Time to Vent

mooseman

mooseman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Here's the scenario...

I'm playing in an 8-ball tourney on the one loss side. It's a short race to 4. My opponent is on the hill and I have 2 wins. While I am shooting my opponent goes over to the next table in my peripheral vision and starts banging balls around HARD. I play my next shot and make it. He continues. This time I ask him to stop before I play my next shot. He does but replies, "I'm keeping warmed up".

I have two balls and the eight left on the table. My next shot rattled up in the pocket and I end up with perfect position for my final ball. He came to the table and ran out. I take 4th place and he goes on to finally win the tournament.

Now I have been accused in the past of slow play. I guess I don't see it because I am concentrating/focused on the game. There is no shot clock.

I guess this is all part of the game, my opponent temporarily took my mind off the game and got me to verbally interact with him. Should this have made a difference? No. Did I get sharked? Yes. Was it deliberate on his part? Maybe, in a serial killer kind of way. You know... when the neighbors are interviewed about the killer. He's such a nice guy we didn't suspect a thing.

The good thing is I was playing well. I was not playing in dead stroke but I was playing tough and my opponents had to beat me in order to win. If he had to use such deliberate tactics means he was worried about me even though he was on the hill. NOTE: I did put him in the one loss side.

OK I feel better now.....
 
I don't know what set of rules ya'll are using, but playing on another table while you're suppose to be in your chair is unsportsmanlike conduct and should be addressed immediately.
 
Well, what did you learn from this experience?

When you miss a shot, what do you do?
Do you analyze the root cause of the missed shot?

Why not use that same mentality to learn for this experience.
What could you have done differently to overcome this issue?

My thoughts:
You could have asked the Tournament Director to make a ruling as to whether that kind of behavior is acceptable or not.
If the TD takes no action, then you could just stand there staring at him until he stops.

In my opinion, the best mode of thinking, is to see the distraction as a challenge that you must overcome.

Just to make myself clear, I am totally on your side. There are so many players out there that are so shameful. There should be mandatory classes on pool etiquette.

I was playing in a money game, and we were getting bumped by people during our shots. Distractions are one thing.....but when idiots are bumping into the back of your cue....that is inexcusable. I told the guy I had to quit and leave before I hurt somebody. We went from run out 9 ball, to not being able to run 3 balls in row because of all the morons around us...and most of them were league players.
 
okinawa77 said:
Well, what did you learn from this experience?

When you miss a shot, what do you do?
Do you analyze the root cause of the missed shot?

Why not use that same mentality to learn for this experience.
What could you have done differently to overcome this issue?

My thoughts:
You could have asked the Tournament Director to make a ruling as to whether that kind of behavior is acceptable or not.
If the TD takes no action, then you could just stand there staring at him until he stops.

In my opinion, the best mode of thinking, is to see the distraction as a challenge that you must overcome.

Just to make myself clear, I am totally on your side. There are so many players out there that are so shameful. There should be mandatory classes on pool etiquette.

I was playing in a money game, and we were getting bumped by people during our shots. Distractions are one thing.....but when idiots are bumping into the back of your cue....that is inexcusable. I told the guy I had to quit and leave before I hurt somebody. We went from run out 9 ball, to not being able to run 3 balls in row because of all the morons around us...and most of them were league players.
Click to expand...

I learn from most experiences. I am also accused of overanalysing my play.

I just needed to vent. Next time I will just go and sit down until he's finished however in that case I would still be sharked. Also hopefully this person reads this but I guess it doesn't really matter since I suspect it was deliberate.
 
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Official BCAPL response

May not be appropriate here, but just in case anyone was wondering...

Foul under BCAPL Rule 1.8. No ambiguity - the act as described by OP was practice as defined under the rule. The current BCAPL rules have been amended to eliminate the progressive penalties of loss of game/match for subsequent violations; each subsequent violation is a foul. However, UC could still come into play based on the ref/TD's judgment of the intent during subsequent violations.

For WSR, probably UC under Rule 6.16(e), although WSR does not define the word "practice". Still, under WSR any right-minded ref/TD could (and IMHO should), at a minimum, stop the action and issue a warning, if not specifically because of practice then because of general UC.

