The Poolhall, "The hustlers and the losers"

[richiebalto]

Bob Seger said it best, which one was you, i know who i was and it wasnt the loser!

Hustler mite not be as dirty as a word as some on here think, its sure better then being the loser!

 

[Tommy Joe]

Bob Seger said it best, which one was you, i know who i was and it wasnt the loser!

Hustler mite not be as dirty as a word as some on here think, its sure better then being the loser!

Just my opinion, but if a person is living in a world where they have to hustle, then in my opinion they are losers even when they win. I'm talking about hard hustling, con-job stuff. I know some are born into it, so good at it I almost respect them. But in my opinion, if a person lives in a world in which they have to hustle on a hard level just to live day to day, then that person is a loser even if all they do is win. Now, matching up, that's a different story. Trying to get the edge, that's ok too. But out and out hustling is different. Some people are proud of their ability to take others down by pretending to be stupid. But in my opinion, if the only way you can win is by pretending to be stupid, you have put yourself in a stupid place, and..................

TJ

TJ

 

[CreeDo]

By that logic, you might as well cheat to win, since winning is more important than 'playing clean'.

 

[Tommy Joe]

By that logic, you might as well cheat to win, since winning is more important than 'playing clean'.

I think everyone would cheat under the right circumstances, especially if they knew no one could ever catch them. I mean, if you could magically steer missed shots into the pockets through sheer psychic wishing - if you could do that, would that be cheating? I think some people don't cheat because they're not good at it. Same with lying. Some people don't lie because they're not good at it. I include myself in that one. It's too much work to lie, same with cheating. I'd rather just lose. If I'm alive the next day I'm a winner. That's the way I see it now. As long as I'm alive and not tied to the radiator in some lunatic's basement I'm a winner.

TJ

 

[Black-Balled]

God, I hate Bob Seger.

 

[D_Lewis]

I've never 'hustled' anyone but I do like to get my money in good.

 

[Banks]

God, I hate Bob Seger.

Be careful what you say..

Rock and roll never forgets. :sorry:

 

[CreeDo]

I think everyone would cheat under the right circumstances, especially if they knew no one could ever catch them. I mean, if you could magically steer missed shots into the pockets through sheer psychic wishing - if you could do that, would that be cheating? I think some people don't cheat because they're not good at it. Same with lying. Some people don't lie because they're not good at it. I include myself in that one. It's too much work to lie, same with cheating. I'd rather just lose. If I'm alive the next day I'm a winner. That's the way I see it now. As long as I'm alive and not tied to the radiator in some lunatic's basement I'm a winner.

TJ

I can't disagree that a lot of people would cheat if they were guaranteed not to get caught.
Way too many people in the world pirating software, rolling stop signs & sneaking candy into the movies
for me to claim "fear of getting caught doesn't play into it"

For me though, I just feel lame if I foul and don't immediately speak up.
Fouling is just a dumb mistake, and I get mad when I make mistakes on the pool table.
Tapping the cue ball will enrage me as much as dogging a simple shot.
I WANT to get punished for it, so I will smarten up and not do it next time.

It never occurred to me to more directly cheat like try to move the balls when someone isn't looking.

Winning that way is obviously not winning so there's no way to take pride in it.
If you can't feel pride, what are you playing for? To make money?
Hard to get rich (or have any fun) with that kind of living.

 

[nahog99]

I have no respect for "hustlers" in the game of pool. Figure out a fair game between the two of you and may the best man win. Hustling is for losers who have no respect for the game. 99% of the time we are talking about, self absorbed, ego-centric, narcissistic, scared to improve douche bags who do nothing but a disservice to the game. All I see when I come across a "hustler" is a scared little piece of shit with little to no faith in themselves, low self-esteem, and a complete lack of pride. **** em.

 

[Banks]

I have no respect for "hustlers" in the game of pool. Figure out a fair game between the two of you and may the best man win. Hustling is for losers who have no respect for the game. 99% of the time we are talking about, self absorbed, ego-centric, narcissistic, scared to improve douche bags who do nothing but a disservice to the game. All I see when I come across a "hustler" is a scared little piece of shit with little to no faith in themselves, low self-esteem, and a complete lack of pride. **** em.

If somebody's that on edge over playing for money;
a) don't play for money
b) don't play those you don't know
c) don't play for money

And why in tarnation do you say "scared to improve"? Most people that really are hustlers are pretty good as it is. Do you also berate the grocery store for placing things near the check-out, putting certain items at eye level, playing music or jacking around the prices?

