I say you should play with whatever equipment you think you like the best. Your friends don't have to like it.
this is fuct
- Thread starter Beware_of_Dawg
- Start date
you play with what you are comfortable with. why do you think there are so many different versions of tips out there. have you tried a super pro tip? or why not just have a phonelic tip put on one of your other player shafts, z, ob, josey, whatever if you liek the hard tip so much?
Superpro Milkdud in a vice for three days, or soak in glue for a day, then put on.
If that isn't hard enough for ya, your definately fuct.
Although if it's any consolation, I bought a fancy break cue from Picone- HEAVY- with a phenolic tip.
I was trying it out at league and a guy saw it, fell in love with it, tried hitting with it and bought it.
He never changed the tip, and was placing high in tournaments in less than two weeks of getting it.
He played with it constantly and I've watched him run out racks with it on various sized tables. He even played snooker with us using it.
So maybe you aren't alone....
I know of one other person that could shoot well before, but shot better with something other than leather.
shrug.
Anyone on here from NW Colorado know Hippie Chris?
If so, you know what I'm talking about.
So I guess if it works, go with it, but that would put you into a whole new calibre of player that I'm not messing with!:grin-square:
If that isn't hard enough for ya, your definately fuct.
Although if it's any consolation, I bought a fancy break cue from Picone- HEAVY- with a phenolic tip.
I was trying it out at league and a guy saw it, fell in love with it, tried hitting with it and bought it.
He never changed the tip, and was placing high in tournaments in less than two weeks of getting it.
He played with it constantly and I've watched him run out racks with it on various sized tables. He even played snooker with us using it.
So maybe you aren't alone....
I know of one other person that could shoot well before, but shot better with something other than leather.
shrug.
Anyone on here from NW Colorado know Hippie Chris?
If so, you know what I'm talking about.
So I guess if it works, go with it, but that would put you into a whole new calibre of player that I'm not messing with!:grin-square:
Thats what I was thinking.
SACRILEGE!!!!!! Don't even think about it. I would hope that Kieth would personally drive to the poolroom, snatch it out of the player's hands, replace it with a Travis Trotter model Cue-tec, fix his, and donate it to a charitable raffle, lol.
Have you ever thought that it not your TIP that is creating such an issue for yourself. I look at it like this, You play very well with a hard tip but not some much any tip on your LD Shafts.. You say the everest is too soft. Have you ever tried shaping that tip? They are constructed in a manner to where the tip istself is hard up has a medium hit to it. The tiger tips are all strange animals. But then you go back to shooting with a break cue or break cue shaft and have no problems. Maybe just maybe you need a stiffer shaft for your playing cue, maybe just maybe it's the LD shafts giving you your problems. Once your mind adjusted back to what most us learned with and most of the time go back to, a standard shaft. On your break cue you have at least a 13mm tip, right? and then you go trying to switch back to a 12.75mm or 11.75mm tip. If you absolutly must use an LD shaft try the Predator Fat Shaft. all in all this is just speculation. All I am asking is how much can a tip really have when you are at a certain level. House Cue to whatever it shouldn't matter. Way to many people overthink there equipment. Why not take a step back and see what the reall issues here are. When you are shooting with a tip as hard as a Phenolic, more than likely you are slowing your stroke down concentrating on the shoot more and that's why you shoot better with it. It's not the cue bud it is you.
I tried it tonight just to see what it would do. I got the same result. I played the best that I have shot in a long time.
After a while, I realized that it was because the tip was not putting anything on the cue ball. I have a tendancy to "overenglish", so that really made me stop and think about my shot choices... Maybe it is a great practice tool.
After a while, I realized that it was because the tip was not putting anything on the cue ball. I have a tendancy to "overenglish", so that really made me stop and think about my shot choices... Maybe it is a great practice tool.
I just put a tip on my cue that is the 2nd hardest leather I have ever seen. I am testing the thing...so far it is doing great...Day 1. Most real hard tips give up by now this one is a fighter. I could tell on the lathe that it was a fighter...I will break it. I just need more time. I have given it a pretty good run so far it has held up we will see how it does in Vegas before I give my public review. I have only had one kind of tip last through Vegas.
The hardest leather tip I ever saw was some tip Jerry Powers invented. It was insanely hard...If you want try leather again and you want some crazy hard leather tip then call Jerry. Tell him I sent you so you can try and tell him who I am again. He gets so caught up in his own work he is totally oblivious to us little guys.
If I were you and you feel that fanolic is the key, then stick with it. I think the day will come when you go back to leather but, if not, take pride in the fact that you found something that works for you...
The hardest leather tip I ever saw was some tip Jerry Powers invented. It was insanely hard...If you want try leather again and you want some crazy hard leather tip then call Jerry. Tell him I sent you so you can try and tell him who I am again. He gets so caught up in his own work he is totally oblivious to us little guys.
If I were you and you feel that fanolic is the key, then stick with it. I think the day will come when you go back to leather but, if not, take pride in the fact that you found something that works for you...
I guess I'm in the minority, but.. I do seriously think that you're holding yourself back a little with a funky hard tip.
Yes, you can work around it and get up to a decent speed using it, but you're fighting against the laws of physics here... and the law will win. It's not just a case of 'different strokes for different folks'... some levels of hardness make sense for general shooting and some don't. Phenolic hardness doesn't. I don't know how to prove it to you, I just sense it's true. You want a little action in your tip and you want it spongy enough to hold chalk.
I don't think you gave yourself enough time going back to a regular tip. It sounds like you went back to leather after just two weeks (vs 2+ months with the phenolic). You're like the guy who quit smoking and then caves in and takes "just a drag" from a buddy's smoke and now he's gonna be hooked again.
