Tough Opponent

C

Cameron Smith

is kind of hungry...
Silver Member
I have been playing this guy for over a month now, and he is by far one of the toughest opponents I have ever faced.

Now let me explain what I mean by tough. He doesn't run out much at all. He is by far the most unbalanced player I have ever met. He is a very good shot maker but has poor positional skills. So when he misses I get his crappy position which is usually no where near anything workable. And trust me, he isn't playing safe a pretending not to. Furthermore his lack of position play typically rearranges the layout of the table by the time he is done, leaving a crap load of clusters.

He has a crappy break which leaves massive clusters near the rack area.

Now there is another part that I am having a difficult time with. He has horrible sharking habits. I don't think they are intentional but nonetheless it definitely has an effect on my game. He hums out of tune when I shoot. He leaves the chalk on the table upside down. When playing one pocket he counts the number of balls I have in my pocket during my run, right before I shoot. He tells me I am running out, when I am running out. He starts taking balls out of pockets when I am shooting the game ball. And he plays devastatingly slow.

Now he is a decent player, despite his poor positional skills if I leave him an open table, if he doesn't get out he will leave me in an untenable position.

He plays very cagey 14.1. He isn't interested in high runs, he just wants to pick up the strays and play safe. This counters my style very well and oftens leaves me frusterated as I don't have much to shoot at. That said he has only won 2 straight pool games. But even when I win I am left very frusterated.

We usually play 8 ball, 14.1 and One Pocket. Primarily 8 ball though. He has done well to counter my style with cagey play and sharking, lol. In 8 ball I have been trying to make hall of fame run outs from his crappy breaks, which sometimes pans out but not often enough. But I have found trying to playing my usual game leaves me disgruntled and frusterated at the end of it.

So I think the solution is to play cagey myself. Forget about massive runs in straight pool, and just keep him locked up, unless I get a good open table to work with. In 8 ball I should realize his weaknesses and play to them and play a more defensive game.

I think it's time to change my strategies as, even though I am usually coming out ahead, I am just not dominating as much as I should be. When an A player comes up against a B player, it should be a no contest.

Sorry for the long post, I am just ponder out loud so to speak.
 
Cameron Smith said:
He hums out of tune when I shoot.
Click to expand...

Have him start with something simple like Three Blind Mice and then work up to the more advanced songs.
 
Your opponent sounds like some of the people I know! :(

Don't change your game to match theirs. If you're playing 8-ball, it may take another inning or two or three to win the game. If it's straight pool, be more patient for the opportunity to take control of the table. Ditto for 1-pocket.
 
Cameron Smith said:
I have been playing this guy for over a month now, and he is by far one of the toughest opponents I have ever faced.

Now let me explain what I mean by tough. He doesn't run out much at all. He is by far the most unbalanced player I have ever met. He is a very good shot maker but has poor positional skills. So when he misses I get his crappy position which is usually no where near anything workable. And trust me, he isn't playing safe a pretending not to. Furthermore his lack of position play typically rearranges the layout of the table by the time he is done, leaving a crap load of clusters.

He has a crappy break which leaves massive clusters near the rack area.

Now there is another part that I am having a difficult time with. He has horrible sharking habits. I don't think they are intentional but nonetheless it definitely has an effect on my game. He hums out of tune when I shoot. He leaves the chalk on the table upside down. When playing one pocket he counts the number of balls I have in my pocket during my run, right before I shoot. He tells me I am running out, when I am running out. He starts taking balls out of pockets when I am shooting the game ball. And he plays devastatingly slow.

Now he is a decent player, despite his poor positional skills if I leave him an open table, if he doesn't get out he will leave me in an untenable position.

He plays very cagey 14.1. He isn't interested in high runs, he just wants to pick up the strays and play safe. This counters my style very well and oftens leaves me frusterated as I don't have much to shoot at. That said he has only won 2 straight pool games. But even when I win I am left very frusterated.

We usually play 8 ball, 14.1 and One Pocket. Primarily 8 ball though. He has done well to counter my style with cagey play and sharking, lol. In 8 ball I have been trying to make hall of fame run outs from his crappy breaks, which sometimes pans out but not often enough. But I have found trying to playing my usual game leaves me disgruntled and frusterated at the end of it.

So I think the solution is to play cagey myself. Forget about massive runs in straight pool, and just keep him locked up, unless I get a good open table to work with. In 8 ball I should realize his weaknesses and play to them and play a more defensive game.

I think it's time to change my strategies as, even though I am usually coming out ahead, I am just not dominating as much as I should be. When an A player comes up against a B player, it should be a no contest.