Buddy Eick
BCAPL National Head Referee (WOW!! very humbled to be promoted :grin: )
BCAPL Director of Referee Training
Technical Editor, BCAPL Rule Book
bcapl_referee@cox.net

Find the Official Rules of the BCA Pool League here:

http://www.playbca.com/Downloads/Rul...2/Default.aspx

* The contents of this post refer to BCA Pool League (BCAPL) Rules only. The BCAPL National Office has authorized me to act in an official capacity regarding questions about BCAPL Rules matters in public forums.
* Neither I nor any BCAPL referee make any policy decisions regarding BCAPL Rules. Any and all decisions, interpretations, or Applied Rulings are made by the BCAPL National Office and are solely their responsibility. BCAPL referees are enforcers of rules, not legislators. BCAPL Rules 9.4.3 and 9.4.4 apply.
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* The BCAPL has not addressed every imaginable rules issue, nor will it ever likely be able to, as evidenced by the seemingly endless situations that people dream up or that (more frequently) actually happen. If I do not have the answer to a question I will tell you so, then I will get a ruling from the BCAPL National Office and get back to you as soon as I can. If deemed necessary, the BCAPL will then add the ruling to the "Applied Rulings" section of The Official Rules of the BCA Pool League.
 
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mooseman said:
I learn from most experiences. I am also accused of overanalysing my play.

I just needed to vent. Next time I will just go and sit down until he's finished however in that case I would still be sharked. Also hopefully this person reads this but I guess it doesn't really matter since I suspect it was deliberate.
Click to expand...

I hear you, man.
I know how you feel, and I'm sure there are a lot of other players that can empathize.

As far as over analyzing....if your are analyzing your stroke, then that is a problem......but if you are analyzing the strategy aspect, then don't listen to that "over analyzation" comment.

You can never over analyze on strategy. You can look at any given shot, and come up with endless possibilities. Find the best one that comes to mind, that has the best probability of success...for you and your capabilities. Then, get down and execute it.

But don't analyze your stroke, that should be automatic from your endless hours of training and practice.
 
Situation

There are only 2 reasons why he would have done this:

1) He became bored waiting on you to shoot.
2) To shark you into missing.

Now, are you an exceedingly slow player? (took longer than 1 minute to shoot the shot). If yes, he became bored, otherwise he wanted you to miss because you would have been on the hill if you ran out, and then who's break would it be on the rubber game?

I would told him to stop it, and park his a** in a chair until I finished shooting.
 
okinawa77...Great response! The key thing (as you know) is not to be changing your mind or your strategy, while you are down on the shot. Those decisions MUST be made standing up, to have the best possible outcome. Remember, we only have 8-10 seconds, once our bridge hand hits the table, to get the shot off, without the subconscious mind interfering.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

okinawa77 said:
You can never over analyze on strategy. You can look at any given shot, and come up with endless possibilities. Find the best one that comes to mind, that has the best probability of success...for you and your capabilities. Then, get down and execute it.
Click to expand...
 
I think it's rude but it's hard to say if it's rude in a careless way (like when someone whistles and they have no idea how annoying it is), or rude in the old fashioned way (you're aware it might be a distraction but you don't give a crap) or intentional sharking (he didn't really even feel like hitting balls).

My first guess is the 2nd one, anyone who plays even a little serious has to know it's gonna distract you, but that maybe wasn't his goal.

I'd have let it ride, even though I sometimes get the 'delayed shark' reaction you're talking about, where stuff someone did in the past can shark me even a couple of shots later cuz I'm still upset they'd be so rude.
 
If you ever play him again, just return the favor and see how much he likes your routine for keeping warmed up.

Though some might think it is childish to retaliate against such behavior, but I think if he is being a douche about it and you are going to keep your posture but have your game ruined by it, shark on.

I hate it when people pull little things like that. If I were in your position, I would've simply stop shooting since there were no shot clock, and not make another shot until he sits his behind back in his warm chair. I would literally tell him, I will not make another shot until you sit down in your chair and I have all the time in the world. If he complains to the TD about it, let's see who the TD would side with.
 
chin0 said:
If you ever play him again, just return the favor and see how much he likes your routine for keeping warmed up.

Though some might think it is childish to retaliate against such behavior, but I think if he is being a douche about it and you are going to keep your posture but have your game ruined by it, shark on.

I hate it when people pull little things like that. If I were in your position, I would've simply stop shooting since there were no shot clock, and not make another shot until he sits his behind back in his warm chair. I would literally tell him, I will not make another shot until you sit down in your chair and I have all the time in the world. If he complains to the TD about it, let's see who the TD would side with.
Click to expand...

This is the second tournament I've played against him in. Prior to this I would have said he is a nice guy. I have filed this information into my memory bank and next time I play him I will be even better prepared to play him or anyone else for that matter.

If it happens again I will simply wait him out like you suggest. I will just let him shark himself. The last thing I will do is let it bother me again........:wink::wink::wink:
 
mooseman said:
If it happens again I will simply wait him out like you suggest. I will just let him shark himself. The last thing I will do is let it bother me again........:wink::wink::wink:
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mooseman,

Take a page from the Tiger Woods School. If a player on a table next to you is banging balls and that distracts you, you are not concentrating on YOUR game. Tiger's dad used to do everything possible to distract him while he prepared to swing or putt. You either learn to shut that crap out or, as another poster suggested, stop and stare. It works just fine. I prefer not to see or hear anything while I'm at the table. It's difficult but as anyone with ADD will tell you, you'll find a way.