When I hear that "the proof is in the pudding" stuff, I just want to cry because it sounds so familiar. It reminds me of when n00bs want to bank a ball, and I tell them "learn to cut the ball" or "play safe"... and they decide to take the wrong shot anyway and make it. "See! The bank was the right play anyway, because I made it!"
The wrong tip is the wrong tip even if you run a rack or two with it >_< There are guys that can run racks with umbrellas but that doesn't "prove" that an umbrella is their best weapon of choice.
Yes, you can work around it and get up to a decent speed using it, but you're fighting against the laws of physics here... and the law will win. It's not just a case of 'different strokes for different folks'... some levels of hardness make sense for general shooting and some don't. Phenolic hardness doesn't. I don't know how to prove it to you, I just sense it's true. You want a little action in your tip and you want it spongy enough to hold chalk.
I don't think you gave yourself enough time going back to a regular tip. It sounds like you went back to leather after just two weeks (vs 2+ months with the phenolic). You're like the guy who quit smoking and then caves in and takes "just a drag" from a buddy's smoke and now he's gonna be hooked again.
When I hear that "the proof is in the pudding" stuff, I just want to cry because it sounds so familiar. It reminds me of when n00bs want to bank a ball, and I tell them "learn to cut the ball" or "play safe"... and they decide to take the wrong shot anyway and make it. "See! The bank was the right play anyway, because I made it!"
The wrong tip is the wrong tip even if you run a rack or two with it >_< There are guys that can run racks with umbrellas but that doesn't "prove" that an umbrella is their best weapon of choice.
I think perhaps the phenolic tip worked for you because you tend to juice the ball, and the phenolic greatly reduced how much english was actually put on the CB. I have no problem playing with my Barnhart break shaft, and and found out the reason for that is because with it Im shooting center ball a lot more and using stop shots and running english instead of juicing up whitey to get it to go where I want.
Shafts
It seems you only play with Predator or OB-1 shafts and I think if you want a shaft that gives you feedback you need a solid maple shaft. I know they deflect a lot more but they aren't hollow at the top and will not have that dead squishy feeling.
I also think those LD shafts are spinning the sh-t out of the ball and you can't control it and it is making you uncomfortable. I would have a cuemaker make me a rock hard maple shaft 13mm. Something that feels like a truck when you hit the cue ball, Tascarella comes to mind. Those type of shafts talk to you and give you the feedback you are looking for. I would also make sure the cue had a steel joint in your case.
The LD shafts are great for low deflection but feedback not so much
It seems you only play with Predator or OB-1 shafts and I think if you want a shaft that gives you feedback you need a solid maple shaft. I know they deflect a lot more but they aren't hollow at the top and will not have that dead squishy feeling.
I also think those LD shafts are spinning the sh-t out of the ball and you can't control it and it is making you uncomfortable. I would have a cuemaker make me a rock hard maple shaft 13mm. Something that feels like a truck when you hit the cue ball, Tascarella comes to mind. Those type of shafts talk to you and give you the feedback you are looking for. I would also make sure the cue had a steel joint in your case.
The LD shafts are great for low deflection but feedback not so much
I don't disagree with the above statement. I do "juice" the ball quite a bit and the reduced spin is much more predictable. Yet, I have a stroke that has plenty of juice to spare so I can easily produce enough english/spin with the phenolic to accompish any shape nessasary. Furthermore as some may have mentioned the fact that it doesnt take as much effort to get the ball around the table because the ball "pops" off the tip also allows me to use a slower more deliberate stroke.
I gave this a great deal of thought over the last few days and I do understand (the physics of) what is happening and why. BUt this does not change the fact, and this may sound weird but... this tip allowed me to hit an unconscious gear which feels effortless. Not control the balls, COMMAND the balls. When describing a baseball pitcher there are 2 terms which sound similar but are VERY different. Command and Control.
Control which almost all "advanced" pool players have is controlling the Qball, or in baseball control is just being able to control your various pitches and be able to throw them for strikes. Command is much more fine tuned. Not only can you throw your pitches for strikes (or make your shots, with various englishes) you can decide where in the strike zone you want the ball to go. So not only can I throw a curveball, slider or changeup (power draw, left stun, or two rail kick) for a strike, I can throw it exactly where I want to in the strike zone. I "see" the path the cueball is going to take, clearly. Not a general idea which way it was going to go and how far it would travel.. I could visualize exactly what I intended the balls to do and exactly where they would go. I don't know if this makes sense to any of you... I'm trying to explain it the best way I can. Does this make sense?
I intend of changing the tip (again) on the OB1 which fits the Josey. I am going to resist using a phenolic tip and try one of the various superhard leather tips, either the superpro which many of you recommend or one of the break tips mentioned. I noticed that Samsara makes a great break tip made of 100% leather. I may give that a try.
The BK2 is a LD shaft. It was 12.35mm at the tip. I don't go over 12.5mm. If it's larger, I get it turned down.
The BK2 is a low deflection shaft.
I have a solid maple shaft, the orginal Josey shaft I have is pure hard rock maple and Josey cues are often recognized for the solid, heavy hit. The maple shaft doesn't give me the feedback you mention and the deflection is very difficult to manage having played with LD shafts for 5+ years.
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hey Dawg sorry I just tried to help you out, obviously you were meant to just shoot with a phenolic tip and an alerted break shaft which has a very strong taper not a playing taper. If you ever need anything just ask bud, but I do apologize for trying to help you out, won't happen again...
<---- Scratching his head
<---- Scratching his head
Say what???
I don't think I snapped at you or anything did I? I was just clarifying the type of shaft & tip size the BK2 was.
I appreciate the feedback & attempt to offer advice. If I didn't want some dialog about my situation I wouldn't have posted it here for discussion... Again, I appreciate that you took the time to offer an opinion about this.
~D4\/\/G~
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