Sorry for the long post, I am just ponder out loud so to speak.
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You are not going to like what I say, but here goes anyway.
Get off your knees and quit crying about rolls and bad breaks and such.
Quit paying attention to this guy. Pay attention to the table and win.
If you are ccounting on him missing and leaving you dead out, then, you should get beat. If you don't allow him to shoot, he won't get good rolls.
Now then, slam your finger in the car door, then march in there and beat this guy.
 
ironman said:
You are not going to like what I say, but here goes anyway.
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That's alright, sometimes what a person needs is a swift kick in the ass to get him goin.

That said, if you ever saw me play you would probably say I need to consider more safeties anyways. If the shot seems as though it could concievably be cut in, I'll go for it. That style has made for some dramatic run outs, but it has also cost me some games and matches.

I appreciate the advice.
 
My suggestion is to insist on spotting the guy in each game to the point that the game is dead even. This will ensure that when you get undisciplined in your play, you will often lose, and nothing will motivate you more than losing to a weaker player.

Some people think that spots are only for when you gamble, but this is not the case. When he lived in NYC, Mika Immonen and I used to practice together on occasion. We never gambled, and yet I always insisted on fouir games on the wire on a race to eleven playing nine ball. Though I am an A player, I need every bit of that spot against a player of that caliber.

Mika really had to bear down to beat me, and the matches were always close, including one session in which we had four straight 11-10 sets. He loved the pressure that spotting me created, and knew he couldn't play frivolously.
 
sjm said:
My suggestion is to insist on spotting the guy in each game to the point that the game is dead even. This will ensure that when you get undisciplined in your play, you will often lose, and nothing will motivate you more than losing to a weaker player.

Some people think that spots are only for when you gamble, but this is not the case. When he lived in NYC, Mika Immonen and I used to practice together on occasion. We never gambled, and yet I always insisted on fouir games on the wire on a race to eleven playing nine ball. Though I am an A player, I need every bit of that spot against a player of that caliber.

Mika really had to bear down to beat me, and the matches were always close, including one session in which we had four straight 11-10 sets. He loved the pressure that spotting me created, and knew he couldn't play frivolously.
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Hmm, that's a good idea. Though I would have to also insist on him letting me warm up 30 min to an 1 hr before we play to get my confidence up to par.
 
Cameron Smith said:
That's alright, sometimes what a person needs is a swift kick in the ass to get him goin.

That said, if you ever saw me play you would probably say I need to consider more safeties anyways. If the shot seems as though it could concievably be cut in, I'll go for it. That style has made for some dramatic run outs, but it has also cost me some games and matches.

I appreciate the advice.
Click to expand...

We all need a swift kick at times.
Now, my real point is, don't concentrate on what you can't control. Focus on how you play the game.
More safeties? Maybe, maybe not. Is the safe shot the right shot to shoot, if so, focus on hitting it as correctly as you possibly can. So much about pool whether it be 8-ball, 9-ball, 1-pocket, or whatever game, is shoot the shot that needs to be shot. Comitt to playing the game the way it is supposed to be played. Once you do, your win % will improve drasticly over a period of time.
Until then, make a deal with yourself. Quit kicking yourself and focus on how the game is supposed to be played. All those sharking techniques and crap like that are just negative distractions which take away from your game.
 
Cameron Smith said:
Hmm, that's a good idea. Though I would have to also insist on him letting me warm up 30 min to an 1 hr before we play to get my confidence up to par.
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I don't believe thats a good idea, it would only increase your frustration. I'm sort of behind the boot in the butt idea. However you might change your attitude also, in that instead of making it a contest, make it a learning session. Never lower yourself to others tactics, intentional or not. Just smile and send them into their pocket for more cash. Use the distractions to enhance your game by leaning to concentrate on the problem at hand, making the ball and putting the cue ball where you want. DON'T ALLOW SOMEONE TO **** WITH YOUR HEAD. Its your fault if its effective, because you are mentally weak. Use it to harden your mental approach to the game. You will find that your game will improve greatly, as will your consistency.

Good Luck. Now get in there and kick his butt... and smile about it.:)
 
Cameron,

One thing you might try is to move a little further away from the table while he's shooting as to not pay so much attention to what is going on. If he's rearranging the balls every time he shoots, there isn't much use in staying close to the table to analyze what you are going to do when you get back to it. Just move away from the table and concentrate on your opportunties and when they come, move back to the table and then see what you got. Can't hurt to try this.

