too much focus on inlays

Hmmmmm

Blue Hog ridr said:
Sneaky Petes built by both Dennis and Leon Sly.
Which one do you think will sell for more? The one with the S on it or the one with the SL? I have 2 of SL's fancy sneakys. I don't know if its possible to build a sneaky that shoots better than an SL. One will sell for $350 and one will sell for $700.

Lots of cue makers build $500 cues. Some will sell them for exactly that and some will sell them for 4 times that. Same quality materials and constructed pretty much the same. Same quality piece of maple for a shaft, same taper. Is the more expensive cue magic, the the other not? What about your game, can you run a rack with a $2000 cue and not a $500 cue?

I just traded a Joss for a Varney conversion. It was light so I drilled and taped for weight bolts. Its balanced and weighted perfect for me and the butt size is perfect for my hand. I'd say that even tho the shaft has a couple of sugar marks on it, that 90% of that cue is the ferrule and taper. With the exception of my Sly sneakys, I don't own a cue that can out shoot that one.

Total cost of the Varney, way under 100 beans. I can see spending 5 to 1200 on a cue of your choice. Over that is totally unnecessary.
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HOG, we have to stop meeting like this...people are going to start talking!!
Ya gotta buy what you like. If we all liked sneaky petes, there would not be much need for the top cuemakers. After about $1K it becomes more of a collectible and/or piece of art that you can play with !!

Hog, how much you spend on your bike?? just asking....see ya
 
I have others, not just sneakys. I used that as an example.
Some people buy the name, others buy the motorcycle.
Even if an after market part says HD on it, its still expensive.

I didn't buy the name. I tried to earn my spot. Paid the price on several occasions.
It hurts when mother nature and gravity kick in and you hit the floor.
MeRide.jpg


I didn't say that spending what ever you like on a cue is unwarranted, I meant, in my opinion, unnecessary.
And it was just my opinion. If I had a lot of disposable cash, I'm not sure what I'd do. Pretty sure I'd still limit what I would spend on a cue tho. If I can't shoot with a $500 cue, then I don't believe I deserve a $2000 cue. I like pretty cues as much as the next guy.
 
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Tommie1351 has Two Jack Madden's listed right now. Both are Plane Janes, and both I am sure will play as well as any Cue Jack, a Formor World Class Player built. Jack knows how to build a Cue that will preform, be it Plane Jane, or Fancy Point Butterfly. JMHO.
 
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Blue Hog ridr said:
I have others, not just sneakys. I used that as an example.
Some people buy the name, others buy the motorcycle.
Even if an after market part says HD on it, its still expensive.

I didn't buy the name. I tried to earn my spot. Paid the price on several occasions.
It hurts when mother nature and gravity kick in and you hit the floor.
MeRide.jpg
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I like you point about MotoCycles, you only need vist the Harley Dealer on Saturday of their HOG Meeting to see the FAUX Bikes, the one who do go to Sturgus, and Trailer their Bikes all the way to Sturgus. LOL

I didn't say that spending what ever you like on a cue is unwarranted, I meant, in my opinion, unnecessary.
And it was just my opinion. If I had a lot of disposable cash, I'm not sure what I'd do. Pretty sure I'd still limit what I would spend on a cue tho. If I can't shoot with a $500 cue, then I don't believe I deserve a $2000 cue. I like pretty cues as much as the next guy.
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All you need to shoot with a 2K cue is 2K. LOL.
 
some of what is important -IMO

Shafts:
- the maple is harvested in winter so there isn't a lot os sap in the wood
- it is naturally dried or dried slowly in a low heat ( don't cook the wood)
- it is turned down over a period of at least 3 months( preferably more) with at least 6 cuts
- if the wood moves at any time in the process then it is scrapped.
-the threads in the joint must be durable, hold up for a long time, not be abrasive-no burrs
-collars- threaded for stability

