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OTLB

OTLB

Banned
Today I passed on a job because the fellow was on Az and wanted his table covered. He mentioned that he had done a few tables and wanted to stay with me while I did his. I determined without doubt the table wasn't level and told him I didn't want the job because I didn't want to show him how I leveled a table.

Was I wrong?
 
i love my table like a family member, so for me its hard to imagine anyone working on her other than myself...

but even if i had to let someone else do it - i cant imagine not wanting to at least watch and discuss with mechanic. because i want to 'know' my table, every inch of it. i want to know how tight every bolt is, i want to know how tight the cloth is, i want to feel the slate seam with my own fingers.

were you wrong? i dont know john, but i'm not sure what the big secret is.
 
I have no problem showing a customer who doesn't work on tables what I do and how I level but when a guy tells me he has done a few tables, that means to me he will do more. I don't want to be copied, especially from a guy on az

Do you think Glen would show a new guy how to use his special tooling

My system is secret. I have demonstrated for one mech only in this forum
 
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When Glen did my table he showed me how he used his tooling, and his leveling system. In fact I was there the whole time, watching, taking pictures, asking questions. I even stapled a rail. It was at that point I knew I had no interest in working on pool tables. I would rather play on them.


OTLB said:
I have no problem showing a customer who doesn't work on tables what I do and how I level but when a guy tells me he has done a few tables, that means to me he will do more. I don't want to be copied, especially from a guy on az

Do you think Glen would show a new guy how to use his special tooling

My system is secret. I have demonstrated for one mech only in this forum
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Tony_in_MD said:
When Glen did my table he showed me how he used his tooling, and his leveling system. In fact I was there the whole time, watching, taking pictures, asking questions. I even stapled a rail. It was at that point I knew I had no interest in working on pool tables. I would rather play on them.
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Yeah exactly. You hadn't worked on tables before. Glen wouldn't have shown you his tooling if he thought you were a guy who had done a few tables and possibly wanting to do more.
 
Mr. Bond said:
i love my table like a family member, so for me its hard to imagine anyone working on her other than myself...

but even if i had to let someone else do it - i cant imagine not wanting to at least watch and discuss with mechanic. because i want to 'know' my table, every inch of it. i want to know how tight every bolt is, i want to know how tight the cloth is, i want to feel the slate seam with my own fingers.

were you wrong? i dont know john, but i'm not sure what the big secret is.
Click to expand...

Point in case: Your finger on the seam means nothing
 
You did the right thing in my opinion. We only do local jobs, and if some local guy wanted to watch us level and set up his table... with full intentions of copying and taking on work... no way in hell.

We've already been through similar situations with previous installers stealing work and setting up tables at a much lower costs...sigh. I guess that's a somewhat different animal though.
 
It's like being a magician. Why would you give away a great trick. Like asking David Copperfield to show you how he does it cuz you paid to see the show. I like my system, it's mine. Nothing to do on a personal level just when I hear that a guy wants to watch I get nervous and it's not because I don't know what I'm doing. As I have said before I can set up a table with nothing in the seams or any shims if it's right to begin with. Why would I want to give that away and since I know the table is not level I can't just slap cloth on it
 
OTLB said:
Yeah exactly. You hadn't worked on tables before. Glen wouldn't have shown you his tooling if he thought you were a guy who had done a few tables and possibly wanting to do more.
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Someone having "done" a few tables before, don't really bother me. It's not like someone is going to watch me one time and learn everything there is to know about working on pool tables. Point in case, Zach. If I'd have worked on Zach's GC1 at his house, knowing he works on pool tables...he'd have never learned in a few days....what he learned in almost 3 months of being with me on the road. Watching someone do something, is not the same thing as being taught by that same person....how to do the work right...until it sinks in and they get it!

Glen
 
I don't disagree with wanting to keep a competitive edge in a defined geographic location. Another danger associated with the scenario is having them "learn" only a little from watching you and then using partial knowledge to jack up a table. If he says he learned from you, now you're unwittingly thrown under the bus with him for the bad job.
 