Maniac
 
Thanks for the responses guys. I'll be playing him again on Friday. I'll try a few things, including safes and running every rack :D. I don't want to stop playing him because he is a nice guy, and I do think that I could learn something by playing someone who seems to be able to counter my style.

As far as the sharking goes, I don't retaliate in kind if anyone was wondering. I return to my chair after my inning is finished and am quiet as a mouse. But the sharking only bothers me when I am not warmed up and in stroke. Once I get dialed in, an earthquake wouldn't bother me. Now I just have to figure out how to get dialed in everytime.:D

On a side note I played very well today, running a 92 in snooker. I was just a red and a black away from a century. Oh well:( . What's worse though is that it was recorded on a guys cell phone, but his buddy erased it by accident.
 
While we always need to work on not letting shark moves bother us, I would give this this guy a lesson in pool room etiquete(sp?). I have gone so far as to match up with the understanding that touching the table while I shoot is loss of game. If you really think it is unintentional, you will be doing him a favor by pointing out his sharking moves. If you don't educate him, who will?
 
I used to play a guy 8-ball who would shoot hard and rearrange many of the balls on the table with *every* shot. This was irritating, but it also kept me on my toes.

He would shark, stand in front of the pocket I was shooting at, talk constantly and loud, etc. But this helped me to learn to block these things out.

The good part was he would play and play for hours even if he lost every game.

Playing him helped me to quickly see shots / patterns as I had to re-evaluate the whole table each time he was done shooting.

I had a lot of fun playing him. He was quite a character to say the least.
 
You've given him control of the game. Take it back.

Give him the crappy position. Make your own clusters.

Stand upright looking at him until he stops humming, counting balls, etc. If he asks why the delay, just tell him you're waiting for him to finish and get back in his seat. I've watched a shark grind halfway through a new cube of chalk before it dawned on him that I wasn't going to shoot until he put it down. I knew that he would wait until my third practice stroke to reach out and put the chalk on the rail. The look of sheepish discomfort that slowly grew over his face was delightful. :-)

If he leaves chalk on the rail, upside down or not, pick it up and put it where it belongs - on a side table.
 
My .02 cents

First, I would teach him some playing manners, and tell him exactly what was expected, including no humming, singing, comments made while I was shooting, had to be in a chair while it is my turn, I count my balls, not him, and tell him to put the damn chalk down the right way.

Once he is aware you are not going to put up with his nonsense. upiu are back to the game at hand, and just outsmart him on the table, which is usually called strategy on the table.

If he starts any of the annoying habits, or sharking, just stop, look at him, and tell him to shut up and sit down, and then quietly go about torturing him on the table ... gets to them everytime ... lol
 
Cameron Smith said:
On a side note I played very well today, running a 92 in snooker. I was just a red and a black away from a century. Oh well:( . What's worse though is that it was recorded on a guys cell phone, but his buddy erased it by accident.
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Nice going Cameron, but perhaps you should try to record it on a full size snooker table next time.

Boro Nut
 
Boro Nut said:
Nice going Cameron, but perhaps you should try to record it on a full size snooker table next time.

Boro Nut
Click to expand...

Huh? I always play snooker on a 6x12. If you were confused by recorded, I meant that a guy had a camera phone that could record short movies.
 
I don't agree retaliation will work. If the guy knows he's sharking, he's not going to stop doing it, he'll stop playing you first. If he doesn't know he's doing it, he might be offended to hear about it. This guy resorts to so many tactics and has them down so pat he might not even think about it.

This is like one of those deals where you've let somebody get away with something for so long that now when you try to tell them it bothers you they act all shocked about it. Too late now.

The original poster mentions that he likes this opponent because he's a good guy, but also because he'll continue playing even if he's losing. So, I have determined that since you are able to beat him over a period of time even while he's sharking you - from that I have determined that you are better than he is and should be spotting him. Perhaps letting him shark you is the spot to which both of you have uspokenly agreed.

Tommy Joe
 
Cameron,
I suggest you don't play with guys below your abilities a lot...especially if you are trying to use the sessions to improve. It can drag your game down. Especially if that player has a lot of annoying quirks or simply doesn't play the game in the way it should be played.

I forget where I read it, but there is a guy with a theory about morphological resonance. This theory suggests that when you are around a person or people whose thinking is on a different level, then this affects your own thinking.

You don't see top golfers out playing the public links with their beer buddies. There is a reason also why researchers prefer libraries to nightclubs to get their work done.

So I suggest you play by yourself in quiet, or play some good polite opponents. Match up occassionally and enter good tournies to test your ability in matches.

Colin
 
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