Butts:
- No 5 min epoxy - ever! - ( it doesn't soak in) it does not have the quality joining that 24hr epoxy has--I want my cues to last!
-to minimize warping- I think the cues should have a rock maple core
- for quality the core should be one piece
-the whole cue should be built around the center axis- it has to be straight
-no glue air bubbles in the forearm or butt sleeve
-all the points are structural points, cut in deep
-weight distribution needs to be increasing slowly progressive towards the butt
-No large concentrations of weight anywhere in the cue- the cue needs to feel balanced
-nice tight fitting joint with maximized contact area between the shaft and the butt
-pin- polished, cannot be abrasive at all- I want the joint to last a lifetime

Overall
-durable, crisp, bright finish on the cue
-wrap- nice clean uniform surface
-tight tolerances on everything!- dont want sloppy work
-All the points MUST line up even- both at the top and the bottom
-the wood used should be high quality and dried properly- this is not hard to do
-the tip should be chosen to match the players style and stroke
 
breakshot said:
Shafts:
- the maple is harvested in winter so there isn't a lot os sap in the wood
- it is naturally dried or dried slowly in a low heat ( don't cook the wood)
- it is turned down over a period of at least 3 months( preferably more) with at least 6 cuts
- if the wood moves at any time in the process then it is scrapped.
-the threads in the joint must be durable, hold up for a long time, not be abrasive-no burrs
-collars- threaded for stability

Butts:
- No 5 min epoxy - ever! - ( it doesn't soak in) it does not have the quality joining that 24hr epoxy has--I want my cues to last!
-to minimize warping- I think the cues should have a rock maple core
- for quality the core should be one piece
-the whole cue should be built around the center axis- it has to be straight
-no glue air bubbles in the forearm or butt sleeve
-all the points are structural points, cut in deep
-weight distribution needs to be increasing slowly progressive towards the butt
-No large concentrations of weight anywhere in the cue- the cue needs to feel balanced
-nice tight fitting joint with maximized contact area between the shaft and the butt
-pin- polished, cannot be abrasive at all- I want the joint to last a lifetime

Overall
-durable, crisp, bright finish on the cue
-wrap- nice clean uniform surface
-tight tolerances on everything!- dont want sloppy work
-All the points MUST line up even- both at the top and the bottom
-the wood used should be high quality and dried properly- this is not hard to do
-the tip should be chosen to match the players style and stroke
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what would you consider a fair price for this?

bill
 
Interesting thread: especially considering the general rules-of-thumb of how much performance came from where. To Whit:

75-80% of the hit of a cue comes from the tip ($0.50-$30)
15-20% of the hit comes from the shaft ($20-$250)
leaving 0-10% to come from the butt+joint+nuances ($60-$60,000)

Kind of a backwards way about getting performance.
 
Well, I've been playing and loving this game for 50 years. Here is what I've learned about how a cue plays.

Its totally subjective player by player, based on the following

Wood quality -(which by the way doesn't require a custom high end cue)

Weight -

Balance point -

Shaft diameter -

Shaft taper -

and last but certainly not least - that 2 dollar Tip on the end. I say 2 dollar because those 20 dollar tips are another crock of crap.

As far as custom cues and inlays and all that, well that's just eye candy.

In all the years playing, unfortunately for me, spending money on a custom cue still falls somewhere on page 200 of my money spending priority list.

Luckily, my old piece of junk still allows this weekend warrior to run 40's 50's and 60's with my limited time on the table.

One of the best playing cues I've EVER used is the one in an old poolroom I used to visit back in the 60's. It was hanging on the wall with about 100 other cues. I burned the wood with a lighter to find it whenever I came in to play. I finally bought it from the owner when I got a home table for a ton of money. 5 bucks. :)
 
MitchAlsup said:
Interesting thread: especially considering the general rules-of-thumb of how much performance came from where. To Whit:

75-80% of the hit of a cue comes from the tip ($0.50-$30)
15-20% of the hit comes from the shaft ($20-$250)
leaving 0-10% to come from the butt+joint+nuances ($60-$60,000)

Kind of a backwards way about getting performance.
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Interesting concept and overall, I tend to agree with you.
But I think that the pool cue should be balanced in its entirety.