OTLB said:
You would say dif if you were making a living in one Area. Think About that
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If he's not already a working mechanic, chances are he's worked on some of his friends tables in the past. And, chances are that if his friends let him do the work instead of calling someone else...you'd never have gotten the work in the first place. John, it's all about YOUR reputation that gets you the work, not about him seeing what you did...then going out and being able to take YOUR customers. Most people hope to find someone that knows what they're doing, not someone that wants to learn more on THEIR pool table. There's a LOT more to working on pool tables than just leveling the slates buddy...and that takes a long time to learn...with many mistakes along the way....even if you watched a professional do the work....once;)

Glen
 
I understand where your coming from, but as a customer who needs my table done soon, It's my house, and If I wanna watch, I'm going to, or you obviously don't need the work that bad.

At what point of does refusing work in your area come back to bite you in the ass? Something to think about.

I do custom kitchens for a living, and have had customers pull up chairs right behind me while I'm installing their kitchen, It's not the ideal situation, but I've got nothing to hide.

JMO,
Rodney
 
Table work

OTLB said:
Today I passed on a job because the fellow was on Az and wanted his table covered. He mentioned that he had done a few tables and wanted to stay with me while I did his. I determined without doubt the table wasn't level and told him I didn't want the job because I didn't want to show him how I leveled a table.

Was I wrong?
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I don't think you were wrong. As a person who works for yourself, you can turn down a job if you want to. You're not obligated to work on his table anymore than he is obligated to hire you to. I started learning to cover tables 20+ years ago by hiring someone to do the pool room, and picking up everything I could while they worked. The hard part is hiring the right person. It's like a table job and a lesson for one price. Comes with the territory-you can't hardly tell someone to leave the room in their own house. You probably should have taken the money, though, as this won't slow him down. If he's on AZ, he'll just read Glen's sticky to level his slates:)
 
i do understand the concept of 'trade secrets' , etc...
but i guess i dont understand flat out turning someone down.
(if thats what you did.)

did you at least attempt to explain your position?
" I'm sorry sir but my leveling process is proprietary, so I would prefer to do it alone.... but you are certainly free to inspect my work in a few minutes when I'm done "

or - perhaps even have the customer sign a non-disclosure agreement.

whatever the case - some people are going to watch you just for the sake of security alone. i typically dont leave strangers in my house unattended either.

dont you want to make the customer as comfortable with your presence as possible?
 
Mr. Bond said:
i do understand the concept of 'trade secrets' , etc...
but i guess i dont understand flat out turning someone down.
(if thats what you did.)

did you at least attempt to explain your position?
" I'm sorry sir but my leveling process is proprietary, so I would prefer to do it alone.... but you are certainly free to inspect my work in a few minutes when I'm done "

or - perhaps even have the customer sign a non-disclosure agreement.

whatever the case - some people are going to watch you just for the sake of security alone. i typically dont leave strangers in my house unattended either.

dont you want to make the customer as comfortable with your presence as possible?
Click to expand...

I answered this in another thread sorry I made a mistake. I'm not perfect
 
OTLB said:
Today I passed on a job because the fellow was on Az and wanted his table covered. He mentioned that he had done a few tables and wanted to stay with me while I did his. I determined without doubt the table wasn't level and told him I didn't want the job because I didn't want to show him how I leveled a table.

Was I wrong?
Click to expand...

Not wrong just paranoid. The Egyption pyramids were as level as any modern pool table. I seriously doubt you have invented anything new.
 
Ok that's it. You guys have fun. I know who my friends are now.

The last guy I showed how I level a table changed to my way after 40 years in the business

He thought it was dif.

My credentials, Millions of dollars from my inventions got me these Titles. Im going back to the professional world. Its less stressful

yeah its sideways
2yl3b4m.jpg
 
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