Top Money Players

[mapman72]

Forget about the tournament scene, I'm curious to know who the best money players are running around the country. I know we could name hundreds, but just start with your state. I am really just trying to figure out which pros play best for the cheese, and not trying to cut anyone's action. So I'm not asking anyone to expose one of their hidden treasures I recently heard a story about Bustamante and Santos playing some people in my area that don't play too bad, and giving up absolutely huge spots and still winning. I guess I'd like to hear some more stories like that.

 

[JAM]

Action has all but dried up in the year 2005, if you were to compare it to 20 years ago.

With the advent of cell phones and the Internet, very few road agents can fly under the radar screen.

These days, there is no more "surprise" when it comes to upcoming gambling players or seasoned veterans. So, in essence, the art of HANDICAPPING is key when it comes to ACTION. If you can't match up properly, you are a dead duck.

In D.C., which unfortunately is not a STATE, I think you know who my pick would be.

BTW, if you do a SEARCH function on this forum, you will be pleased to know there are MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY threads and posts about "top money players."

JAM

 

[Black-Balled]

I've only seen him a few times, but that young'n from TX, Sylver Ochoa is a badass.

How does our SDKid rate?

 

[JAM]

I've only seen him a few times, but that young'n from TX, Sylver Ochoa is a badass.

How does our SDKid rate?

Who is "SDKid," Black-Balled?

BTW, I heard it through the grapevine that James Waldon was heading to Mexico several days ago to play Rafael Martinez.

I've seen great players who do just fine on the tournament trail, but get them in the pit playing for big bucks, and they fold like a lawn chair. Some players, though, can play BETTER for the money than they do in a race-to-9 tournament setting.

I think Scott "The Freezer" Frost, Marcus "The Little Napolean" Chamat, Tony "T-Rex" Chohan, North Carolinian Tony Watson, Filipinos Santos and Bustamante, Mississippi's Finest Little John, Alex "The Lion" Pagulayan, Seattle's Harry Platis, and Shannon "The Cannon" Daulton have a demonstrated track record as being "top money players." JMHO, FWIW!

Pookie from Virginia used to be a frequent flyer on the action circuit, but he's now MIA.

JAM

 

[mapman72]

Keither

In D.C., which unfortunately is not a STATE, I think you know who my pick would be. JAM

JAM, when's the last time Keith has matched up with anyone? Since I've been coming around, which hasn't been that long, I've never had the pleasure of watching him gamble. That is, except for the ponies when we play in that Cambridge tournament next to the OTB or on the craps table at Turning Stone.

 

[JAM]

JAM, when's the last time Keith has matched up with anyone? Since I've been coming around, which hasn't been that long, I've never had the pleasure of watching him gamble. That is, except for the ponies when we play in that Cambridge tournament next to the OTB or on the craps table at Turning Stone.

Unfortunately, Mapman72, there ain't too much action in the metropolitan D.C. area. It's dry county when it comes to action. Either people want a huge spot hoping to ROB or they want to play for peanuts.

Last time Keith matched up here locally was at USA Billiards in Laurel when Seth was around. Quite a few funny match-ups between Seth versus Genie Man and Earthquake, too! Seth returned to Iowa last time I heard. Maybe one of the best match-ups with Keith in recent times has been between Jerry Slivka and him, a few times at First Break in Sterling and twice at Champions in Laurel.

I think when Keith first came to the D.C. area, he played every single action player who was willing to step up to the plate: White Max, Sterling, Cutty, Pookie, Tony Long, Freddie Boggs, and Bobby Hawk.

In order to get in action, Mapman72, there needs to be at least two participants. In D.C., the action is dwindling, dwindling, dwindling. The only GOOD action Keith gets is when we are on the road.

I think the first time we met you was in Silver Spring Champions, before it closed, less than a year ago. Nice to see some new faces in the D.C. area who are passionate about pool like yourself, and I look forward to watching your game progress in the months ahead.

JAM

 

[Mike Templeton]

Who is "SDKid," Black-Balled?

BTW, I heard it through the grapevine that James Waldon was heading to Mexico several days ago to play Rafael Martinez.

I've seen great players who do just fine on the tournament trail, but get them in the pit playing for big bucks, and they fold like a lawn chair. Some players, though, can play BETTER for the money than they do in a race-to-9 tournament setting.

I think Scott "The Freezer" Frost, Marcus "The Little Napolean" Chamat, Tony "T-Rex" Chohan, North Carolinian Tony Watson, Filipinos Santos and Bustamante, Mississippi's Finest Little John, Alex "The Lion" Pagulayan, Seattle's Harry Platis, and Shannon "The Cannon" Daulton have a demonstrated track record as being "top money players." JMHO, FWIW!