Lyn
 
cardiac kid said:
mooseman,

Take a page from the Tiger Woods School. If a player on a table next to you is banging balls and that distracts you, you are not concentrating on YOUR game. Tiger's dad used to do everything possible to distract him while he prepared to swing or putt. You either learn to shut that crap out or, as another poster suggested, stop and stare. It works just fine. I prefer not to see or hear anything while I'm at the table. It's difficult but as anyone with ADD will tell you, you'll find a way.

Lyn
Click to expand...

Normally it doesn't bother me. Yes it is annoying. In this case it was my OPPONENT in that match banging the balls. Several times that day, if there was a distraction (ie person walking or excessive movement close to the table), I would stand back up, go through my preshot routine, focus, and continue. In this case when he continued after I played my shot I asked him to stop. He did comply but made comments. NOTE: I even stepped away from the table to regather my composure and continued my routine. I rattled my next shot in the pocket with PERFECT position on my key ball. He cooly came up and ran the table out for the win. If I had won it would have been Hill - Hill, him breaking. Who can tell what the result might have been in that case........?????
 
What would you have done if it wasn't your opponent?

Haven't you ever played when other people were "playing" on a adjacent table?

Apparently he wasn't watching your game. It may not really be sportsman like but if you miss and he is not watching just keep playing as if you made your shot. If you get caught just play dumb and say that you thought that you slopped another ball in. :rotflmao1: Or if you made a bad hit or foul don't acknowledge it. :shrug:
 
TheBook said:
What would you have done if it wasn't your opponent?

Haven't you ever played when other people were "playing" on a adjacent table?

Apparently he wasn't watching your game. It may not really be sportsman like but if you miss and he is not watching just keep playing as if you made your shot. If you get caught just play dumb and say that you thought that you slopped another ball in. :rotflmao1: Or if you made a bad hit or foul don't acknowledge it. :shrug:
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LMFAO you are something else man lol. This started my day off with a good laugh :thumbup:
 
TheBook said:
What would you have done if it wasn't your opponent?

Haven't you ever played when other people were "playing" on a adjacent table?

Apparently he wasn't watching your game. It may not really be sportsman like but if you miss and he is not watching just keep playing as if you made your shot. If you get caught just play dumb and say that you thought that you slopped another ball in. :rotflmao1: Or if you made a bad hit or foul don't acknowledge it. :shrug:
Click to expand...

Of course I've played with other people playing on an adjacent table. If they are playing a match I let them get on with it. If they aren't playing in an actual match and they are BANGING balls around, I will ask if they can move to a different table or talk with the TD.

I would like to think I don't have to stoop so low. My integrity is too important to me. IF I do something that sharks you it is usually unintentional. I have been accused in the past of moving but that is only if you shoot quickly and I don't have time to move out of your line-of-sight. I will normally stand to one side or behind you where I can observe your shot (looking for the foul). If a chair is available I will sit quietly in my chair (maybe rolling my eyes or beating myself up for missing). Will I tell you you have BIH, NO, but if you ask me I will say yes. If you ask me what balls do I have or if the table is open I will tell you as a courtesy.
 
I feel for ya man, i got sharked this weekend. My opponent pulled the "where you going?" bs right in midstroke. This a&*hole was barely paying attention as i was running out and knew he was beat. I rattled the shot, got perfect shape on the 8, and got knocked out of the tourney. Had i won that game, our team was in the semi-finals. I wanted to drill that ....oh well. Next time, i'll ignore him and let him know where i'm going as the ball drops.
 
I was down on a shot in a league tournament a few years back. I was playing a guy rated the same level as me but whom I had beat a couple times recently and whom had never beat me. Something distracted me while down and aiming but I shook it off.... and then my teams "ACE" player jumped up and loudly made the case that my opponent was sharking! He had been walking around the end of the table, holding the rack as I was about to run the last two balls and he had tapped the edge of the table a couple of times.

Our Ace got the TD and it was ruled loss of game. I won the match on his foul and our team won the tournament and the year end $$$$$$.
 
I love a story...

JimS said:
I was down on a shot in a league tournament a few years back. I was playing a guy rated the same level as me but whom I had beat a couple times recently and whom had never beat me. Something distracted me while down and aiming but I shook it off.... and then my teams "ACE" player jumped up and loudly made the case that my opponent was sharking! He had been walking around the end of the table, holding the rack as I was about to run the last two balls and he had tapped the edge of the table a couple of times.

Our Ace got the TD and it was ruled loss of game. I won the match on his foul and our team won the tournament and the year end $$$$$$.
Click to expand...

where the good guys win and it's a happy ending!! :)

td
 
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