To jump or kick?

oldplayer

oldplayer

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Years ago I jumped with a playing cue and was successful in making the shot 50%+ of the time but making shape was always questionable. in the past 5 years I have concentrated on kicking more so and while I am not trying to make the ball as much as playing a safety (never ever played safeties back in the 70s or 80s) now the jump cue has come into play.....IMHO with the same results I had. not very good success even from the pros, at least from what I have seen on the streams the last couple of years. it seems the pros, while making the ball 50% of the time, experience the same problem I had, hardly ever making shape on the next shot. in the local pool hall the cb or ob leaves the table 50% of the time. yet, day after day, the local players are pulling out their jump cue to no avail. I personally have found that kicking is a higher percentage of success, whatever that may be, make the shot or play a safety...buying a jump cue is not in my future plans....what have you found to be the case?
 
I can make contact with the OB roughly 80% of the time, by kicking. I can also make contact with the OB roughly 60% of the time, by jumping. That being said, there has to be give and take. No player, that I know of, can kick balls in everytime and get shape. I use my jump cue when I want to and I kick when I want to.

IMO, jump cues are fine and practicing kick shots is important.
 
A decent jump cue can be find with only 50$, so this is not a big deal.

I jump, when object ball is close to the pocket, or in straight line, in other words if is a good chance to make the pot I'll take jump, in other situations I use kick.
 
Like most shots it depends on where the next ball is. Why try to jump a ball if its a shot to nothing? Wont matter much if you make the jump and have no shot on the next ball. Better to kick at it and try to separate the cue ball and whatever you're shooting at. Unless its pretty easy to jump and have easy shape.
 
oldplayer said:
Years ago I jumped with a playing cue and was successful in making the shot 50%+ of the time but making shape was always questionable. in the past 5 years I have concentrated on kicking more so and while I am not trying to make the ball as much as playing a safety (never ever played safeties back in the 70s or 80s) now the jump cue has come into play.....IMHO with the same results I had. not very good success even from the pros, at least from what I have seen on the streams the last couple of years. it seems the pros, while making the ball 50% of the time, experience the same problem I had, hardly ever making shape on the next shot. in the local pool hall the cb or ob leaves the table 50% of the time. yet, day after day, the local players are pulling out their jump cue to no avail. I personally have found that kicking is a higher percentage of success, whatever that may be, make the shot or play a safety...buying a jump cue is not in my future plans....what have you found to be the case?
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I personally have not found numbers even remotely close to yours for anyone that is at least half way decent with a jump cue.

That being said, I choose what ever shot I feel I can reasonably be expected to execute. 50% is pretty bad odds for any choice in my opinion so I wonder exactly what scenerios your getting yourself into but even then, I'll take a jump to make a shot with a 50% chance of shape and keeping the table vs kicking and 50% chance of shape all day long.

It does sound like the people in your hall should not be jumping at all if what you say is true about 50% leaving the table so they are probably not a great pool of reference to pull odds from.

Bottom line is I do what I know I can do and worry little about everyone else.

;)
 
By far, most people treat jumping and kicking with the same attitude that beginners take on open shots. That is, just try and hit the ball with the cb. And, if they manage to do that, they feel they are successful.

Shape can be played off jump shots and kick shots. But, just like in open shots, it takes a lot of practice to be able to do it. Most quit practicing when they can just hit the ball.
 
I jump like a frog

Learn how to Jump/kick by juming CB with running english to clear obstructing ball ,then go 1-3 rails for the hit. Learn to jump with stop and draw. I just like to mske peopl sick when they get me safe 3 inches behibd a ball and I clear it, make a ball an run out. It gets them to shoot more and play less safes.
 
RRfireblade said:
I personally have not found numbers even remotely close to yours for anyone that is at least half way decent with a jump cue.

That being said, I choose what ever shot I feel I can reasonably be expected to execute. 50% is pretty bad odds for any choice in my opinion so I wonder exactly what scenerios your getting yourself into but even then, I'll take a jump to make a shot with a 50% chance of shape and keeping the table vs kicking and 50% chance of shape all day long.