Pookie from Virginia used to be a frequent flyer on the action circuit, but he's now MIA.

JAM

Jam,

Black-Balled is probably referring to Shane Van de Boening from South Dakota. He spent a little time in Tn and the Carolinas recently, and does play well for the cheese. Especially on the bar box.

And I may have to commission his help in days to come. Shane is deaf, and an excellent player. I have a deaf daughter that I hope to teach the game one day. He may be an excellent coach.

Mike

 

[mapman72]

Tony?

Unfortunately, Mapman72, there ain't too much action in the metropolitan D.C. area. It's dry county when it comes to action. Either people want a huge spot hoping to ROB or they want to play for peanuts.

Last time Keith matched up here locally was at USA Billiards in Laurel when Seth was around. Quite a few funny match-ups between Seth versus Genie Man and Earthquake, too! Seth returned to Iowa last time I heard. Maybe one of the best match-ups with Keith in recent times has been between Jerry Slivka and him, a few times at First Break in Sterling and twice at Champions in Laurel.

I think when Keith first came to the D.C. area, he played every single action player who was willing to step up to the plate: White Max, Sterling, Cutty, Pookie, Tony Long, Freddie Boggs, and Bobby Hawk.

In order to get in action, Mapman72, there needs to be at least two participants. In D.C., the action is dwindling, dwindling, dwindling. The only GOOD action Keith gets is when we are on the road.

I think the first time we met you was in Silver Spring Champions, before it closed, less than a year ago. Nice to see some new faces in the D.C. area who are passionate about pool like yourself, and I look forward to watching your game progress in the months ahead.

JAM

I heard a rumor that Keith played Tony Long up around Baltimore one time in a race to 11 for $1,000. I believe it was on a barbox and Tony broke and ran the first table, then Keith won 11 in a row. Is this just a rumor?

 

[Black-Balled]

Jam,

Black-Balled is probably referring to Shane Van de Boening from South Dakota. He spent a little time in Tn and the Carolinas recently, and does play well for the cheese. Especially on the bar box.

And I may have to commission his help in days to come. Shane is deaf, and an excellent player. I have a deaf daughter that I hope to teach the game one day. He may be an excellent coach.

Mike

That would be SDKid- Van de Boening .

 

[Mr. J]

Rafael Martinez....

Who is "SDKid," Black-Balled?

BTW, I heard it through the grapevine that James Waldon was heading to Mexico several days ago to play Rafael Martinez.

I've seen great players who do just fine on the tournament trail, but get them in the pit playing for big bucks, and they fold like a lawn chair. Some players, though, can play BETTER for the money than they do in a race-to-9 tournament setting.

I think Scott "The Freezer" Frost, Marcus "The Little Napolean" Chamat, Tony "T-Rex" Chohan, North Carolinian Tony Watson, Filipinos Santos and Bustamante, Mississippi's Finest Little John, Alex "The Lion" Pagulayan, Seattle's Harry Platis, and Shannon "The Cannon" Daulton have a demonstrated track record as being "top money players." JMHO, FWIW!

Pookie from Virginia used to be a frequent flyer on the action circuit, but he's now MIA.

JAM

JAM....please let us know if you believe the info on Rafael? He is a friend if mine and a friend to many. We all want to know if he is ok??? Please give any details and comfirmations that you are aware of if you can...

Thanks for this,

Mr. J.

 

[JAM]

I heard a rumor that Keith played Tony Long up around Baltimore one time in a race to 11 for $1,000. I believe it was on a barbox and Tony broke and ran the first table, then Keith won 11 in a row. Is this just a rumor?

I didn't witness that match, but Keith did beat him. I'm not sure about the 11 in a row.

We're going to be in Sterling tonight, Mapman72. You've now got a demonstrated track record on the local scene and are making GREAT strides.

Having defeated Keith yourself on several occasions in the local tournament arena, would you be interested in matching up with him sometime?

There's no time like the present, I say.

JAM [Drumming up a little action in D.C.]

 

[JAM]

JAM....please let us know if you believe the info on Rafael? He is a friend if mine and a friend to many. We all want to know if he is ok??? Please give any details and comfirmations that you are aware of if you can...