 

[nahog99]

If somebody's that on edge over playing for money;
a) don't play for money
b) don't play those you don't know
c) don't play for money

And why in tarnation do you say "scared to improve"? Most people that really are hustlers are pretty good as it is. Do you also berate the grocery store for placing things near the check-out, putting certain items at eye level, playing music or jacking around the prices?

How many times you find a hustler playing someone BETTER than they are in an even race? I do all the time because it makes me better. In my opinion the hustlers are the ones on edge over playing for money. If they weren't they why all the bullshit lying and throwing off to try and get as much money as possible out of their opponent? My pride is worth more to me than a few dollars and I am not going to stoop to the level of throwing off just so I can win a little money.

Also I just want to clarify here, I am NOT talking about people working out some kind of a spot. There are a million different levels of skill in this game and many times something needs to be worked out. I'm talking about the people that come in in groups, lose to each other, throw off, shark their opponent, cheat, etc etc etc.

 

[CJ Wiley]

"Hustler" is a dirty word?

Bob Seger said it best, which one was you, i know who i was and it wasnt the loser!

Hustler mite not be as dirty as a word as some on here think, its sure better then being the loser!

How could anyone possibly think "Hustler" is a dirty word?

 

[rayjay]

I have fun. I'm not as big a sucker as some think I am, and I get my licks in on more than a few occasions, regularly. I've never been a "loser", always see it as a work in progress although a few times were pretty painful, and a "winner" every moment of my life (except just a couple moments when I had a doubt or two).
:grin:

 

[MahnaMahna]

Richie,

Please correct your thread title. It should be:

The Poolhall: The hustlers, the losers, and the rest of the room laughing at those pathetic jackasses..

Thanks.

PS- Sorry your thread failed.

 

[scratchs]

I can't disagree that a lot of people would cheat if they were guaranteed not to get caught.
Way too many people in the world pirating software, rolling stop signs & sneaking candy into the movies
for me to claim "fear of getting caught doesn't play into it"

For me though, I just feel lame if I foul and don't immediately speak up.
Fouling is just a dumb mistake, and I get mad when I make mistakes on the pool table.
Tapping the cue ball will enrage me as much as dogging a simple shot.
I WANT to get punished for it, so I will smarten up and not do it next time.

It never occurred to me to more directly cheat like try to move the balls when someone isn't looking.

Winning that way is obviously not winning so there's no way to take pride in it.
If you can't feel pride, what are you playing for? To make money?
Hard to get rich (or have any fun) with that kind of living.

WHAT....? I can't sneak candy into the movies..! whats this world coming to..lol.

 

[Tommy Joe]

I can't disagree that a lot of people would cheat if they were guaranteed not to get caught.
Way too many people in the world pirating software, rolling stop signs & sneaking candy into the movies
for me to claim "fear of getting caught doesn't play into it"

For me though, I just feel lame if I foul and don't immediately speak up.
Fouling is just a dumb mistake, and I get mad when I make mistakes on the pool table.
Tapping the cue ball will enrage me as much as dogging a simple shot.
I WANT to get punished for it, so I will smarten up and not do it next time.

It never occurred to me to more directly cheat like try to move the balls when someone isn't looking.

Winning that way is obviously not winning so there's no way to take pride in it.
If you can't feel pride, what are you playing for? To make money?
Hard to get rich (or have any fun) with that kind of living.

I don't like cheating or lying. I have made a point of putting myself in a place in life where I don't need to lie. I don't want much. But the subject intrigues me - cheating and lying and so forth - the morality issue. I often wonder, even about myself, maybe most about myself - am I a non liar and a non cheat because I'm a nice guy, or am I a non liar and a non cheat because I don't have the guts to be either one?

Of course I was referring to life and death situations when I said anyone would cheat. Imagine (go overboard if necessary) being hauled into court on a charge you cannot refute without lying. The truth is not good enough. Very unlikely, but it could happen. I'm sure there is a point where anybody would cheat. But where I frown most on cheating is we do it to ourselves. I'm too egotistical to cheat. Although when I was younger I remember taking multiple IQ tests (without cheating on any one test individually), one after the other, each time gaining knowledge for the next test. So even though I didn't cheat the test, certainly I was cheating myself by taking one test after the other until finally I was able to use the number of the test on which I scored highest. I'm a god damn genius, man! Anyway, beyond pool or any game, just in general, the subject of lying and cheating intrigues me, the morality aspect of it.