It does sound like the people in your hall should not be jumping at all if what you say is true about 50% leaving the table so they are probably not a great pool of reference to pull odds from.

Bottom line is I do what I know I can do and worry little about everyone else.

;)
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Oldplayer would be about right about 3-5 years ago, but the top jumping pros now are very careful when and when not to jump instead of kick. Johnnyt
 
While in the standing (thinking) position, I look at both options very carefully and try to guess my (not yours) odds of either making the shot, or getting safe IF contact is made. This can depend upon many variables, such as how close the cue ball is to the object ball I must jump over, how close to the pocket the object ball is I must hit, how clustered around balls the object ball is that I must hit, etc.

You can't just find yourself hooked...then immediately go for your jump cue, or make a rash decision to kick. I don't usually take a long time in between shots...but making this decision usually takes me longer than most shots do.

It's all about percentages...but there are some days when I am kicking (or jumping) better than usual...and this factors into my decision also.

Maniac
 
oldplayer said:
Years ago I jumped with a playing cue and was successful in making the shot 50%+ of the time but making shape was always questionable. in the past 5 years I have concentrated on kicking more so and while I am not trying to make the ball as much as playing a safety (never ever played safeties back in the 70s or 80s) now the jump cue has come into play.....IMHO with the same results I had. not very good success even from the pros, at least from what I have seen on the streams the last couple of years. it seems the pros, while making the ball 50% of the time, experience the same problem I had, hardly ever making shape on the next shot. in the local pool hall the cb or ob leaves the table 50% of the time. yet, day after day, the local players are pulling out their jump cue to no avail. I personally have found that kicking is a higher percentage of success, whatever that may be, make the shot or play a safety...buying a jump cue is not in my future plans....what have you found to be the case?
Click to expand...

Most times I will kick but if the jump is high percentage (for me) I will jump it
Depends on how well you jump really. I jump when I know I'm going to hit a certain side of the ball and what's suppose to happen after that. It's more of a matter of knowing what and what not to jump at. If I jump a lot better than my op then I will push to a jump I like. If jump cues are allowed and you haven't taken time to jump as good as you play then your at a disadvantage. This much I do know
 
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Depends on the shot. Jumping has a better success rate if using a jump cue IMO.
 
Who are the top 3 pros that play in tournaments a lot on the stream? Give me the names and I'll watch some recent videos of them and find the % of bad/good jumps. Johnnyt
 
To full cue jump and make the ball, even 50% of the time, seems almost impossible to me.
I'd definitely like to see that. That's impressive by itself, nevermind shape.
Draw shape plays pretty natural but follow is a little trickier to get the feel.

For me, getting a good hit while jumping is 95%, while kicking is... I dunno. Much less.

Shape-wise it all depends on the shot. But I can definitely hit an intended side of the object ball
much more easily with a jump, than with a kick.
The catch is the speed on the jump is harder to control.
 
You have to weigh the percentages of both shots. Also you have to be proficient enough with both shots to be able to do what you want to do.

Having both shots is an advantage.
 
oldplayer said:
Years ago I jumped with a playing cue and was successful in making the shot 50%+ of the time but making shape was always questionable. in the past 5 years I have concentrated on kicking more so and while I am not trying to make the ball as much as playing a safety (never ever played safeties back in the 70s or 80s) now the jump cue has come into play.....IMHO with the same results I had. not very good success even from the pros, at least from what I have seen on the streams the last couple of years. it seems the pros, while making the ball 50% of the time, experience the same problem I had, hardly ever making shape on the next shot. in the local pool hall the cb or ob leaves the table 50% of the time. yet, day after day, the local players are pulling out their jump cue to no avail. I personally have found that kicking is a higher percentage of success, whatever that may be, make the shot or play a safety...buying a jump cue is not in my future plans....what have you found to be the case?
Click to expand...

Exactly what you observed. Probabilities tell the story. You are more apt to kick than jump. There are cases where you will find it necessary to do one over the other but that is rarity.The time spent learning to jump can be spent learning to kick.
(I hope no-one listens to that last sentence!) :wink:
 
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