Thanks for this

Mr. J, I was just as surprised as you to hear of Wadon traveling to Mexico to play Rafael Martinez. If I hear any further details about Rafael, I'll be sure to post them. In order for Waldon to be willing to travel to Mexico, though, I'd imagine that it's going to be a good match, indeed. Maybe if somebody knows Waldon on this forum, they can call him to confirm if this a "go" AND if Rafael Martinez is doing okay.

BTW, if Rafael is on top of his game, I don't think Waldon has to like it much. JMHO, FWIW!

JAM

 

[masonh]

If Waldon plays I am betting on him.

 

[Snapshot9]

Money player ...

Although many people may not be impressed with
Gabe Owen's tournament play so far, he has been
doing pretty darn well on the road playing money
matches the last few years.

 

[Matt_24]

JAM,

I don't get out like I used to but have "heard" that Bobby Hawk is considered the best MD/DC area one pocket player these days. Now..I'm not going to go into anything about his character, but is he not willing to play Keith some even one hole?

Like you said...most players just want to S..T..E..A..L. Few have any REAL heart. Who do you or Keith think would win in a one pocket game between Pooky and Bobby Hawk. I've seen Bobby and Pooky play on numerous occasions. Bobby played just good enough to win giving a weak spot. Pooky gave the same opponent a MONSTER spot and played jam up to win..so I personally would have to give it to Pooky..but then again, I haven't seen Bobby's REAL game. That is a match I'd like to see.

Has Keith ever played Bus Driver Ronnie? That is a great player. Perhaps in need of a heart transplant but a great player. He ran 100+ balls on me in straight pool, and can string racks in 9 ball with the best of them (as well as being a monster one hole player). If I played like him I would have no choice but to be in steady action. I don't really hear about him matching up anymore, although I know he's older and retired. That could play a part.

Any thoughts?

 

[mapman72]

Staking for the Ether?

I didn't witness that match, but Keith did beat him. I'm not sure about the 11 in a row.

We're going to be in Sterling tonight, Mapman72. You've now got a demonstrated track record on the local scene and are making GREAT strides.

Having defeated Keith yourself on several occasions in the local tournament arena, would you be interested in matching up with him sometime?

There's no time like the present, I say.

JAM [Drumming up a little action in D.C.]

JAM, you know that I do like to gamble and I will match up, even under difficult circumstances (e.g., playing Brandon even on his home table). However, I like Keith and you. The couple times that I have beaten Keith in tournaments, he has gotten very angry with me. I understand that he's a competitor and he has an incredibly strong drive to win, but I am reluctant to gamble with him because I don't want to feel his full wrath if I would happen to win and we would have a dispute (e.g., racks, fouls, etc.). I hope that makes sense and I hope you're not offended.

I just feel like I have so much to gain by staying in Keith's good graces right now because I have already learned a ton from him. One thing I will say is that after beating him then seeing him at the next tournament, he has never held a grudge or been upset about the conflict from before.

I guess what I am trying to say is that at this point, there are certain people that I am eager to gamble with (e.g., Brandon, Mike, Shawn T., Ilir, etc.) and certain people that I am not (e.g., Keith, Ryan, Pookie, etc.) and it has less to do with skill level and more to do with not wanting confrontations that may damage our friendships. Things may be different in the future, however, when it is certain that no matter what will happen on the table, there will be mutual respect and sportsmanship after the match is long over. I hope that makes sense.

All that aside, I am interested in playing Keith some cheap one pocket. I need the lessons.

 

[JAM]

JAM,

I don't get out like I used to but have "heard" that Bobby Hawk is considered the best MD/DC area one pocket player these days. Now..I'm not going to go into anything about his character, but is he not willing to play Keith some even one hole?

I really like Bobby Hawk, known him since he was a youngster. He's always had a lot of heart and is very passionate about pool. I think Bobby Hawk would "ask" for a spot from Keith in one-pocket, but whether Keith would give it to him is another question. The two of them are friends these days and try to stay on the same side of the table.

Like you said...most players just want to S..T..E..A..L. Few have any REAL heart. Who do you or Keith think would win in a one pocket game between Pooky and Bobby Hawk. I've seen Bobby and Pooky play on numerous occasions. Bobby played just good enough to win giving a weak spot. Pooky gave the same opponent a MONSTER spot and played jam up to win..so I personally would have to give it to Pooky..but then again, I haven't seen Bobby's REAL game. That is a match I'd like to see.

In one-hole, I definitely like Bobby Hawk against Pookie [sorry, Pookster! ]

In 9-ball, I'd have to go with Pookie over Bobby Hawk.

One thing about both gentlemen, they have a lot of heart and show no fear whenever an opportunity avails itself to them.