Case in point: If you have a avg weight cue with a great tip (that matches your style of play) but the weight is concentrated in the butt of the cue and the shaft is whippy --then you would have a very hard time pocketing balls consistently with this cue.

In addition, the cue should be built to last a long time and the tip is something that is changed as it wears out or it's playing characteristics change.

as pool players we strive to increase our awareness of our play in order to play better, so our equipment should be balanced
 
MitchAlsup said:
Interesting thread: especially considering the general rules-of-thumb of how much performance came from where. To Whit:

75-80% of the hit of a cue comes from the tip ($0.50-$30)
15-20% of the hit comes from the shaft ($20-$250)
leaving 0-10% to come from the butt+joint+nuances ($60-$60,000)

Kind of a backwards way about getting performance.
Click to expand...

Thats what I'm talking about! I just misplaced my percentage chart. :thumbup:
 
I agree

I have focused on less is more of late as well. My Searing and Farris. Both play great.
 

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i think this is just a by product of how people conduct business here. when someone says the cue hits like a dream/a monster cue/ hits like a ton, people just ignore it as hype. so the only thing u can really go on regarding cues on this forum is how it looks. obviously certain cuemakers are famous for making great hitting cues but at the end of the day the cue is made out of wood and as many people have pointed out, it doesnt matter who makes it, woods do their own thing and there will be a dud or two.

since all we get are pics on this forum (obviously u cant play with the cue) people tend to comment more on how a cue looks which leads to the impression that all they care about is how it looks and not how it plays. i've been accused of this sometimes but how am i supposed to judge how a cue plays by looking at a picture of it. if u show me pics, i will comment on how it looks. if u let me use it, i will comment on how it plays.

when someone shows me a pic and asks me how i think it'll play i have absolutely no answer for that. all i can say is whether i think it looks nice or not.

i bring this up cuz when u go to large pool gatherings like SBE, most of the people there dont give a crap about inlays or how a cue looks.
 
I spoke to a well known custom cue maker here in Colorado and he told me if he builds a basic cue he can't sell it. But if he loads it up with eye candy and gets twice or three times the money it sells quick. That is where the market is now in his opinion.
 
measureman said:
I spoke to a well known custom cue maker here in Colorado and he told me if he builds a basic cue he can't sell it. But if he loads it up with eye candy and gets twice or three times the money it sells quick. That is where the market is now in his opinion.
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I have the exact opposite opinion. With this tough economy I truly feel that real players (not collector types) care less about fancy eye candy & would rather have a cue thats simple with beautiful wood that is a performance monster. They would rather pay for performance & have a cue thats affordable $400-500-600-700 instead of a cue "loaded with eye candy at two or three times the money". Just the way I see the market....I've been wrong before. :smile:
 
MitchAlsup said:
Interesting thread: especially considering the general rules-of-thumb of how much performance came from where. To Whit:

75-80% of the hit of a cue comes from the tip ($0.50-$30)
15-20% of the hit comes from the shaft ($20-$250)
leaving 0-10% to come from the butt+joint+nuances ($60-$60,000)

Kind of a backwards way about getting performance.
Click to expand...

Interesting bit of information, a GREENIE 2 U.
 
based on this logic I will go out and buy a nice set of Pirellis cause it only counts "where the rubber hits the road" and I'll hold off on getting the Ferrari (not that I could)
 
breakshot said:
A lot of players and collectors just focus on inlays and how many there are.
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They suck. I'll take all your inlaid cues off your hands. Of course, I can only offer pennies on the dollar and frozen 25lb. turkey. I'll bring the turkey when I come by and pickup those cues. You'll take a check right?

bryan
 
One piece or two?

It would seem a single piece would have a better hit. Why don't more players use single piece cues? At least locally or in their regular room.
Traveling with a long cue can be done but what a drag.

Years ago at Julian's in NYC a kid comes back to where we're playing cards
and asks if he should play this old guy that uses a broomstick?
Without a pause one of the old boys asks, "does he chalk it?"
The kid says yes, the old boy says, "No"

MtB:groucho:
 
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