And that's no lie,

TJ

 

[Tommy Joe]

I have no respect for "hustlers" in the game of pool. Figure out a fair game between the two of you and may the best man win. Hustling is for losers who have no respect for the game. 99% of the time we are talking about, self absorbed, ego-centric, narcissistic, scared to improve douche bags who do nothing but a disservice to the game. All I see when I come across a "hustler" is a scared little piece of shit with little to no faith in themselves, low self-esteem, and a complete lack of pride. **** em.

I agree, I don't care for them either. But in fairness I have to say not everyone is brought up the same way. Some people are born into environments requiring them to hustle hard from a young age. Not making excuses for them, just an observation. I don't like hard hustling either and I also don't consider it hustling to match up and get the edge. Somebody's got to win. I was always broke when I was young, so I had my fling with trying to lay down to get games against people who could hardly play, and I hated every minute of it. I stunk at it too. It would bring my game down. I am admitting I did it a few times, but I never made it my life, or even a short term habit. I'm the sort who would rather sell his body on the street (years ago my friend, years ago), than con someone out of money. Some whores are honest, so for them I have more respect than I do for hustlers. At the same time, disgustingly, while I have no respect for hustlers, I can see when someone is really good at it and acknowledge it in an almost respectful way. I'm just glad I wasn't brought up needing to do it.

Oh, one more thing - sorry. Do you consider it ugly hustling when two guys go into a poolroom and one of them plays and loses, then they come back the next day and everyone is lined up to bet again, only this time the other guy plays and wins? That is hustling, but it's sort of a 'tweener' type of hustling because the regulars who waited around for the players to come back were looking to take them off again. I'm not saying I like that either, but I've seen some good ones pulled off and marveled at how patient they were, to come in and lose and have the faith that when they return they'll take down the cash. Anyway, I suppose it's one of those issues where everyone draws the line at not exactly the same place. There are degrees to everything. Now with all this bullcrap coming out of my mouth I feel like I'm hustling myself.

TJ

 

[(((Satori)))]

Nevermind...

 

[Tommy Joe]

If somebody's that on edge over playing for money;
a) don't play for money
b) don't play those you don't know
c) don't play for money

And why in tarnation do you say "scared to improve"? Most people that really are hustlers are pretty good as it is. Do you also berate the grocery store for placing things near the check-out, putting certain items at eye level, playing music or jacking around the prices?

See now, I like this more than discussing pool itself, the subject of what is and is not moral. It's interesting. When I lived in L.A. a friend and I put out a pro football tout sheet that my friend (he had the car), would take to magazine stands to be sold at consignment. I did most of the writing. Our sheet was a cheap cardboard cover with a xeroxed silhouette of OJ Simpson running with the ball. We got some stencils and penciled in the lettering. Not a bad job. Then we xeroxed a bunch of them. The mag itself was maybe two type-written pages of game previews and outrageous predictions.

Anyway, we only did it for one season, but one day my buddy got a call from two guys who had won using our picks. They invited us to a party in Pasadena. It was on the up and up. As we were preparing to leave in my buddy's car I told him, "Now remember, if anybody wants any predictions about this week's games, you're the game guy, I'm just the writer."

My buddy says, "Wha'dya mean?"

I said, "I mean, I'm just the writer, you're the guy making the picks, especially if they ask about college games." At least on the pro games I genuinely believed I knew who was going to win or lose and was egotistical enough to believe I'd be right most of the time..

But my buddy says again, 'Yeah, but what do you mean?"

I told him, 'I mean, I don't want to lie to them."

There's this pause before my buddy says, "You mean, to their face?"

I broke up laughing. My buddy got me. He knew. We both laughed after that. My buddy had a great sense of humor. He's been dead for 20 years now and his humor is still greatly missed. But it is true, doing it to the face and doing it unseen, there is definitely a difference yet it could be said they're the same damn thing.

TJ

 

[Tommy Joe]

Richie,

Please correct your thread title. It should be:

The Poolhall: The hustlers, the losers, and the rest of the room laughing at those pathetic jackasses..

Thanks.

PS- Sorry your thread failed.

I don't see any failure, but you could be right. As for the hustlers and losers and the rest of the room, they're all in the same boat, aren't they? One night at Hollywood Billiards I was listening to another boring debate between The Boa and The Swamp Rat about who between them had won more money over time. The Boa played for anything, even 50 cents a game, but would choke the cash out of them slowly, and if he lost he never lost much. The Swamp Rat played for higher stakes against stronger players but would lose now and then. These two clowns were arguing over who made the most money over time when I got tired of it and turned to them and asked both of them how much money they had in their pockets right now. To me, if losing money produces a good story or a good lesson, it has more value than any amount of money a person has won, especially if he doesn't have it anymore.

TJ