the center line. He shoots straight as an arrow. Mike probably has the worst fundamentals in the team.

The positive highlight for me has been Skylar though. Doesn't look like he knows what pressure means. Maybe because he is so young :)
 
Perhaps Europe puts their best players on the team and the US team has personal relationships as a factor of who makes the team.

The first match I watched an American missed a one rail kick. That's not fundamentals, it is lack of ability.
 
jay helfert said:
These guys are all very good players or they wouldnt be here. What I see over and over again is who holds up better under pressure. Thats what makes the biggest difference here. Having a lot of "heart" is what defines the champions every time, the ones who come up with the big shots under pressure.
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Ah -- the old elusive "heart".

So you think those that hold up better under pressure are those with "heart" instead of those with rock solid fundamentals?

Heart is very difficult to define but I can clearly see a difference in technique between those that mange to get through a rack and those that don't.
 
PoolBum said:
I think you mean it's about how well you can play when you're playing poorly.
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That may be a better quote but poorly is probably too strong of a word.

How about -- The Mosconi Cup is NOT about how well you can play but instead it's about how poorly you're capable of playing.
 
randallt6 said:
sky has perfect fundamentals, never any movement from his body and his stroke is straight and smooth. mike d tends to get a big jerky with his stroke which is easier to **** up under the heat.
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Sure agree about Sky's fundamentals....and he has Teflon skin when it comes to pressure. He seems to ignore everything but the table.
 
Pfnatic said:
Interesting. I thought the same thing that under that amount of pressure, for most people it becomes a battle of their B games. And at the moment Europe's team B game is better than USA's. Also agree that fundamentals play a big part. If you have worked on your fundamentals to the point they are second nature, it will show even under great pressure. Else, your mind goes back to the bad habits.

However, I don't agree with Shane's fundamentals being off. His cue does not once move away from the center line. He shoots straight as an arrow. Mike probably has the worst fundamentals in the team.

The positive highlight for me has been Skylar though. Doesn't look like he knows what pressure means. Maybe because he is so young :)
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For Shane, it's not about his cue going offline like it may be with Dechaine. My critique of Shane's fundamentals is in the timing of his cue action. He has such a long stroke, and he does on even the softer struck shots. He pulls his cue back so far and he actually does it too quickly. If you watch his backstroke you can see him pulling the cue back so fast that he has to slow it down on the forward stroke. This causes a bit of a hitch in his transition. I think this is why if he struggles with anything under pressure -- it's with his cue ball control.

This hitch in his stroke is not something anybody would teach to a beginner and it's not something I've noticed with any of the other players in the event.
 
alstl said:
Perhaps Europe puts their best players on the team and the US team has personal relationships as a factor of who makes the team.

The first match I watched an American missed a one rail kick. That's not fundamentals, it is lack of ability.
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Those one rail kick misses were bad, especially where all you had to do was divide the distance in half . You have a billionth inch short of 3 balls across for a target. No excuse for a pro to miss imho.

Next year proficiency in the diamond system should be a requirement for team membership. They weren't too hot with the 3 railers either.
 
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