Has Keith ever played Bus Driver Ronnie? That is a great player. Perhaps in need of a heart transplant but a great player. He ran 100+ balls on me in straight pool, and can string racks in 9 ball with the best of them (as well as being a monster one hole player). If I played like him I would have no choice but to be in steady action. I don't really hear about him matching up anymore, although I know he's older and retired. That could play a part. Any thoughts?

Bus Driver Ronnie is a gem. Twenty-plus years ago, there weren't too many players wanting to get in action with him because his one-pocket game was just that strong. Strawberry is another one-pocket phenom in the area.

Both of them are older now and have responsibilities, i.e., family, work, kids, grandkids, et cetera. I heard that Bus Driver Ronnie gives lessons on occasion.

There's a new pool room on Route 214 off of the Beltway (I-495), and its name escapes me at present. If you get off Route 214 off the Beltway going towards D.C., the pool room is on the left-hand side, about 2-1/2 miles down.

Every Wednesday, they have been holding one-pocket exhibitions with Bus Driver Ronnie, Strawberry, Bobby Hawk, "Jackie Robinson," Danny Green, Jerry Slivka, and quite a few other local greats. If I can find out more info about it, I'll post it up.

BTW, there is now a local one-pocket tournament at First Break in Sterling every Sunday, beginning at 12:00 noon, $30 entry fee, double elimination.

BEST one-pocket player ever in my neck of the woods? Michael "Geese" Gerace, may he rest in peace!

JAM

 

[JAM]

JAM, you know that I do like to gamble and I will match up, even under difficult circumstances (e.g., playing Brandon even on his home table). However, I like Keith and you. The couple times that I have beaten Keith in tournaments, he has gotten very angry with me. I understand that he's a competitor and he has an incredibly strong drive to win, but I am reluctant to gamble with him because I don't want to feel his full wrath if I would happen to win and we would have a dispute (e.g., racks, fouls, etc.). I hope that makes sense and I hope you're not offended.

I just feel like I have so much to gain by staying in Keith's good graces right now because I have already learned a ton from him. One thing I will say is that after beating him then seeing him at the next tournament, he has never held a grudge or been upset about the conflict from before.

I guess what I am trying to say is that at this point, there are certain people that I am eager to gamble with (e.g., Brandon, Mike, Shawn T., Ilir, etc.) and certain people that I am not (e.g., Keith, Ryan, Pookie, etc.) and it has less to do with skill level and more to do with not wanting confrontations that may damage our friendships. Things may be different in the future, however, when it is certain that no matter what will happen on the table, there will be mutual respect and sportsmanship after the match is long over. I hope that makes sense.

All that aside, I am interested in playing Keith some cheap one pocket. I need the lessons.

It's kind of funny reading this post, Mapman72. Keith actually spoke the same words about you. He has a difficult time when players rack their own balls and the wing ball keeps flying in the same pocket. When it happens 5 times in a row -- as it did in Laurel several days ago -- he will speak up.
Actually, he told me Wednesday night that he DELIBERATELY did not win on the hill-hill at Champions because he did not want to lose a friendship, FWIW, which is why the 5 ball did not go in the hole. After you vented your anger at him because he questioned you racking the balls ahead of the spot, he decided the win just was not worth it. If you ask him about it next time you see him, he may be able to explain it better than I on a forum.

JAM

 

[9Ball_JJ]

I've only seen him a few times, but that young'n from TX, Sylver Ochoa is a badass.

Sylver is a badass!! He's young, so I can just imagine how he's going to play in years to come.

 

[rhncue]

It's kind of funny reading this post, Mapman72. Keith actually spoke the same words about you. He has a difficult time when players rack their own balls and the wing ball keeps flying in the same pocket. When it happens 5 times in a row -- as it did in Laurel several days ago -- he will speak up.
Actually, he told me Wednesday night that he DELIBERATELY did not win on the hill-hill at Champions because he did not want to lose a friendship, FWIW, which is why the 5 ball did not go in the hole. After you vented your anger at him because he questioned you racking the balls ahead of the spot, he decided the win just was not worth it. If you ask him about it next time you see him, he may be able to explain it better than I on a forum.

JAM

I see no reason that a man can't rack his own balls. They still have to be racked on the spot and as tight as possible as the rules state. If the balls are not correctly racked then the non-breaker needs to speak up and have the rack corrected. This elliminates the breakers argument over bad racks and at the same time affords the non-breaker a means of contesting the rack before the break. If the non-breaker still feels he is being cheated by the racker manipulating the rack then he needs to learn to read a rack better.
Dick